Rule Questions - 3 Cushion end of game.

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Trying to figure out the rules for the end of 3-cushion game scoring.

player A (who has the opening break) reaching the winning score of 40.

player B - who has, let's say 34 points - gets a turn to try to catch or pass player A.

Questions: Why? What happens if he ties player A, and if he passes player A?

Is there a written rule somewhere? Is this only in world championship play or in every 3 cushion game?
Is it because player A had the opening break and equal innings must be played?

Thanks!!!!!!
 
If breaking player reaches 40 first the second player is reset at the break position and given a single chance to tie

If he reaches 40 also, they reset and have a sudden death shoot out(he cannot surpass player a until the shoot out)
to whoever makes more points in a single inning

Player a has another break shot and goes until he misses
Player b must score more than player a, or he loses



Yes it's always to the non breaking player
I've often wondered how come some do not choose to make the other break, giving yourself an assured second chance


And as far as I can tell its just in world cups and championships, and perhaps some EUROPEAN nationals
 
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thanks for the help!

two points I would like to clear up.

in the extra inning, player A starts with another opening break shot and goes until he misses.
does player B have to shoot from where player A's last shot stopped or does he get his own opening break too?

and, if they are still tied at the end of the extra inning I assume they continue with an additional inning or innings until someone wins?
 
thanks for the help!

two points I would like to clear up.

in the extra inning, player A starts with another opening break shot and goes until he misses.
does player B have to shoot from where player A's last shot stopped or does he get his own opening break too?

and, if they are still tied at the end of the extra inning I assume they continue with an additional inning or innings until someone wins?


Once player a misses player b is reset from the break position as well, and yes I would assume they would continue if they both ended up the same score

But look here, as I do not know 100percent, I don't think ive ever seen that lol

http://www.umb-carom.org/AP/cm/PG145L2/Union-Mondiale-de-Billiard.aspx
 
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Equal innings is always interesting. What is benefit of winning the lag in this case? Shouldn't there be an advantage for winning the lag?
 
I wrote a little something about that in 2014

Equal innings, what's the point?
September 6, 2014 at 8:35am
By Bert van Manen

There was a bright, pool-playing youngster on English Kozoom chat the other day, watching 3-cushion with appreciation. He was critical of the equalizing inning. With typical 20-year old overconfidence, he said: “Completely idiotic system, if you are the first to cross the finish line, you win. Who wants a draw in sports anyway? Why even play the lag, if there is no advantage in winning it?” Let me say it again, it was a smart kid. But his comments proved he was clueless about the psychology of billiards. An equal-innings match is a thing of beauty. If you’ve played a thousand of ‘em, you know.

Forget about sets for a moment, whether best of three or best of five. Of course there is no equalizing inning there, and of course there is an advantage when you win the lag. That’s all pretty obvious. But what about matches to 40 or 50? This is my opening question: if every (every!) top class player in the world elects to start the match, does that not suggest to you, Mr. 20-year old, that you are better off with the white chess pieces than with the black ones, even if they are identical? The key word here, is initiative. You want to score a few points from the break, three at least, and you also want to make sure your opponent starts the match with a much more difficult position than the one you got. If all goes to plan, you can control the game for a while, build up a useful lead in the first 4 or 5 innings, and get the other guy on the back foot. Maybe you will have found your natural rhythm and stroke before he even has 3 points on the board. It’s as if the rules of the game give you a weight and reach advantage in a boxing match, and you should capitalize on it. You want to get the first punch in, and you want it to hurt.

Did you earn that lovely, dominant position you are in? Yes. You won the lag.

So you are – more often than not - in the driving seat early in the game. But if you can’t get rid of the other guy, HE IS, in the latter stages. If you are playing to 40 and it’s 37-37, you are in more danger than he is. Any mistake you make can be your last. If he runs 3, it’s over. If you do, he still has an escape hatch, a back-up plan. You are the one under pressure now, the weight and reach advantage has shifted to your opponent. You have to be ultra careful: only a point made or perfect defense will be good enough. He can be aggressive, go for the shots.

Did he earn that position he is now in? Yes. You had the advantage, but he still got back to 37-37.

And then there is that cruel, exciting phenomenon we call a “shootout”, or “penalties” as it’s incorrectly but commonly called in Europe. High drama, audiences absolutely love it. I’ve played my fair share of shoot-outs in the past 25 years or so, and I can tell you: if that does not get your blood racing, nothing will. It is a wonderful test of will and nerve and character. Billiard players only have a few seconds to adjust to the fact that their heart rate is up to 185 and their cue suddenly weighs more than a Ford Explorer. You get to know yourself in those moments, you learn, you hurt, you grow. And this is the absolute beauty of it: you come out a wiser person, whether you have failed or passed the test. Whatever we do with our formats, let’s never get rid of the shoot-out.

In my opinion, there is nothing wrong with the equalizing inning, if applied to 40 or 50 pt matches. It’s very fair to both players, but still leaves the importance of the lag intact. And by the way, 20-somethings of the billiard world: you are not going to solve every problem our sport has by shortening distances and increasing the luck factor. Three cushion formats, whatever we decide they should be, must always favor the strongest players. Call me a dinosaur, I don’t care. Billiards is one of the noblest of sports, 3-cushion is its King’s discipline. Let’s never turn it into a glorified roll of the dice.
 
I like equal innings. It's a good idea.

I have often thought about something similar in "winner breaks" 9 ball
if someone breaks and runs out a set.
 
Equal innings is always interesting. What is benefit of winning the lag in this case? Shouldn't there be an advantage for winning the lag?

Agreed. Equal innings is beyond stupid. But for a different reason: unfair advantage for the second player as the first player must stop at a specific score (unlike baseball). I am surprised that more lag winners do not choose to play second. Jaspers often does......guess he's the exception in terms of math ability.
 
Equal innings, what's the point?
September 6, 2014 at 8:35am
By Bert van Manen

There was a bright, pool-playing youngster on English Kozoom chat the other day, watching 3-cushion with appreciation. He was critical of the equalizing inning. With typical 20-year old overconfidence, he said: “Completely idiotic system, if you are the first to cross the finish line, you win. Who wants a draw in sports anyway? Why even play the lag, if there is no advantage in winning it?” Let me say it again, it was a smart kid. But his comments proved he was clueless about the psychology of billiards. An equal-innings match is a thing of beauty. If you’ve played a thousand of ‘em, you know.

Forget about sets for a moment, whether best of three or best of five. Of course there is no equalizing inning there, and of course there is an advantage when you win the lag. That’s all pretty obvious. But what about matches to 40 or 50? This is my opening question: if every (every!) top class player in the world elects to start the match, does that not suggest to you, Mr. 20-year old, that you are better off with the white chess pieces than with the black ones, even if they are identical? The key word here, is initiative. You want to score a few points from the break, three at least, and you also want to make sure your opponent starts the match with a much more difficult position than the one you got. If all goes to plan, you can control the game for a while, build up a useful lead in the first 4 or 5 innings, and get the other guy on the back foot. Maybe you will have found your natural rhythm and stroke before he even has 3 points on the board. It’s as if the rules of the game give you a weight and reach advantage in a boxing match, and you should capitalize on it. You want to get the first punch in, and you want it to hurt.

Did you earn that lovely, dominant position you are in? Yes. You won the lag.

So you are – more often than not - in the driving seat early in the game. But if you can’t get rid of the other guy, HE IS, in the latter stages. If you are playing to 40 and it’s 37-37, you are in more danger than he is. Any mistake you make can be your last. If he runs 3, it’s over. If you do, he still has an escape hatch, a back-up plan. You are the one under pressure now, the weight and reach advantage has shifted to your opponent. You have to be ultra careful: only a point made or perfect defense will be good enough. He can be aggressive, go for the shots.

Did he earn that position he is now in? Yes. You had the advantage, but he still got back to 37-37.

And then there is that cruel, exciting phenomenon we call a “shootout”, or “penalties” as it’s incorrectly but commonly called in Europe. High drama, audiences absolutely love it. I’ve played my fair share of shoot-outs in the past 25 years or so, and I can tell you: if that does not get your blood racing, nothing will. It is a wonderful test of will and nerve and character. Billiard players only have a few seconds to adjust to the fact that their heart rate is up to 185 and their cue suddenly weighs more than a Ford Explorer. You get to know yourself in those moments, you learn, you hurt, you grow. And this is the absolute beauty of it: you come out a wiser person, whether you have failed or passed the test. Whatever we do with our formats, let’s never get rid of the shoot-out.

In my opinion, there is nothing wrong with the equalizing inning, if applied to 40 or 50 pt matches. It’s very fair to both players, but still leaves the importance of the lag intact. And by the way, 20-somethings of the billiard world: you are not going to solve every problem our sport has by shortening distances and increasing the luck factor. Three cushion formats, whatever we decide they should be, must always favor the strongest players. Call me a dinosaur, I don’t care. Billiards is one of the noblest of sports, 3-cushion is its King’s discipline. Let’s never turn it into a glorified roll of the dice.


bert well said

and i dont think we will have to worry about that, mr 20 something is a 1 drop in a lake compared to us who have no issue with it

the rest of love the billiard culture,
we will not go the road of jumping on tables, throwing sticks and stomping rails

;)
 
BTW equal innings eliminates an important strategy element of championship level 3-C. In the penalty phase (overtime), no defense is required.
 
Agreed. Equal innings is beyond stupid. But for a different reason: unfair advantage for the second player as the first player must stop at a specific score (unlike baseball). I am surprised that more lag winners do not choose to play second. Jaspers often does......guess he's the exception in terms of math ability.

Agree - equal innings is an amateur concept - you win the lag your option... you go first or require your opponent to go first ( for what ever reason).... winning the lag and getting out there makes for aggressive thinking right from the get go. The idea of equality innings is a spectator ploy for the audience .
 
I'm in the camp of NO equal innings!

When playing the, '15 point' format, the most important shot to practice is the lag!

The Break shot!
 
In the 37 years I've known him, I've NEVER seen Dick Jaspers give away the break shot.

He was doing it in league play but not in tournament play since that format replaced 3/5. Why don't you ask him why? Could be a good subject for one of your columns along with a survey among other top players: whether they favor the equal innings system and why they don't choose to shoot second with its obvious mathematical advantage. I'll bet the top players don't like the system while lesser players do. I'll also bet the reason a top player would choose to break is the psychological disadvantage were an opponent to make a .substantial run off the break. As always, I look forward to your column.
 
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No defense no problem, I'drather see the best shooting Ut out than trying to put someone's cueball in a rail or behind another ball personally


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JerseyChris

Can you walk me through that "obvious mathematical advantage" in a few sentences, because I don't see it. Player A must stop at a specific number, but so must Player B.
 
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