"Reyes Thinks Thin, Kills Shot"

[shinobi]

The shot really isn't that tough, Pat. I'm sure if you practiced it enough and got your speed down and so on you could pull it off with ease. Not saying I could, but you probably could.Flex

The cut is easy, but shape is difficult. Have you actually tried this? I, and several other players at a local pool hall, have. It's _tough_.

If you use too much reverse English, the cueball shortens up too much off the first rail. If you don't use enough, it doesn't shorten up enough from the second rail. The angle that the cueball goes off the cut into the first rail is critical. And, different cloths and rails could affect it as well how well it bites, too.

Thus, for Reyes to recognize the exact angle, to put the precise amount of English on for a TV table (not exactly his home table) and to pull it off in one try under those conditions is marvelous.

Billy Incardona and Danny D know their stuff. They raved about it for good reason.

I also like it when Billy raves over the incredible draw shot Corey Deuel pulled off in another match that's been posted on AZ before

Anyway, set up the shot yourself and try it 50 times and see how often you reproduce it.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Me:
He not only made the shot but also hit it with just enough speed and lots of inside english to avoid the 3rd rail and get shape on the 7.

Inside english? Sometimes terms get in the way of understanding what's going on. He shot that cut shot to the right with extreme right english

[...]

I think that kind of english when used in this case is called reverse english, or check english, or simply is called a kill shot.

That's what it's called with respect to its action on the rails. With respect to the OB it's inside english. In other words, it's both.

The shot really isn't that tough, Pat. I'm sure if you practiced it enough and got your speed down and so on you could pull it off with ease. Not saying I could, but you probably could.

I think we both could.

Also, just because I might not pull it off with ease doesn't make it that tough a shot... JMHO.

It's a kind of shot, not just a particular shot. Efren judged the inside/holdup english and speed just right for that particular shot, and probably would have done the same thing even if the cut angle and rail angles were different. That's way different from you and I practicing this one particular shot a bunch of times until we can hit it right. What would we do if the shot that came up during a game was the same general kind but different in its details? Would we know the adjustments necessary?

And I think there are many shots that Efren pulls off with ease that are "tough" for anybody else, let alone you and me.

pj
chgo

 

[Flex]

The cut is easy, but shape is difficult. Have you actually tried this? I, and several other players at a local pool hall, have. It's _tough_.

If you use too much reverse English, the cueball shortens up too much off the first rail. If you don't use enough, it doesn't shorten up enough from the second rail. The angle that the cueball goes off the cut into the first rail is critical. And, different cloths and rails could affect it as well how well it bites, too.

Thus, for Reyes to recognize the exact angle, to put the precise amount of English on for a TV table (not exactly his home table) and to pull it off in one try under those conditions is marvelous.

Billy Incardona and Danny D know their stuff. They raved about it for good reason.

I also like it when Billy raves over the incredible draw shot Corey Deuel pulled off in another match that's been posted on AZ before

Anyway, set up the shot yourself and try it 50 times and see how often you reproduce it.

That's a good suggestion. However, if I manage to pull it off a fairly good percentage of the time, do you really expect me to come back here and let everyone know that? :grin-square:

Flex

 

[Flex]

It's a kind of shot, not just a particular shot. Efren judged the inside/holdup english and speed just right for that particular shot, and probably would have done the same thing even if the cut angle and rail angles were different. That's way different from you and I practicing this one particular shot a bunch of times until we can hit it right. What would we do if the shot that came up during a game was the same general kind but different in its details? Would we know the adjustments necessary?

And I think there are many shots that Efren pulls off with ease that are "tough" for anybody else, let alone you and me.

pj
chgo

Thanks, Pat, for your very thoughtful reply.

I agree with you: the real issue here is not setting up a shot with donuts on the table to be able to reproduce exactly the same shot so it can be repeated until it's easy. The issue is learning how to transform this kind of shot into a reference shot to be shot at will under varying conditions.

That's the only way to really take a shot like this and own it.

Thus, the angles can change, the cloth can change, the balls and humidity and everything else can change, and a really good player will take all that into account and pull the rabbit out of the hat with a shot like the one Effren shot.

IMHO, if someone wants to learn how to do that, they need to really work at it, and not for just one practice session. That kind of shot needs, first, to be made into a relatively high percentage shot in terms of making the ball, and second, practiced and adapted to differing table conditions to produce the desired, or close to desired, shape with the cue ball.

For such a reference shot to be kept fresh in one's mind and available for use, it needs to be practiced not infrequently, IMHO.

Flex

 

[crosseyedjoe]

Inside english? Sometimes terms get in the way of understanding what's going on. He shot that cut shot to the right with extreme right english, which slows down the cue ball in this case when it hits the rails, and straightens out the cue ball once it hits the top short rail. I think that kind of english when used in this case is called reverse english, or check english, or simply is called a kill shot.

The shot really isn't that tough, Pat. I'm sure if you practiced it enough and got your speed down and so on you could pull it off with ease. Not saying I could, but you probably could.

Also, just because I might not pull it off with ease doesn't make it that tough a shot... JMHO.

Flex

POP QUESTION: Can you guess that shot on your own?

 

[Samiel]

I bought this DVD from Accu-Stats after that DCC. Having watched it before, I didn't think a whole lot about. Now that I re-visit the shot, I am even more impressed. The angle is a lot steeper than I originally thought. Efren was on fire those last few rounds. Jason Miller didn't even get a ball!