Subrail Extentions Idea

D

dendweller

Well-known member
Here goes. I was talking to a local mechanic and he says he thinks there is an middle ground for tightening pockets.

Worst is using stacked facing which mean no subrail extension. Everyone agrees that's kind of sub standard.

Best is using quality plywood to extend the subrail and recut the pocket openings and angles etc.

The middle ground he does is to use hard facing material instead of plywood to extend the subrail. The facing material is applied and trimmed off even with the subrail glue surface after the rubber is removed. The rubber is glued on and a single 8th inch soft facing is used on the end.

Having read all the info on here I kind of dismissed it at first but the more I thought about it the more I started wondering if that isn't a decent middle ground for someone that doesn't have the experience or a mechanic that is set up to do the full job.

Any thoughts?
 
dendweller said:
Here goes. I was talking to a local mechanic and he says he thinks there is an middle ground for tightening pockets.

Worst is using stacked facing which mean no subrail extension. Everyone agrees that's kind of sub standard.

Best is using quality plywood to extend the subrail and recut the pocket openings and angles etc.

The middle ground he does is to use hard facing material instead of plywood to extend the subrail. The facing material is applied and trimmed off even with the subrail glue surface after the rubber is removed. The rubber is glued on and a single 8th inch soft facing is used on the end.

Having read all the info on here I kind of dismissed it at first but the more I thought about it the more I started wondering if that isn't a decent middle ground for someone that doesn't have the experience or a mechanic that is set up to do the full job.

Any thoughts?
Click to expand...
I live by the old adage my father taught me many years ago: There's only one way to do things, the right way. This certainly applies here. Whether you are using multiple facings or a single thick facing you are still filling the void with the incorrect material. Obviously you can do it but the pocket will play dead. The only way to tighten the pockets that will ensure no degradation in quality of play is the "Best" method mentioned above.

Why are you trying to cut corners?
 
Actually, with the second case the pocket would play really lively because what it's doing is installing the rails over the facings used to extend the rail. The only facing that would be on the front of the rail is the 18th inch one on the end.

The reason I'm looking at this is this is what's available locally. Same old story, can't get another set of rails (and I've tried) and don't want to ship the ones I have.

Like I said, I initially dismissed it, but after thinking about it for a while I think it would be worlds better than 3/8 inch of facing on the front of the rail. Bottom line, you're replacing the plywood the best way uses with hard facing material.
 
dendweller said:
Actually, with the second case the pocket would play really lively because what it's doing is installing the rails over the facings used to extend the rail. The only facing that would be on the front of the rail is the 18th inch one on the end.

The reason I'm looking at this is this is what's available locally. Same old story, can't get another set of rails (and I've tried) and don't want to ship the ones I have.

Like I said, I initially dismissed it, but after thinking about it for a while I think it would be worlds better than 3/8 inch of facing on the front of the rail. Bottom line, you're replacing the plywood the best way uses with hard facing material.
Click to expand...
I understand what you are saying now but if you are going to go through that trouble, why not just use the plywood? Depending on what size pockets you are going with, the miter angles will most likely need to be changed too. It's easier to cut wood than facing material.
 
rexus31 said:
I understand what you are saying now but if you are going to go through that trouble, why not just use the plywood? Depending on what size pockets you are going with, the miter angles will most likely need to be changed too. It's easier to cut wood than facing material.
Click to expand...
Yeah, this method would include living with the miters you got. I'm thinking it would make for some pretty tough pocket, my miters average around 142-143.
 
They are right at 4.5 now using 3/8 inch shims. I'm thinking I'll replace the 3/8th inch shim with a 1/4 inch hard shim in back of the new rubber and put an 8th on the facing. I don't want them any tighter, just want them to play tougher.

Balls that have no business dropping drop on my shimmed setup at 4.5 inches. I don't care for that.
 
dendweller said:
They are right at 4.5 now using 3/8 inch shims. I'm thinking I'll replace the 3/8th inch shim with a 1/4 inch hard shim in back of the new rubber and put an 8th on the facing. I don't want them any tighter, just want them to play tougher.

Balls that have no business dropping drop on my shimmed setup at 4.5 inches. I don't care for that.
Click to expand...
I am only chiming in to say: ALL OTHERS READING. DO NOT FOLLOW DOWN THIS PATH. Proper subrail extensions are the best route and only way I would do it and I am betting MOST mechanics will say the same.

There really aint nothing to talk about here, now is there?? :P

TFT
 
trentfromtoledo said:
This is the core of it. Not tryin to press the OP, just stating that his diligence to his path, is not the recommended one. IMO

TFT
Click to expand...
Don't think anyone is saying this is as good as getting subrails done, but if that isn't something available to you, this will play better around the pockets than just doing stacked facings.
 
dendweller said:
The middle ground he does is to use hard facing material instead of plywood to extend the subrail. The facing material is applied and trimmed off even with the subrail glue surface after the rubber is removed. The rubber is glued on and a single 8th inch soft facing is used on the end.

Any thoughts?
Click to expand...
Just one... Why?

Not entirely sure what's going to be saved by using hard rubber over plywood. I guess if you not going to change the miter angle, then it's an option, but no different than using a piece of wood at the same thickness.

I must be missing something
 
The_JV said:
Just one... Why?

Not entirely sure what's going to be saved by using hard rubber over plywood. I guess if you not going to change the miter angle, then it's an option, but no different than using a piece of wood at the same thickness.

I must be missing something
Click to expand...
I believe this guy does not have a wood shop so does them this way. He wasn't arguing that it was better, just that it's better than stacked facings.
 
The_JV said:
Fair enough...
Click to expand...
To me, the only benefit to using hard rubber rather than plywood (if you aren't changing the miters) is the ability to go back to stock if it doesn't work out that well or it's time to give the table to your off spring who are not real interested in the table being more difficult.
 
dendweller said:
To me, the only benefit to using hard rubber rather than plywood (if you aren't changing the miters) is the ability to go back to stock if it doesn't work out that well or it's time to give the table to your off spring who are not real interested in the table being more difficult.
Click to expand...
If you use wood cant you always just cut off the extra extension that was added?? I would imagine that the hard rubber might cause more damage to the original sub-rail trying to remove it than using wood would cause. If its extended with wood you can always stick in a miter saw a cut the sub-rail, with rubber extensions I would think that you would have to be much more careful to get all of the rubber off, if you left a little of the wood extension behind no big deal.
 
Actually,i don’t think it’s such a bad idea if you are going to finish with a 1/8th facing. They usually get cut real fast where the cushion meets the wood…


Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant AzBilliards Forums
 
fastone371 said:
If you use wood cant you always just cut off the extra extension that was added?? I would imagine that the hard rubber might cause more damage to the original sub-rail trying to remove it than using wood would cause. If its extended with wood you can always stick in a miter saw a cut the sub-rail, with rubber extensions I would think that you would have to be much more careful to get all of the rubber off, if you left a little of the wood extension behind no big deal.
Click to expand...
I'd think they would come off just like a facing, would be put on with contact cement and stapled at the bottom.
 
fastone371 said:
If you use wood cant you always just cut off the extra extension that was added?? I would imagine that the hard rubber might cause more damage to the original sub-rail trying to remove it than using wood would cause. If its extended with wood you can always stick in a miter saw a cut the sub-rail, with rubber extensions I would think that you would have to be much more careful to get all of the rubber off, if you left a little of the wood extension behind no big deal.
Click to expand...
To be clear, I don't think this is the best method. I think it will have results a lot better than the 3/8 inch facings I have on there now.

As far as cutting the extension off, that would take the same experience and talent that doing it the correct way in the first place would take, calculating miters and down angles etc. as well as the equipment to do it, and it's not a 190 dollar chop saw from harbor freight.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top