Shot accuracy % rating system

R

RingKing

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Looks like Fargo rating is king right now problem is you have to play against other rated players and play alot to establish Fargo score.

The above is hard if you live in a remote area where you don't have many or any rated players.

How about a shot accuracy % or SAP rating system?
I think it could be very easy to figure out spots. Additionally you could accurately rate yourself playing the ghost.
 
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RingKing said:
Looks like Fargo rating is king right now problem is you have to play against other rated players and play alot to establish Fargo score.

The above is hard if you live in a remote area where you don't have many or any rated players.

How about a shot accuracy % rating system?
I think it could be very easy to figure out spots. Additionally you could accurately rate yourself playing the ghost.
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You mean like shooting spot shots?? ;)
 
I was thinking if your playing the ghost you can play safe,

if the ghost can hit any part of the ball you lose and the shot is marked as a miss.

If the ghost has to kick at the ball to hit it then its a draw the shot is not marked as a miss or a make. Doesent hurt you and should be kept track of. Say I'm an 82% shooter and average 0.3 safeties per game against the ghost or 0.3 (SATG)
garczar said:
You mean like shooting spot shots?? ;)
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What's the current record for most spot shot in a row? Want to talk about exciting television there it is.
 
RingKing said:
I was thinking if your playing the ghost you can play safe,

if the ghost can hit any part of the ball you lose and the shot is marked as a miss.

If the ghost has to kick at the ball to hit it then its a draw the shot is not marked as a miss or a make. Doesent hurt you and should be kept track of. Say I'm an 82% shooter and average 0.3 safeties per game against the ghost or 0.3 (SATG)

What's the current record for most spot shot in a row? Want to talk about exciting television there it is.
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Record is 1,250 in a row. Kenny Kiddy. He also ran over 500 and 700. Made 95 spot-to-spot spot shots.
 
garczar said:
Record is 1,250 in a row. Kenny Kiddy. He also ran over 500 and 700. Made 95 spot-to-spot spot shots.
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On the spot to spot did he have to play cue where it stopped and did it have to stop behind the head string on each side?
 
I was thinking shooting spot shots from both end of the table. Play cue where it lies after each shot. As long as it is behind head string. Alternate end to end.
 
RingKing said:
I was thinking shooting spot shots from both end of the table. Play cue where it lies after each shot. As long as it is behind head string. Alternate end to end.
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Never seen that done. EVER. He either shot normal BIH in the kitchen or spot-to-spot. No 'wherever it ends up' stuff. That would be pretty tough tho for sure.
 
RingKing said:
I was thinking if your playing the ghost you can play safe,

if the ghost can hit any part of the ball you lose and the shot is marked as a miss.

If the ghost has to kick at the ball to hit it then its a draw the shot is not marked as a miss or a make. Doesent hurt you and should be kept track of. Say I'm an 82% shooter and average 0.3 safeties per game against the ghost or 0.3 (SATG)
Click to expand...
I like the idea but…. What’s the next shot after a safety shot? BIH?
 
RingKing said:
Looks like Fargo rating is king right now problem is you have to play against other rated players and play alot to establish Fargo score.

The above is hard if you live in a remote area where you don't have many or any rated players.

How about a shot accuracy % or SAP rating system?
I think it could be very easy to figure out spots. Additionally you could accurately rate yourself playing the ghost.
Click to expand...

If you don't play other players, the only real way to figure out a player rating aside from just using knowledge and seeing how they play, would be playing the ghost. I would not worry about safety play there at all, it does not come into effect much for "skill" at the table, safety play like pattern play is knowledge and there is just about no way to gain the skill to run out without gaining the knowledge of pattern play and safeties. Once you can beat the 9 ball ghost, it's safe to say your safety play is about that same level of skill and if you have a hard time running out 3 balls, same thing there, there is pretty much 0 chance you play safe at a higher level. All the ghost ratings are already established.
 
hang-the-9 said:
If you don't play other players, the only real way to figure out a player rating aside from just using knowledge and seeing how they play, would be playing the ghost. I would not worry about safety play there at all, it does not come into effect much for "skill" at the table, safety play like pattern play is knowledge and there is just about no way to gain the skill to run out without gaining the knowledge of pattern play and safeties. Once you can beat the 9 ball ghost, it's safe to say your safety play is about that same level of skill and if you have a hard time running out 3 balls, same thing there, there is pretty much 0 chance you play safe at a higher level. All the ghost ratings are already established.
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Understood, saying the ghost has to give me the 8 ball or 6 out for me to have an edge is an established rating.

My thought is using playing against the ghost to establish an accuracy %.
Say you are go for a break out and balls end up real tough instead of shooting a low percentage shot you can bow out with a successful safety and it won't change your shot accuracy % where a miss would.

Someone may say they play even with the ghost. Does that mean they win 51% of the games or 90% of the games with no spot?
 
RingKing said:
Understood, saying the ghost has to give me the 8 ball or 6 out for me to have an edge is an established rating.

My thought is using playing against the ghost to establish an accuracy %.
Say you are go for a break out and balls end up real tough instead of shooting a low percentage shot you can bow out with a successful safety and it won't change your shot accuracy % where a miss would.

Someone may say they play even with the ghost. Does that mean they win 51% of the games or 90% of the games with no spot?
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To me playing the ghost even means there's no spot and sets are either double-hill or one game either way. You keep saying 'shot accuracy'. Just exactly what are you referring to? To me 'shot accuracy' is pocketing balls. BTW, best ghost perf. i've ever heard of is Efren racing to 21 playing 10b. IIRC he wins 21-10.
 
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garczar said:
To me playing the ghost even means there's no spot and sets are either double-hill or one game either way. You keep saying 'shot accuracy'. Just exactly what are you referring to? To me 'shot accuracy' is pocketing balls. BTW, best ghost perf. i've ever heard of is Efren racing to 21 playing 10b. IIRC he wins 21-10.
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To me shot accuracy is making the ball period. All the factors that go into running multiple balls can be ignored they are inherent in make %.
 
RingKing said:
Understood, saying the ghost has to give me the 8 ball or 6 out for me to have an edge is an established rating.

My thought is using playing against the ghost to establish an accuracy %.
Say you are go for a break out and balls end up real tough instead of shooting a low percentage shot you can bow out with a successful safety and it won't change your shot accuracy % where a miss would.

Someone may say they play even with the ghost. Does that mean they win 51% of the games or 90% of the games with no spot?
Click to expand...

There are different levels of the ghost based on the skill level. An A- and higher player should be able to beat the 8 or 9 ball ghost (race to 10). A B range player 6-7 ball ghost, a good C can probably beat the 5 ball ghost, etc.. Beating the ghost can be a 9/10 win, basically you run out the rack a bit more than half the time and miss under half the time with ball in hand. IMHO you would need a 70% rate of beating the ghost before you can say "I beat the ghost at so and so a level", meaning if you play 10 races to 10 vs the ghost you win 7 of those to be a consistent player at a given level.

If you want to know how well you play when playing, that is pretty simple, AccuStats has done that decades ago. Take how many balls you shot and then take away from a 1.000 score for every miss/position error/safety error/kicking error/scratch. Of course you need to take some things into account when playing by yourself since if you take a position error then miss the kick you are doubling your mistake, and in a game those would be for two different players. So if I was trying to get a rating for me in a ghost game, I would take away a point for getting out of line and being forced into a safety or needing to kick but not another one if you miss the kick. If you get out of line but bank the ball in or something, I think that still counts as an error but you then avoid having a miss as well.

Good pro level is about the .850 range, if you play over .900 for all the matches in an event you are likely to win that event. .800 is about pro level, but just so-so, .850 is what the commentators call world class, so think of guys like Archer, Orcullo, Strickland, Shaw, etc.. Over .900 is usually an exceptional match, although with the mechanics of the modern players and the training they do, I'm guessing there are more .900 matches now than there were 20 years ago.
 
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RingKing said:
To me shot accuracy is making the ball period. All the factors that go into running multiple balls can be ignored they are inherent in make %.
Click to expand...
You mentioned 'accuracy %'. Playing the ghost that pretty much means winning or losing the game. Its not a separate stat. The only stat in playing the ghost is W/L. If you want to make note of how many balls you pocket in a set that's fine but if you don't get out it really doesn't matter. if i break and run eight(9b) and dog the nine all those 'makes' don't mean squat. I lost.
 
somewhat of a solution is if one playing rack #109 on your standard 7' valley,
it would match up and score the same for comparison as any other one' at its location, remote or not on a 7' valley.
 
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