Shaft Grain Runout

C

Cgra2

Registered
Well here I am just turned 70 and working on my first cue, thought it would be neat playing with one I built myself. I have a "plain jane" butt section out of walnut front and butt with a maple handle and cored with purple heart with my own window rings etc., pretty well finished. I do have quite a bit of background with lathes and have a 14 inch Clausing, small Index mill and wood lathe.. making lots of my tooling as I go.. shaft taper bar to fit on the Clausing, small boring bars, live threading burr driven with a die grinder, etc. and as you probably can guess, learning a lot by trial and error.. Question is about shaft grain runout.. of course I would like the growth rings to be perfectly straight but I guess thats not possible. So what is an accepted run out from one end of the shaft to the other for a "top quality" shaft. I did read on one shaft wood website that the grain run out of their AAAAA shafts was within .33 (5/16+) inches, just how good is this? and where is a source for some top quality shaft wood ??
Cgra
 
Cgra2 said:
Well here I am just turned 70 and working on my first cue, thought it would be neat playing with one I built myself. I have a "plain jane" butt section out of walnut front and butt with a maple handle and cored with purple heart with my own window rings etc., pretty well finished. I do have quite a bit of background with lathes and have a 14 inch Clausing, small Index mill and wood lathe.. making lots of my tooling as I go.. shaft taper bar to fit on the Clausing, small boring bars, live threading burr driven with a die grinder, etc. and as you probably can guess, learning a lot by trial and error.. Question is about shaft grain runout.. of course I would like the growth rings to be perfectly straight but I guess thats not possible. So what is an accepted run out from one end of the shaft to the other for a "top quality" shaft. I did read on one shaft wood website that the grain run out of their AAAAA shafts was within .33 (5/16+) inches, just how good is this? and where is a source for some top quality shaft wood ??
Cgra
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All those toys and you waited this long to build a cue ??

Chris Hightower a regular here cuesmith.com

or prather cue parts

atlas cue parts

schmelke cue sells some nice wood for the price i never could get any deffinitive answer on how seasoned it was so if i buy from there it hangs longer
 
Only had those toys for a about a year, and joined a pool club about a year ago. Was turning a piece of walnut and started thinking it would make a good looking cue :-) At that time I didn't realize how involved and time consuming cue making really was, but after looking at a set of cuemaking DVD's and working on my first one I am beginning to be enlightened. :-) I will check out those sites, Thanks...
Cgra
 
just follow a single grain from end to end and center that grain.this works better when choosing out of board stock.

bill
 
vasilios said:
just follow a single grain from end to end and center that grain.this works better when choosing out of board stock.

bill
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Like Bill said. Having the ability to adjust the centre after a cut or 2 in the right direction to average out the grain is the best option.It can be as simple as just lapping/pushing/grinding the center in the desired direction ready for another cut, or it can be as complicated as you like.
You could have a setup like on a crank grinding machine, where you can index the center, or you can use a 4jaw chuck on a steady to offset the shaft. Lots of ways to achieve the same result.
 
Thanks Guys
That definitely opened a new train of thought. I have only dealt with cones so far and don't have much leeway on them. I will see if I can find a source of something like 6/4 that will give me some working room.. one .750 cone I looked at had the leftmost growth ring (on the large end) coming out on the right side of the cone about 10 inches up from the small end, another about 2 inches up.. (if you can follow that). I just don't think I can use either one... I would like to have zero runout...
 
Cgra2 said:
Well here I am just turned 70 and working on my first cue, thought it would be neat playing with one I built myself. I have a "plain jane" butt section out of walnut front and butt with a maple handle and cored with purple heart with my own window rings etc., pretty well finished. I do have quite a bit of background with lathes and have a 14 inch Clausing, small Index mill and wood lathe.. making lots of my tooling as I go.. shaft taper bar to fit on the Clausing, small boring bars, live threading burr driven with a die grinder, etc. and as you probably can guess, learning a lot by trial and error.. Question is about shaft grain runout.. of course I would like the growth rings to be perfectly straight but I guess thats not possible. So what is an accepted run out from one end of the shaft to the other for a "top quality" shaft. I did read on one shaft wood website that the grain run out of their AAAAA shafts was within .33 (5/16+) inches, just how good is this? and where is a source for some top quality shaft wood ??
Cgra
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Welcome to the forum, my friend.
Also keep in mind that there are always these guys hanging out here looking for a Clausing ;)
 
your overcooking the idea of zero run out.centering the grain is a general direction thing.you can finish out those tapers that you already have and not lose sleep.look for board stock or 1 inch rounds and stay away from the pre tapers unless you know the source.

bill
 
My Clausing is the 6913, picked it up on ebay, about a 100 miles distance. Didn't have 3 phase power, but picked up a Phase converter/VFD (variable frequency) drive (Teco) that has worked flawless so far.. some Clausings have problems with the variable speed pulleys (mine included) but the VFD offers full torque even down to 10 cycles which is slow enough to thread with. Single phase power in and 3 phase power with variable frequency out...handy as a pocket in a shirt..
 
Cgra2 said:
My Clausing is the 6913, picked it up on ebay, about a 100 miles distance. Didn't have 3 phase power, but picked up a Phase converter/VFD (variable frequency) drive (Teco) that has worked flawless so far.. some Clausings have problems with the variable speed pulleys (mine included) but the VFD offers full torque even down to 10 cycles which is slow enough to thread with. Single phase power in and 3 phase power with variable frequency out...handy as a pocket in a shirt..
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Yep, that way you don't have to mess with the hydraulics. Just out of curiosity what part of the country are you in?
 
vasilios said:
your overcooking the idea of zero run out.centering the grain is a general direction thing.you can finish out those tapers that you already have and not lose sleep.look for board stock or 1 inch rounds and stay away from the pre tapers unless you know the source.

bill
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Ok Bill, I realize that I will never achieve "perfect" but I would like to get as close as I can.. :-) I know this first cue will be examined closely by my playing buddies so I don't want the grain looking like Sargent stripes. And I will look for some board stock. I know where a hardwood barn is but I think all the hard maple they have has been planed to something like 3/4 inch (probably not big enough)..
 
Cgra2 said:
Ok Bill, I realize that I will never achieve "perfect" but I would like to get as close as I can.. :-) I know this first cue will be examined closely by my playing buddies so I don't want the grain looking like Sargent stripes. And I will look for some board stock. I know where a hardwood barn is but I think all the hard maple they have has been planed to something like 3/4 inch (probably not big enough)..
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your buds might beat on you a little for stripes.you can get real nice rounds from cuecomponents out of fla, do it online or call him.2 days you got wood.

bill
 
bapage said:
maybe this.. http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=245932
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I'd also recommend Geoff (GPD) the seller in the above referenced ad. I just received some wood from him and it is very nice. Some of the coring dowels I got from him don't vary 5/16's of an inch end to end, so you can imagine what his shaft wood is like.

I'm not discounting any of the other suppliers suggested above either, just that Geoff's customer service is right up there with Chris Hightower's and the rest and he's true to his word.

And WELCOME to the forum - it sounds like you did your homework (watched cuemaking DVD's) which was a great start.

FWIW, black walnut can make a beautiful cue - I've got some fiddleback just waiting for me to get around to it.

Gary
 
i guessing but if time is of importance for your first cue
a final taper from prather or hightower will be seasoned and ready to
be made into a shaft unlike working with a shaft dowel or cone
 
Chris Hightower and Tony Guerra have sent me excellent shaft blanks with high growth ring counts that are very straight.
 
Want to thank you guys again for your input, I will sure give some of these suppliers a try, will probably also get a couple that is close to the final taper for a couple of cues in the pipeline, untill I get some turned down.. Got my first cue finished today, but it likes a little being perfect, will make another post on this problem I have encountered...
 
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