Shaping Layered Tips

N

Nostaglia

New member
Hey all. Yes, I know, another tip thread. I've been searching around and haven't found answers to some of my questions. So here goes. Sorry if I'm a little long-winded today.

I've always done my own tips. Last year I decided to let my local PH do it to see what the difference was. A week later, the guy hands me the stick back with the disclaimer, "I didn't shape the tip since I didn't know what radius you like." No problem, right? Well, not only did he not shape the crown, he didn't trim the damn thing even with the ferrule. So much for that idea.

The last tip I installed was a Tiger Dynamite layered tip. I installed it with Tweeten glue and a clamp as I normally do, then sanded it even with the ferrule and used one of those UFO looking things to shape the crown. This was about a year ago. I've since sold the stick and he's still using the same tip.

Now I've got a Tiger Everest I want to put on my new Lucasi. So I've got a few questions:

1. I recently purchased a Porper Shaver. Should I be able to cut through the tip with this? When I tried to use it, it just kinda skipped down the side of the tip making leather dust. It doesn't seem to cut. Maybe I'm misusing it?

2. I've read about using a razor knife to rough shape the tip. When you cut the tip to match the size of the ferrule, do you slice with the razor's edge perpendicular to the shaft or parallel? i.e. Do you make many cuts across the thickness of the tip, or do you go around the edge like you're peeling an apple?

3. I've got a wood lathe in my shop. I can mount the shaft in it so I have access to the tip.
3a. Would using the lathe be better than cutting the tip by hand?
3b. What cutting tools would I use to do the lathe work? Would a sharp wood chisel be useable?

Thanks in advance,

-Joe
 
At the poolhall my friend owns, we do all our shafts on a lathe. I been through the process of trimming the tips by hand with a razor blade and really disapprove of doing so. It always seems that the tips are extremely hard to burnish if done by hand. While using the lathe with the shaft spinning, you have to be very careful and have the razor blade flush with the ferrule to trim the tip. Otherwise, you're likely to cut to much off the tip. This does require some practice before you get the hang of it so I wouldn't necessary try it. But it sure does leave the tip shiny and burnished as well as flush with the ferrule. If I were you, I would take it to a guy that know what he's doing and has experience.
 
Where to start, where to start....
1. I won't use a Porper Shaver 'cuz it's too easy to cut into the ferrule.
2. I wouldn't use a razor knife either perpendicular to the shaft or parallel 'cuz it's nearly impossible to get it truely round.
3. A very accurate wood lathe would be OK (is there such a thing as a "very accurate wood lathe" ???) but I would NOT use a wood chisel. It would be far better to have a tool post with a carbide tip cutter.

Bottom line --- Find a pro and have the job done correctly. This should include trimming the tip to match the ferrule, burnishing, and shaping the tip per your requested radius.

That's how I treat my customers... :)

Troy
Nostaglia said:
Hey all. Yes, I know, another tip thread. I've been searching around and haven't found answers to some of my questions. So here goes. Sorry if I'm a little long-winded today.

I've always done my own tips. Last year I decided to let my local PH do it to see what the difference was. A week later, the guy hands me the stick back with the disclaimer, "I didn't shape the tip since I didn't know what radius you like." No problem, right? Well, not only did he not shape the crown, he didn't trim the damn thing even with the ferrule. So much for that idea.

The last tip I installed was a Tiger Dynamite layered tip. I installed it with Tweeten glue and a clamp as I normally do, then sanded it even with the ferrule and used one of those UFO looking things to shape the crown. This was about a year ago. I've since sold the stick and he's still using the same tip.

Now I've got a Tiger Everest I want to put on my new Lucasi. So I've got a few questions:

1. I recently purchased a Porper Shaver. Should I be able to cut through the tip with this? When I tried to use it, it just kinda skipped down the side of the tip making leather dust. It doesn't seem to cut. Maybe I'm misusing it?

2. I've read about using a razor knife to rough shape the tip. When you cut the tip to match the size of the ferrule, do you slice with the razor's edge perpendicular to the shaft or parallel? i.e. Do you make many cuts across the thickness of the tip, or do you go around the edge like you're peeling an apple?

3. I've got a wood lathe in my shop. I can mount the shaft in it so I have access to the tip.
3a. Would using the lathe be better than cutting the tip by hand?
3b. What cutting tools would I use to do the lathe work? Would a sharp wood chisel be useable?

Thanks in advance,

-Joe
Click to expand...
 
Take it back to the monkey that glued it on there and didn't trim it ESPECIALLY THE SIDES. WTF! A blind guy could do a tip if thats all is takes.
 
Take it back to the monkey that glued it on there and didn't trim it ESPECIALLY THE SIDES. WTF! A blind guy could do a tip if thats all is takes.
Click to expand...
Tell me about it. That's why I just left. If that's how they "install" tips, I'm not going to trust them to finish it after I b*tch about it.

Thanks for all of your suggestions to not do the tip myself. However, I've been installing my own tips since I got my first cue many moons ago, and I'm going to continue doing so. There's no voodoo involved, just care and patience. All I really wanted to know is what kind of cutter to use on my lathe. So far I've gotten two answers, a razor blade and a carbide cutter. I'm a little leery of using a razor blade near a spinning cue tip. Can I assume the carbide cutter is the same type of bit used on a metal lathe?

Thanks,

-Joe
 
Black-Balled said:
Take it back to the monkey that glued it on there and didn't trim it ESPECIALLY THE SIDES. WTF! A blind guy could do a tip if thats all is takes.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Especially with laminated tips, the sanding & cutting effort by hand is easily ten-fold to the glueing effort. A lame excuse of not knowing what radius you like sounds very lazy-ripoff attitude to me. If you don't know what radius your customer likes, you sand it even with the ferrule from the sides and leave the radius quite flat so you'd be able to sand it more round if needed. That's what I've always done and I've changed quite a few tips for myself and many others (by hand).
 
Btw, I usually use a mat knife for cutting, it's basically a razor blade with a handle. For cutting the tip by hand, you need a very sharp blade which is also very thin, regular knifes are useless. Also patience is needed, as Nostaglia stated ;)
 
YES...

By the way, a common method of trimming using a razor blade or sharp knife is to lay the blade on the ferrule and cut toward the end of the tip. This puts de-lam pressure on a layered tip and should be avoided.

Troy
Nostaglia said:
Can I assume the carbide cutter is the same type of bit used on a metal lathe?

Thanks,

-Joe
Click to expand...
 
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If by installing your own tips your trying to save money you should just buy the tips and have some shop put it on! (It should be cheaper that way. I think most charge $10 to put a tip on if you already have it.) All except for the shop mentioned above which didnt even trim the sides WOW!!! that is unreal!! I am surprised they just didnt hand you the glue and tip and say here you go!! Since you have a wood lathe I dont know think you will have the correct tool post to use a carbide tip you may have to buy some kind of conversion. So you will probably just have to cut off the tip by hand then sand the ferrul. At least you can cut the tip down with sandpaper. I would just install the tip regular ( the way you been doing) then put it in the wood lathe to spin and use sand paper to make the tip flush. After that if you going to shape the tip use 80 grit sandpaper and hold at about 45 degree angle and it will put a perfect radius on it. (once you get good at it) To start out with I would sand with 80 then take a wililards either dime or nickel and use that to finish shaping the tip with. After you get to where you want use some leather to burnish!
 
What kind of 80 grit sand paper do you recommend? It seems to me that garnet sandpaper is the one to use for tip shaping - as opposed to emory or the other stuff.
 
kokopuffs said:
What kind of 80 grit sand paper do you recommend? It seems to me that garnet sandpaper is the one to use for tip shaping - as opposed to emory or the other stuff.
Click to expand...


I use the 3M 80 grit and cut it into quarters then fold it in half. That seems to work great.
 
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