Rail Rubber and Facing Filling or Fairing Compound?

jviss

jviss

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Question for the experts.

Background: I can see and feel through the cloth on my Gold Crown I that there are imperfections in the interface of facing to rubber/subrail.

I am planning on recovering. Is there a compound, like a rubber material that sets, that can be sanded or ground to a perfect profile when set?

Or, should I lust plan on replacing the facings when I recover?

If I replace the facings, which kind should I use?

I am pretty certain it's original rubber, on a 1962 or so GCI. It's still very lively.

Thanks,

jv
 
rexus31 said:
They have to be cut to the profile of the subrail and cushion after they are applied.
Click to expand...

Cut and sanded. Many people use a makita belt sander to sand them smooth. I use a ridgid orbital with 60 grit, it is less aggressive and works great for me.

Your pocket opening angles will still be wrong.

TFT
 
rexus31 said:
They have to be cut to the profile of the subrail and cushion after they are applied.
Click to expand...

Thanks.

I see Classic Billiards sells facings in 50, 60, and 75 Durometer. Do you know what Durometer the original Gold Crown I used?
 
trentfromtoledo said:
With factory BUCKETS 5" +, the angle aint gonna matter very much.

TFT
Click to expand...

Yea, that's what I want - a "standard" Gold Crown I. This isn't for competition, it's a family enjoyment table. If I tighten up the pockets it's not going to be fun for family and friends anymore.

The TDF for my table is just about 0.95.

I might replace the facings with stiff neoprene facings, per RKC's note on the TDF stickie, because I do see the rattling-out effect he describes.

BTW, I must measured the angles, I have 144º on the corners, 105º on the sides.
 
jviss said:
Yea, that's what I want - a "standard" Gold Crown I. This isn't for competition, it's a family enjoyment table. If I tighten up the pockets it's not going to be fun for family and friends anymore.

The TDF for my table is just about 0.95.

I might replace the facings with stiff neoprene facings, per RKC's note on the TDF stickie, because I do see the rattling-out effect he describes.

BTW, I must measured the angles, I have 144º on the corners, 105º on the sides.
Click to expand...

The "rattling-out" is due to the 144 degree corners. No facing will fix that.
 
rexus31 said:
The "rattling-out" is due to the 144 degree corners. No facing will fix that.
Click to expand...

This seemed to make sense to me:

from realkingcobra in AZB post:

"Facings play a major role in rejecting balls from pockets as do cushions. Take the Olhausen tables for example. The cushions are very, very soft, the facings are 1/8″ and very soft. What happens on an Olhausen table is that when you’re attempting to pocket a ball in the corner pocket coming down the rails, you’re shooting the ball right into the outer have of the pocket facing with no rail wood support behind the cushion. When you do this, what happens is that when the ball being pocketed hits the facing, instead of deflecting to-wards the back of the pocket, it compresses the facing and cushion kind of like creating a flat spot at the end of the cushion, which in turn kicks the ball across the pocket to the opposite facing and back out again, and you don’t even have to shoot the shot hard to get this “rejection” to happen. So, now comes in the role of the facings. If the soft 1/8″ facings are replaced with harder 3/16″ neoprene facings, these facings don’t compress nearly as much when you shoot a ball into them, so the balls that would normally reject … go in because they deflect off the facings deeper into the back of the pocket."
 
jviss said:
This seemed to make sense to me:

from realkingcobra in AZB post:

"Facings play a major role in rejecting balls from pockets as do cushions. Take the Olhausen tables for example. The cushions are very, very soft, the facings are 1/8″ and very soft. What happens on an Olhausen table is that when you’re attempting to pocket a ball in the corner pocket coming down the rails, you’re shooting the ball right into the outer have of the pocket facing with no rail wood support behind the cushion. When you do this, what happens is that when the ball being pocketed hits the facing, instead of deflecting to-wards the back of the pocket, it compresses the facing and cushion kind of like creating a flat spot at the end of the cushion, which in turn kicks the ball across the pocket to the opposite facing and back out again, and you don’t even have to shoot the shot hard to get this “rejection” to happen. So, now comes in the role of the facings. If the soft 1/8″ facings are replaced with harder 3/16″ neoprene facings, these facings don’t compress nearly as much when you shoot a ball into them, so the balls that would normally reject … go in because they deflect off the facings deeper into the back of the pocket."
Click to expand...

Although that may play a role, Olhausen tables are notorious for having wide angle pocket openings that primarily account for the dreaded "Olhausen Rattle". 144 degrees is approaching this territory.
 
rexus31 said:
Although that may play a role, Olhausen tables are notorious for having wide angle pocket openings that primarily account for the dreaded "Olhausen Rattle". 144 degrees is approaching this territory.
Click to expand...

I hear that, thanks. I'm getting ready for a refurbishment of my table, as it was terribly installed, and has some oddness to it. I want it to be extremely consistent, pocket to pocket, and to be as close as possible to an "original spec" Gold Crown I, a fun, family table.

Since this thread I've done some testing. I am pretty sure there's a variety of facings on it. I'm also pretty sure it's all original rail rubber. The bottom right pocket often rejects balls, and the facings feel kinda soft and springy. The top left never rejects or "rattles out" balls, and those facings seem much stiffer. I'll never know 'til I get the cloth off of it. I'm planning on getting a Durometer hardness gauge/tester, so I can keep track of all of this.

What's the recommended method for cutting off the old facings?
 
jviss said:
I hear that, thanks. I'm getting ready for a refurbishment of my table, as it was terribly installed, and has some oddness to it. I want it to be extremely consistent, pocket to pocket, and to be as close as possible to an "original spec" Gold Crown I, a fun, family table.

Since this thread I've done some testing. I am pretty sure there's a variety of facings on it. I'm also pretty sure it's all original rail rubber. The bottom right pocket often rejects balls, and the facings feel kinda soft and springy. The top left never rejects or "rattles out" balls, and those facings seem much stiffer. I'll never know 'til I get the cloth off of it. I'm planning on getting a Durometer hardness gauge/tester, so I can keep track of all of this.

What's the recommended method for cutting off the old facings?
Click to expand...

They will most likely peel right off.
 
rexus31 said:
They will most likely peel right off.
Click to expand...
Thank you for that.

I'm trying to gather up all of the knowledge I need, and parts and materials I need, to do this job. I'm planning on making "gauges" - wooden block templates - for setting the pockets, and putting some wooden blocks on a carpenter's square for squaring-up the corners.

The toughest part is deciding on the cloth color! It's currently gray, with gray aprons, but I'm leaning towards a blue cloth. I confess I really love the gold cloth and blue aprons that you see in the GC I literature. I also like the blue cloth with tangerine aprons. Aprons are easier to change the color of than the cloth. :)
 
jviss said:
Thank you for that.

I'm trying to gather up all of the knowledge I need, and parts and materials I need, to do this job. I'm planning on making "gauges" - wooden block templates - for setting the pockets, and putting some wooden blocks on a carpenter's square for squaring-up the corners.

The toughest part is deciding on the cloth color! It's currently gray, with gray aprons, but I'm leaning towards a blue cloth. I confess I really love the gold cloth and blue aprons that you see in the GC I literature. I also like the blue cloth with tangerine aprons. Aprons are easier to change the color of than the cloth. :)
Click to expand...

Unless you are planning to change the cushions, I wouldn't mess around with trying to adjust the pocket angles. Adding wood will result in the existing cushion being too short.

From experience, I would say changing cloth color is easier. I had a heck of a time getting the proper finish on my aprons.
 
rexus31 said:
Unless you are planning to change the cushions, I wouldn't mess around with trying to adjust the pocket angles. Adding wood will result in the existing cushion being too short.

From experience, I would say changing cloth color is easier. I had a heck of a time getting the proper finish on my aprons.
Click to expand...

Sorry if I miscommunicated, I have no plan to change pocket angles! Just want to preserve the original angles, and get the proper linings.
 
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