Anyone else notice that at least here in the US predator seems to be losing its influence? Top US pros are no longer using pred and seem to have switched over to OB, Mezz, Lucasi, and customs. Arguably Mike Dechaine was the most high profile US player signed to Pred but has jumped over to OB. Predator seems to have a strong following in the European market and at least used to have one here in the US. It also seems that Pred has updated their list on their website as to how many pros are using predator technology. That list was most likely skewed to begin with but it does seem that less players are using pred nowadays.
Predator losing influence?
- Thread starter LHP5
- Start date
Mike didn't 'jump' on his own. My understanding is that he was dropped by Predator but that is as much info as I know.
I suspect all it means is that Predator decided to spend less money sponsoring players while OB, Mezz and others decided to spend more. You're talking about guys that could beat 99.99% of the world with a bar stick. All those companies make quality products, using any one of their cues would work just fine with the professionals.
I think Predator is just as big now as ever. It still has the shaft with the least amount of deflection out of any other company.
Just wonder if any professional still uses a Joss Cue?
I never hear anyone talking about Joss anymore.
And me...I still use my old one hundred dollar Meucci.:thumbup:
Bingo!
All except SVB, of course. He uses Cuetech because it's the best, right?
When Predator created the market for LD cues, they had it to themselves along with the fat profit margins that go with dominating a market. It's easy to throw money around on sponsorships when you're making lots of profit.
But it was only a matter of time before other makers entered the market and nibbled away at Predator's profits. So, they had to cut back on the expenses. It happens to every company that creates a market. (look at all the small companies going after Kamui's upscale, laminated tip business. You bet it's hurting Kamui's profits...in fact, we'll probably see less Kamui sponsorships in 2015 and beyond).
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I think Predator is just as big now as ever. It still has the shaft with the least amount of deflection out of any other company.
Just wonder if any professional still uses a Joss Cue?
I never hear anyone talking about Joss anymore.
And me...I still use my old one hundred dollar Meucci.:thumbup:
Predator shafts having the least deflection is highly debatable...
I don't know if it has much bearing on any of this, but there seems to be a movement (albeit somewhat small in the grand picture of things) against MAP pricing, or set pricing guidelines that distributors and dealers are being forced sell products at by some of the companies. Predator was one of the first to do this. Tiger is going to the same sort of pricing guidelines and there are others as well. This directly hurts some of the dealers from setting their own competitive pricing and many are simply beginning to stop stocking some of these brands. It's just not profitable and hurts supply and demand. Why buy from a dealer when the distributor sells it for the same price? It's all business related sales tactics on the part of the companies to keep pricing up, and until they realize how bad it's going to eventually hurt sales, I'm sure most of them that go this route will end up cutting back on sponsors, further hurting the sport moving forward. It's all just part of the current state of pool and billiards that we're all dealing with. I currently carry and use both Predator and Tiger products (there are other companies, not just these two), but have plans to try out some of the up and coming manufacturers product lines moving forward. My next tips and chalk that I try will probably Ultraskins or maybe G2's (haven't researched them much yet though). I had originally intended to try a 314-2 shaft on my new player as well since I like the older 314's so much, but probably will hold off until this MAP thing settles down some. Thinking of trying out an SS360 instead. I hear good things about them.
Your rumor is fact, and nearly 10 years late. Everything has been manufactured in China, except for a few specific cues, for some time now.
actually, more players play with a LD shaft today, than ever before..... they keep increasing in popularity, and league players like them a lot.
Neither one is better, they are just different. And good thing we have the options today to choose.. heck, some cuemakers will let you order their cue with the LD shaft as an option, or they even build their own LD shaft..... not so a few years ago ...
I've loved Predator for years and even when I don't play,I can pick
one up and run out. I love most LD shafts and feel Predator wont fade
but might take a lapse due to people experimenting with other LD shafts.
I went through a period where it really bugged me that my game would
take a massive poop if I didn't play with a Predator.
At first I thought it was just mental but after awhile I knew it was the shaft.
To this day the only shafts I can play with without a drop in my game
is the OB1 and David Jacoby's Hybrid.
I don't know if ant pros play with the Jacoby Hybrid but I cant say
enough about the over-all playability and feel of this shaft.
The funny thing about Predator is sometimes they go way to gimmicky.
The S-tuned Zshaft made me laugh because any competent cuemaker
could lengthen the taper and viola, you have a S-tuned Zshaft.
The original Z-shaft had a longer taper that's why the Z-2 deflected less.
By putting a longer taper you now increase deflection and back at square 1
again.
Predator has to stick to quality over marketing gimmicks or people may
start thinking twice about the hype.
one up and run out. I love most LD shafts and feel Predator wont fade
but might take a lapse due to people experimenting with other LD shafts.
I went through a period where it really bugged me that my game would
take a massive poop if I didn't play with a Predator.
At first I thought it was just mental but after awhile I knew it was the shaft.
To this day the only shafts I can play with without a drop in my game
is the OB1 and David Jacoby's Hybrid.
I don't know if ant pros play with the Jacoby Hybrid but I cant say
enough about the over-all playability and feel of this shaft.
The funny thing about Predator is sometimes they go way to gimmicky.
The S-tuned Zshaft made me laugh because any competent cuemaker
could lengthen the taper and viola, you have a S-tuned Zshaft.
The original Z-shaft had a longer taper that's why the Z-2 deflected less.
By putting a longer taper you now increase deflection and back at square 1
again.
Predator has to stick to quality over marketing gimmicks or people may
start thinking twice about the hype.
Predator is a marketing company. They have never made a cue. Not one. ever. From day one they have farmed out the actual building of the cues and even shafts. I don't think anyone at Predator even puts a tip on honestly. It was farmed out to several US companies in the beginning and has been 100% made in China for the last 10 years or so. Lucasi is exactly the same type of company. Ordering from China is all they do as well.
Ill start by saying I like my Icon. Great tool for me. Losing Influence? Of all the cue makers, they are probably the richest. The Predator Marketing Group had a good business plan and it paid off. I do believe they are definitely overpriced IMO. But the price will be set by what the consumer is willing to fork out. I think they are concentrating on other, lucrative, markets. The US is on the downslide.
I agree with what you said
except for one thing. The P2 cue was the only cue ever that was made
top to bottom in Jacksonville Florida. I spoke years ago to a guy at the plant
and asked him why they stopped. He said it was to time consuming and would
be much more expensive compared to outsourcing. They took great pride in the P2
but money talks I guess.
I think Predator is just as big now as ever. It still has the shaft with the least amount of deflection out of any other company.
Just wonder if any professional still uses a Joss Cue?
I never hear anyone talking about Joss anymore.
And me...I still use my old one hundred dollar Meucci.:thumbup:
My new Joss Cue, the butt warped so bad you couldn't play with it 3 months after I got it. Joss told me there was no warranty. Yes, they examined the cue. I even spoke to Dan Janes about it. "Too bad....so sad..shit out of luck with your $700 Joss."
The pros are going where the money is, based on this, my guess is the other companies are offering more incentives.
I've never used anything but US made cues. I know they are made here becuase I know the cue maker.
I've never used anything but US made cues. I know they are made here becuase I know the cue maker.
Exactly. Even though the pie is bigger than ever before there are more companies wanting a slice. Look for Pred to lose its stranglehold on Europe.
These things fluctuate..
Predator has quite a few big name players: Appleton, Boyes and Soquet to name a few.
They are focusing on supporting their players and promoting their products.
Predator is a strong, you might even say dominating brand name, that status will likely remain regardless of where the cues are made.
Predator still sponses events in Europe, USA and I guess in Asia too?
Some of the traditional American cue companies seem very absent, where is McDermott, Meucci and Joss? I almost never see these brands as sponsors for events or players...
Mezz, Predator, Lucasi, OB cues, Kamui, Diamond and Longoni seems to be the brands I regulary see sponsoring events/players..
Predator has quite a few big name players: Appleton, Boyes and Soquet to name a few.
They are focusing on supporting their players and promoting their products.
Predator is a strong, you might even say dominating brand name, that status will likely remain regardless of where the cues are made.
Predator still sponses events in Europe, USA and I guess in Asia too?
Some of the traditional American cue companies seem very absent, where is McDermott, Meucci and Joss? I almost never see these brands as sponsors for events or players...
Mezz, Predator, Lucasi, OB cues, Kamui, Diamond and Longoni seems to be the brands I regulary see sponsoring events/players..