I'd like to hear your ideas on these exercises to rapidly tune Cueing Action.
http://www.top147.com/magazine/2004003/2004003061511094232.htm
http://www.top147.com/magazine/2004003/2004003061511094232.htm
Shortcuts to a better Cue Action!
- Thread starter Colin Colenso
- Start date
Purdman
Banned
Colin
The most important thing you can do with a new player is teach them proper mechanics. Stance, Grip, Bridge, and Stroke. Break them down and explain " WHY " and " HOW ". Without a good smothe stroke, you ain't got a chance of improving anything. I am an instructor and have students who can't change their old habits. My one friend plays in two leagues and practices everyday. He hasn't improved one bit in the five years I have known him. He can't change his bad habits! My wife who didn't know what a cue was until 1999, has one of the nicest strokes you will ever see. The guy who said " it is harder to unlearn than it is to learn " is correct. Your two examples work fine. You also have to percieve what actually is with your eyes. Place a golf ball with a dot on it on the center spot on the foot rail. From the head of the table, place the cue on the table with the handle on the rail. Aim for the dot standing up and lay the cue down. Now get down and sight it in. Usually we are off a bit. This we can correct.
JMHO, Don P.
The most important thing you can do with a new player is teach them proper mechanics. Stance, Grip, Bridge, and Stroke. Break them down and explain " WHY " and " HOW ". Without a good smothe stroke, you ain't got a chance of improving anything. I am an instructor and have students who can't change their old habits. My one friend plays in two leagues and practices everyday. He hasn't improved one bit in the five years I have known him. He can't change his bad habits! My wife who didn't know what a cue was until 1999, has one of the nicest strokes you will ever see. The guy who said " it is harder to unlearn than it is to learn " is correct. Your two examples work fine. You also have to percieve what actually is with your eyes. Place a golf ball with a dot on it on the center spot on the foot rail. From the head of the table, place the cue on the table with the handle on the rail. Aim for the dot standing up and lay the cue down. Now get down and sight it in. Usually we are off a bit. This we can correct.
JMHO, Don P.
Donald A. Purdy said:The most important thing you can do with a new player is teach them proper mechanics. Stance, Grip, Bridge, and Stroke. Break them down and explain " WHY " and " HOW ". Without a good smothe stroke, you ain't got a chance of improving anything. I am an instructor and have students who can't change their old habits. My one friend plays in two leagues and practices everyday. He hasn't improved one bit in the five years I have known him. He can't change his bad habits! My wife who didn't know what a cue was until 1999, has one of the nicest strokes you will ever see. The guy who said " it is harder to unlearn than it is to learn " is correct. Your two examples work fine. You also have to percieve what actually is with your eyes. Place a golf ball with a dot on it on the center spot on the foot rail. From the head of the table, place the cue on the table with the handle on the rail. Aim for the dot standing up and lay the cue down. Now get down and sight it in. Usually we are off a bit. This we can correct.
JMHO, Don P.
I agree! Personally, I have much more trouble with allignment than cueing. If I don't put in a few sessions of practice I often hit to the right of where I think I am aiming. I kind of need to tune up my eyes. Mostly my left eye which I find is my dominant eye, but I need to practice staring down the cue for a while before I can overcome the interference from my right eye.
As for unlearning old bad habits, that is also my experience from coaching. I had a girlfriend who could only hit the cue ball one in 5 attempts
when she started, but by teaching her straight cueing fundamentals she became a very accurate pot. We won a couple of city mixed doubles competitions together. She became one of the top female players in the league. Not from much practice, just that she wouldn't miss many pots due to her straight cueing fundamentals.
I should add, that when I practice cueing in the mirror, or with the laser, staring carefully at the cue reflection or laser dot, this tends to tune in my eyes. Strengthen them perhaps.
I'll often do this cueing drill for a few minutes every hour while playing. Playing tends to bring out bad habits, retrain the muscle memory, so I find these drills very helpful in maintaining a consistant stroke.
I'll often do this cueing drill for a few minutes every hour while playing. Playing tends to bring out bad habits, retrain the muscle memory, so I find these drills very helpful in maintaining a consistant stroke.
banking
Hi Don,
When you get ready for banking try this. Place a mirrow on top of the rail,[ away from the cushion], place your cue ball on the table, align the pocket in the mirrow with your site of eye and cue ball, fire away. Goes every time, without english. This simple drill will tune you up for all banks, and make your sire of aim, sharper. It's a good referance drill for banks, and pin point shots.
Using inside english to the shot, will allow you to "pinch" the ball.
blud
Donald A. Purdy said:Colin, put several pennies on the edge of the bottom rail about 3/4 inch apart. Shoot from behind the head string and knock em off. You can also use the line between the rail felt and the edge of the table to straighten out your stroke.
I love this game!!!! Don P.
Hi Don,
When you get ready for banking try this. Place a mirrow on top of the rail,[ away from the cushion], place your cue ball on the table, align the pocket in the mirrow with your site of eye and cue ball, fire away. Goes every time, without english. This simple drill will tune you up for all banks, and make your sire of aim, sharper. It's a good referance drill for banks, and pin point shots.
Using inside english to the shot, will allow you to "pinch" the ball.
blud
Sometimes you can be doing something a certain way for so long you just don't think of other ways of doing it. I have been imagining a table directly beside mine to improve my banks, it helps but its still not perfect. Basicly your suggestion here just takes the Imagination part of it away!! Thanks for this simple suggestion Blud, im gonna go home and try that tonight!!
Hey Guys,
I do enjoy the discussions on allignment methods etc. But I'd like to get this thread back on track regarding grooving a better cue action!
Has anyone else tried the laser method mentioned in my article.
What about power swinging? I have found this extremely useful even though I have not been doing it long.
Great for power, smoothness, straighness....and within a couple of sessions I felt much more comfortable playing left handed.
I want to add....that if you haven't checked your cue action with a laser, it is very likely you are moving the cue in and out of the line as you are cueing, even though you cannot notice this by eye.
The laser will also show you how your body tends to move about. Especially as you stand over a shot for a few seconds trying to find aim.
It will teach you where your tendencies are to come off line and therefore give you a chance to eliminate these tendencies or at least begin to notice them when they come into shotmaking. It trains you to become much more aware of the finer details of your cue action.
Perhaps I'm the only goose mad enough to spend 1 hour a day practicing with a laser???
I do enjoy the discussions on allignment methods etc. But I'd like to get this thread back on track regarding grooving a better cue action!
Has anyone else tried the laser method mentioned in my article.
What about power swinging? I have found this extremely useful even though I have not been doing it long.
Great for power, smoothness, straighness....and within a couple of sessions I felt much more comfortable playing left handed.
I want to add....that if you haven't checked your cue action with a laser, it is very likely you are moving the cue in and out of the line as you are cueing, even though you cannot notice this by eye.
The laser will also show you how your body tends to move about. Especially as you stand over a shot for a few seconds trying to find aim.
It will teach you where your tendencies are to come off line and therefore give you a chance to eliminate these tendencies or at least begin to notice them when they come into shotmaking. It trains you to become much more aware of the finer details of your cue action.
Perhaps I'm the only goose mad enough to spend 1 hour a day practicing with a laser???
Colin Colenso said:
Interesting question...
Would you mind sharing how this has improved your game? and what skill level you were prior to this practice method? and what skill level you are presently?
I assume you are referring to beginners just entering the game of billiards.
To answer your first question... IMO the quickest way to improve your cue alignment would be to get a certified instructor and have them evaluate your game. This may or may not involve stroke alignment training/practice. If it does, there are many methods that are equal to or better than a laser.
I don't need to stinking laser. 
I just shoot Kinnister's shot number one over and over again or shoot spot shots until I'm lined up right.
I just shoot Kinnister's shot number one over and over again or shoot spot shots until I'm lined up right.
For Beginners and Experts
These cueing drills, especially the laser helped with my game because they gave me an intuitive sense of how I was moving my cue. I was able to feel when I made the slightest deviations and could correct this quickly with a few exercises.
Before I started using the laser (I had used the bottle and mirror cue action watching method, not banking method) my best performance was a 6th at the Nationals in 8 ball.
A few months after regularly using the laser, I noticed good improvement in my cueing action and also playing accuracy. I placed 4th, then 3rd in two of Australia's highest prizemoney events AUD$10,000 and then placed 5th in Australia's richest ever 8-ball event worth AUD$100,000 that attracted the best field in history for an Aussie tournament.
An instructor is fine, but he is not going to stare down the cue with you for an hour at a time each day. It sometimes takes this kind of dedication to reach the highest levels. I think the laser and rapid cue swinging are two great methods to train muscle memory and neuromuscular awareness to higher levels.
Tom In Cincy said:
These cueing drills, especially the laser helped with my game because they gave me an intuitive sense of how I was moving my cue. I was able to feel when I made the slightest deviations and could correct this quickly with a few exercises.
Before I started using the laser (I had used the bottle and mirror cue action watching method, not banking method) my best performance was a 6th at the Nationals in 8 ball.
A few months after regularly using the laser, I noticed good improvement in my cueing action and also playing accuracy. I placed 4th, then 3rd in two of Australia's highest prizemoney events AUD$10,000 and then placed 5th in Australia's richest ever 8-ball event worth AUD$100,000 that attracted the best field in history for an Aussie tournament.
An instructor is fine, but he is not going to stare down the cue with you for an hour at a time each day. It sometimes takes this kind of dedication to reach the highest levels. I think the laser and rapid cue swinging are two great methods to train muscle memory and neuromuscular awareness to higher levels.
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Practice Tips...
Colin,
Great post! I'm sure there are several techniques to improve your stroke allignment, and everyone can prove them right or wrong, for whatever reasons.
Purdman,
Awesome tips about sighting. I like the pennies on the rail Purdman. I had a friend years ago who would place a penny on the center spot, just off the rails edge, a glass of beer with a Schnapps shot in the bottom on the table next to the foot spot, shoot the CB into the rail forcing the penny to fly off the rail and into the glass of beer on the next table...then slam the beer and toss the penny to someone watching. Awesome trick, could be done 3/5 times.
Blud,
Great advice! I'ver heard people talk about the mirror, but I've never tried it. When I practice banks, I imagine another table directly parrallel to the one I'm playing on, then shoot into the side pocket of the other table. I'm about 80% on my banks, both with and without english.
Thanks for the tips and keep em' comin',
Zim
Colin,
Great post! I'm sure there are several techniques to improve your stroke allignment, and everyone can prove them right or wrong, for whatever reasons.
Purdman,
Awesome tips about sighting. I like the pennies on the rail Purdman. I had a friend years ago who would place a penny on the center spot, just off the rails edge, a glass of beer with a Schnapps shot in the bottom on the table next to the foot spot, shoot the CB into the rail forcing the penny to fly off the rail and into the glass of beer on the next table...then slam the beer and toss the penny to someone watching. Awesome trick, could be done 3/5 times.
Blud,
Great advice! I'ver heard people talk about the mirror, but I've never tried it. When I practice banks, I imagine another table directly parrallel to the one I'm playing on, then shoot into the side pocket of the other table. I'm about 80% on my banks, both with and without english.
Thanks for the tips and keep em' comin',
Zim
Re: The mirror method for seeing bank angles, I've also set up a mirror along the cushion (about 1 inch from the edge). It's a good way to see how speed and spin may affect the natural angles.
Another method that I have used in double's tournaments is to measure the location of the imaginary pocket, or target ball, and place my cue vertically at this spot.
My partner would align to the cue. I would move when he had the line to avoid too much controversy. The success rate for getting out of snookers was very high. It works much the same way as having a mirror to assist.
Another method that I have used in double's tournaments is to measure the location of the imaginary pocket, or target ball, and place my cue vertically at this spot.
My partner would align to the cue. I would move when he had the line to avoid too much controversy. The success rate for getting out of snookers was very high. It works much the same way as having a mirror to assist.
drivermaker
Banned
Colin Colenso said:
Colin, of all the bullshit that you've written on the scientific side which isn't going to do much to help anyone other than learn to write a thesis, you've hit on something here thats REAL WORLD practical and intrigues me about tuning up your eyes. When I first get on the table, typically I'll just scatter the balls all over the table for 9 ball. There are days when I come come right out of the box cold as ice and run 2 or 3 racks as easy as could be. And there are other days where I really do have to tune up my eyes because they're out of whack. It's like I can't line up the CB to the OB properly, the cue to my line, or anything else. My stroke sure as hell doesn't go out of kilter over night, but it is going cockeyed because it seems like I am cockeyed until I can really focus and start seeing things properly after about 30 minutes or so. I don't know why this happens, maybe a laser beam would allow you to get in synch immediately on those days when you're eyes and brain are haywire. I'm almost afraid of getting one because it would put me a step closer to becoming a certifiable loon, and who knows where I could go from there. Heaven forbid...maybe even a deflection whacko. (Help me Lord...help me)
When the stars are aligned and I'm feeling good, I feel like my stroke is pretty straight and smooth. However, there are a lot of things that can throw it off, e.g., I'm feeling awful or I had too much coffee or sometimes I just don't feel like playing that much (which aint often). When any of the aforementioned occurs, it doesn't matter much what kind of drills I have done.
I do like the idea of stroking the cue very fast as a warm-up exercise though. I might try that and incorporate it into a warm up routine. Thanks Colin.
I do like the idea of stroking the cue very fast as a warm-up exercise though. I might try that and incorporate it into a warm up routine. Thanks Colin.
What I don't like about the stroke trainer!
I believe a laser is far more accurate in showing any lateral movements in the cue and allowing you to fine tune them.
I also believe the fast swinging, done 5*20 seconds per day will be far more effective for training the opposite arm. Combine this with the laser and the results are even better.
Some points about the stroke trainer I don't like:
You may be applying force against the guide which, when removed would result in movement to the side.
The elbow or point of contact may move laterally during the stroke, meaning that the cue is not actually moving straight.
You need to manipulate your body into the right position on the device. If you assume slighlty different positions each time, you may be changing the stroke.
In neuromuscular adaptation experiments, a machine guided movement does not develop neuromuscular pathways to increase coordination. So if it is force of the guide keeping the cue straight, then it is not such an effective way of training muscle memory. (Properly called neuromuscular adaptation).
You might as well just use a guide like a beer bottle.
Still, better to use the guide trainer than nothing at all. Just take notice of body position, lateral movement of the elbow (or contact point on the guide), and not to apply force against the side of the guide.
To demonstrate this last point. Stand in a doorway, with straigh arms hanging, move them to the side of the door frame and push hard for 20 seconds. Then move away and relax your arms. Move them up a little. You'll feel them wanting to rise. So imagine what happens to your muscle memory if you are pushing againt the side of the stroke trainer guide.
Frank_Glenn said:
I believe a laser is far more accurate in showing any lateral movements in the cue and allowing you to fine tune them.
I also believe the fast swinging, done 5*20 seconds per day will be far more effective for training the opposite arm. Combine this with the laser and the results are even better.
Some points about the stroke trainer I don't like:
You may be applying force against the guide which, when removed would result in movement to the side.
The elbow or point of contact may move laterally during the stroke, meaning that the cue is not actually moving straight.
You need to manipulate your body into the right position on the device. If you assume slighlty different positions each time, you may be changing the stroke.
In neuromuscular adaptation experiments, a machine guided movement does not develop neuromuscular pathways to increase coordination. So if it is force of the guide keeping the cue straight, then it is not such an effective way of training muscle memory. (Properly called neuromuscular adaptation).
You might as well just use a guide like a beer bottle.
Still, better to use the guide trainer than nothing at all. Just take notice of body position, lateral movement of the elbow (or contact point on the guide), and not to apply force against the side of the guide.
To demonstrate this last point. Stand in a doorway, with straigh arms hanging, move them to the side of the door frame and push hard for 20 seconds. Then move away and relax your arms. Move them up a little. You'll feel them wanting to rise. So imagine what happens to your muscle memory if you are pushing againt the side of the stroke trainer guide.
drivermaker said:
You've hit the point of no return now. Next you'll be wearning 3D goggles and carrying a mass spectrometer and high speed photography gismos to every practice session.
Sounds like I'm just like you with the eyes. Sometimes they're locked it from the go. Moreso when I am practicing regularly. When I take some time off, I can look and feel like an absolute spastic cause I'm seeing with my right eye but actually the cue is pointed along my left eye. Years ago I believe I was right eye dominant, but that changed for god knows whatever reason. I actually have 20/20 vision in both eyes. Maybe I began using the right side of my brain more reading all that physics garbage
I think the laser could help a little, but mainly because you are staring at the dot 5-10 feet away, similar to how you stare at balls. You can check the laser is put on accurately by looking down the cue with one-eye like a gunsite. If you have a laser pen, you can attach it with blue-tak. If it only goes on when button is pressed. You can tape over the button and use the battery screw cap to turn it on and off.
But the best thing for me to tune my eyes is tournament play. This seems to make me focus harder than usual. Staring so hard that later it feels like your eyes have run 10k.
There are probably some exercises that could be developed to help tune the eyes that are more effective than this. Maybe a few reps of one eyed focusing in and out from 5" to 10 feet and back.
I should think try a few things and see if any work better than what I do now. Because playing when you are seeing the lines clearly is just bloody fabulous. The opposite is just torture and fills the head with doubts.
I want to add something re:the stroke trainer.
Your elbow may be moving perfectly along the line, but a lot of the movement may come through the wrist. Your wrist may be moving all over the place and you may not know it.
Also, if the elbow is tucked in a little, as many players do, this device will be hard to use.
That said, I haven't used one.... just going of the pics and explainations I've seen.
Your elbow may be moving perfectly along the line, but a lot of the movement may come through the wrist. Your wrist may be moving all over the place and you may not know it.
Also, if the elbow is tucked in a little, as many players do, this device will be hard to use.
That said, I haven't used one.... just going of the pics and explainations I've seen.
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