OK there are a couple mistakes I already noticed, but this is about what I meant to say
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZqqakiKbhHI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZqqakiKbhHI
Sense & Nonsense of Draw --my youtube video
- Thread starter mikepage
- Start date
I have to sturdy this more but it's great.. I've been told and it works, if you need exceptional english (draw included) choke up on the cue (grip)
This may eliminate or minimize the elbow drop. It may come after the hit or the elbow is already in the dropped position..
I'm rambling here but want your opinion.
This may eliminate or minimize the elbow drop. It may come after the hit or the elbow is already in the dropped position..
I'm rambling here but want your opinion.
mikepage said:
What he said!
Nice job and thanks for the effort.
mike,
the angle of the cue stick also determines the amount of backspin imparted
on the cb.
It seems that you advocate the wrist snap, which raises the butt end
of the cue and then in the next frame advocate using a level cue.
One thing you may want to add is most of accuracy/ precision can be connected to not having the tip close enough to the cb when the
forearm is perp. to the cue stick or, at the set position.
On the miscue issue, knowing what part of the tip actually contacts
the cb is something that went unmentioned.
Otherwise, well done.
-cOOp
ps. what is your target audience?
the angle of the cue stick also determines the amount of backspin imparted
on the cb.
It seems that you advocate the wrist snap, which raises the butt end
of the cue and then in the next frame advocate using a level cue.
One thing you may want to add is most of accuracy/ precision can be connected to not having the tip close enough to the cb when the
forearm is perp. to the cue stick or, at the set position.
On the miscue issue, knowing what part of the tip actually contacts
the cb is something that went unmentioned.
Otherwise, well done.
-cOOp
ps. what is your target audience?
coopdeville said:
In the first diagram, "b" is the perpendicular distance to the line of the stick. So the stick angle doesn't matter/
I do not advocate a wrist snap.
I don't believe this is true.
OK, thanks.
Anyone who likes thinking about the why questions about this game as opposed to just the how questions.
Good video.
If I understand correctly, those factors like wrist snap can compensate for a stroke error (or a non-pendulum stroke) but are not necessary, right?
You start out by giving the argument that draw only depends on how low you hit it and how fast. It sounds like you are going to argue against this view by adding these other factors, but if that is not your intention it's a bit unclear, at least in the beginning.
If I understand correctly, those factors like wrist snap can compensate for a stroke error (or a non-pendulum stroke) but are not necessary, right?
You start out by giving the argument that draw only depends on how low you hit it and how fast. It sounds like you are going to argue against this view by adding these other factors, but if that is not your intention it's a bit unclear, at least in the beginning.
PKM said:
Yes, wrist snap is one of a number of compensating stroke features that when added to the original stroke flaw can get some success. While some people have taught themselves to do it with good results, it requires good timing and basically an unnecessarily complicated stroke.
OK I see your point. Thanks for the comments
I'm with Mike on this one - why complicate a flaw further? Instead of adding a movement, go to the root of the issue and fix the flaw. KISS. The stroke should already be a simple, uncomplicated movement requiring little effort. Adding a wrist snap doesn't decrease that effort.Flex said:
Mike, I really like your video. I think in the future, any newbies asking about draw should be required to watch this video.
-djb
draw
Mike,
If you're in the set position with the tip 2 inches away from the cue
and your back arm perpendicular...
you're going to hit the cb where you thought you were without
incorporating your shoulder?
-cOOp
Mike,
If you're in the set position with the tip 2 inches away from the cue
and your back arm perpendicular...
you're going to hit the cb where you thought you were without
incorporating your shoulder?
-cOOp
9ballrun said:
I agree too. When I started playing I learned to draw with a wrist snap and it worked....sort of. It creted a very inconsistent and unreliable draw and I miscued frequently.
I wouldn't recomend it to beginners plus it is tough to unlearn.
Ed
Well done.
The shape of the tip increases the limits a little because more surface area of a dime shaped tip comes into contact with the cue ball hit near the limit than a nickel shaped tip. Also a softer tip will increase the surface area that comes into contact.
That all may be outside the scope of your presentation, though.
The shape of the tip increases the limits a little because more surface area of a dime shaped tip comes into contact with the cue ball hit near the limit than a nickel shaped tip. Also a softer tip will increase the surface area that comes into contact.
That all may be outside the scope of your presentation, though.
The Bourbonator said:
My analysis of the soft tip/hard tip issue may surprise you.
Many people believe more contact area means more grab--more frictional force. But that's not the way friction works. (Rubber is a weird material and doesn't follow normal friction behavior).
Friction is generally independent of contact area. So, for example, if your were going to slide a length of a two-by-four across a smooth floor surface, it would stop at the same point whether you slid it with the "two" side down or the "four" side down.
With the "four" side down, there is more surface area, which sounds like more friction. But the weight of the wood is spread out over a bigger area resulting in less weight on each square inch. This twice the surface area but half the weight on each square inch situation makes the frictional drag force independent of surface area.
Likewise, for well chalked soft and hard tips, the grip is the same, even though the soft tip has a bigger contact surface.
How does this relate to miscue territory?
There are a number or relevant subtleties, but the short answer is I would need to be convinced one is really better the the other.
First subtlety - applies to well-chalked tips and assumes contact times very short
Suppose the theoretical miscue limit is 12 mm. If the hard tip makes a 1 mm wide contact, and the soft tip makes a 2 mm wide contact, then to avoid a miscue the center of the hard-tip contact area can go out to 11.5 mm, whereas the center of the soft tip contact circle had better not be past 11 mm. This seems to give the nod to hard tip.
Second subtlety - applies to well-chalked tips and actual contact times
Take the above to be the situation at maximum compression. The soft tip will take longer to decompress, riding further out on the ball. But it also will have started it's compression earlier. So the initial contact point will be even further in for the soft tip. In this sense, the soft tip gives more spin for the same initial contact point. But I don't think that's really an advantage. It may be that soft and hard tips have about the same range of spins but that soft tips complete that whole range in 10 mm of initial offsets while hard tips spread it out over 11 mm of initial offsets. I'd say that again gives the nod to hard tips.
Third subtlety - applies to real world tips with imperfect chalk coverage For many spin shots, it may be that a miscue will occur unless more than some fraction, say 80%, of the contact surface is has chalk. It could be that with small random islands of bare spots a hard tip with its small contact area is more likely to get bitten here. --This one may give the nod to soft tips.
Again, I really don't know which I would recommend. Without other information, I'd be skeptical of anybody who sees a clear advantage of one over the other.
It's true that a Frictional Force is indpendent of surface area if Force (the weight of the 2X4) is a constant, but if you increase the force as you increase the surface area, you do increase frictional force. So, if you put some heat on and hit near the "limit", a soft tip will definitely give you more frictional force than a hard one because the hard one will obviously have a more static surface area. This means the harder you hit, the more frictional force you get with either, but moreso with the soft tip.
I think this also means my tip shape theory is force-dependent too, I guess (dammit).
I think if you hit near the "limit" with a dime shape tip, the surface area will increase more when hit with more force than a nickel shaped tip will. I was going to draw a picture, but my brain just exploded.
All this in a setence: The "limits" increase as the force increases.
I think this also means my tip shape theory is force-dependent too, I guess (dammit).
I think if you hit near the "limit" with a dime shape tip, the surface area will increase more when hit with more force than a nickel shaped tip will. I was going to draw a picture, but my brain just exploded.All this in a setence: The "limits" increase as the force increases.
That last statement is only true to a point, of course...the point where your cueball flies off the table.
The Bourbonator said:
I don't understand what you're saying here.
I would expect the maximum force when a cueball is hit to say a speed of 10 mph with a soft tip is less than that when the cueball is hit with a hard tip. The area under the force-time curve is the same for the two, and if the contact time is longer for the soft tip, the maximum force should be less.
But still, I'm not following you.
Are you saying that a flatter tip will be hitting on its edge at a point where a more rounded one is still hitting on its surface, so the more rounded one can hit more offcenter without miscuing? This seems intuitively true, but I wonder if it's really true, given that the flatter tip's edge compresses creating a larger contact area, and that even a flatter tip doesn't hit on its edge until very near the miscue limit (the great equalizer).The Bourbonator said:
pj
chgo