The Future Of The Southwest Amateur Tournament in TX
- Thread starter ne14tennis
- Start date
Timing formats always depend on the type of tournament that is being held. With a tournament in your local pool hall the "Shot Gun" works pretty good but at the bigger tournament formats players need things timed out so they know when they can leave for lunch or use the time to simply get away from the playing area for a breather.
We have changed the timing and format for SWAT #3 in October (Oct. 17-19).
We were planning on playing 9-ball or 10-ball but instead we will be playing 8-ball. Scotch Doubles (Mixed) will be played all day Friday with singles starting Saturday morning at 9am.
We will have mini-tournaments going on for the incoming players and players eliminated from Scotch earlier Friday evening than normal (also starting about 6pm Thursdayevening).
Entry forms at the following links:
http://www.playbca.com/portals/0/regional/SWAT_3.pdf
http://www.sw8ball.org
We have changed the timing and format for SWAT #3 in October (Oct. 17-19).
We were planning on playing 9-ball or 10-ball but instead we will be playing 8-ball. Scotch Doubles (Mixed) will be played all day Friday with singles starting Saturday morning at 9am.
We will have mini-tournaments going on for the incoming players and players eliminated from Scotch earlier Friday evening than normal (also starting about 6pm Thursdayevening).
Entry forms at the following links:
http://www.playbca.com/portals/0/regional/SWAT_3.pdf
http://www.sw8ball.org
8-ball
This will probably be successful as you will be in 8-ball season. Too bad the 9-ballers can't get on those Diamond smarts for a tournament running Friday night. If you book at least 24 tables this should be easy.
My two cents regarding 9-ball SWAT. I doubt that you will ever get enough interest to compete with Waco / Denton and others. No Added money and no one-day approach. Not to compete for their players, but to be even remotely interesting to draw them there for the event. As I stated earlier green fees being higher, that does tilt the scales against anyone but the pocket billiard / Diamond junkie. :boring2:
I also agree with others who have said that advertising for this is minimal, unless you are familiar with playbca or Azbilliards.
This will probably be successful as you will be in 8-ball season. Too bad the 9-ballers can't get on those Diamond smarts for a tournament running Friday night. If you book at least 24 tables this should be easy.
My two cents regarding 9-ball SWAT. I doubt that you will ever get enough interest to compete with Waco / Denton and others. No Added money and no one-day approach. Not to compete for their players, but to be even remotely interesting to draw them there for the event. As I stated earlier green fees being higher, that does tilt the scales against anyone but the pocket billiard / Diamond junkie. :boring2:
I also agree with others who have said that advertising for this is minimal, unless you are familiar with playbca or Azbilliards.
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rbtabor said:
Robert: you answered it correctly. I have heard in the past, in some
events (not yours) players were not allowed to leave the area or would
risk forfeit if their match was called. When you have advanced in the
bracket faster than others, and there still is 2 or more matches to be
played before your match can be called, you can see where players could
get upset. If I was a player in this situation, it would be good to
communicate with the T.D. to get a "safe" match time.
Good luck with your next event.
rbtabor said:
These are awesome changes, Robert! I can't wait! Please, let me know how I can help!
P.S. It's not often people listen to the players - thank you!
Hi Everyone!!
As I can only speak for myself, here are the reasons I chose not to sign up this time around:
1) Triple elimination was brutal. I realize the reasoning for this, however, for myself it was just not economical. I got fifth and didn't even cover my hotel room for one night not the three I actually stayed, let alone gas, food, or even the table cost.
2) The days were grueling. You would have 9 am matches and if you made all the way through you could expect to be playing until 11 pm and then have to get up and do it all over again. I think the idea of a "shotgun" tournament is a great idea and definitely could help the timing of matches. If both players are there, there should be no harm in starting a match early.
As always I'm a little long-winded but I didn't want to be all negative. TABOR IS AN AWESOME TOURNAMENT DIRECTOR and this is a great tournament. I hope that it doesn't go to 9 ball, this tournament is one of the few that still does 8 ball. The tables are amazing and the Diamond guys are truly rock stars in their own right.
Miss you Melinda and Amanda!!!
Ashley
As I can only speak for myself, here are the reasons I chose not to sign up this time around:
1) Triple elimination was brutal. I realize the reasoning for this, however, for myself it was just not economical. I got fifth and didn't even cover my hotel room for one night not the three I actually stayed, let alone gas, food, or even the table cost.
2) The days were grueling. You would have 9 am matches and if you made all the way through you could expect to be playing until 11 pm and then have to get up and do it all over again. I think the idea of a "shotgun" tournament is a great idea and definitely could help the timing of matches. If both players are there, there should be no harm in starting a match early.
As always I'm a little long-winded but I didn't want to be all negative. TABOR IS AN AWESOME TOURNAMENT DIRECTOR and this is a great tournament. I hope that it doesn't go to 9 ball, this tournament is one of the few that still does 8 ball. The tables are amazing and the Diamond guys are truly rock stars in their own right.
Miss you Melinda and Amanda!!!
Ashley
nandrasy said:
That's what a pool tournament is about :thumbup:
Early mornings and late evenings is what makes it fun.
Been to Vegas lately? Try playing at 7:30 AM after your last match ended at 1:30 AM....I love it :grin:
Lonestar_jim said:This will probably be successful as you will be in 8-ball season. Too bad the 9-ballers can't get on those Diamond smarts for a tournament running Friday night. If you book at least 24 tables this should be easy.
Most 9 ballers I talk with don't want to play on the bar boxes, that's why I thought it was a strange choice. Most of the players I know want to play 9 Ball on 8 or 9 footers
No comment, see above
Good point. What other means are there? Seriously!!
Robert tried to get it put out through the league operators and the majority of the people said their League Op never mentioned it or did it in passing with no details or emphasis.
I have personally asked pool halls here if I could put up flyers. The answer has been either yes, and the next day the flyer is gone or flat out no. The pool halls will not help you advertise an event that has the potential to take their players away.
With as many views as this and the other tournament threads get....word of mouth almost seems like the best idea
Different Strokes
This tournament was originally designed for the League Player. The intent was for League players to have more chances than just the State and Nationals to play in a "Big" tourney atmosphere on Diamond sand lots which is how those tourneys are run.
The problem developed where players came from areas that had no organized BCA-ACS-APA-Valley-Tap leagues and the league member requirement was dropped.
So if you find "the pocket billiard / Diamond junkie. :boring2: " . This tour was not inteded to compete for the players of big table 9 ball
Lonestar_jim said:
This tournament was originally designed for the League Player. The intent was for League players to have more chances than just the State and Nationals to play in a "Big" tourney atmosphere on Diamond sand lots which is how those tourneys are run.
The problem developed where players came from areas that had no organized BCA-ACS-APA-Valley-Tap leagues and the league member requirement was dropped.
So if you find "the pocket billiard / Diamond junkie. :boring2: " . This tour was not inteded to compete for the players of big table 9 ball
Understand
I understand the intent of SWAT to appeal to league players and eliminate roadies and pros. Most small tournaments I play in have at least 50% league people participating.
Someone did some good advertising in the past for the Grapevine ? event. There was a lot of turn out and most of the winners were not SWEL people. I am not sure what demographic has represented the Harker Heights' tourney's as I have not participated. If it is 60% Dallas people, then I ask is gas higher in central TX ? I thought the rotating locations was a good idea, notwithstanding El Paso or whatever.
I still say read the poll results. More than half are willing to play in a 9-ball event on the barbox. I don't think anyone wants to see 9-ball only. We just want to see one well planned amateur league 9-ball event. Maybe SWAT is not the vehicle for this event. I suggest get rid of the 9-ball season in SWEL if there is no emphasis in tournaments for that game.
Someone else please chime in. I have only been in league for 2 years.
I understand the intent of SWAT to appeal to league players and eliminate roadies and pros. Most small tournaments I play in have at least 50% league people participating.
Someone did some good advertising in the past for the Grapevine ? event. There was a lot of turn out and most of the winners were not SWEL people. I am not sure what demographic has represented the Harker Heights' tourney's as I have not participated. If it is 60% Dallas people, then I ask is gas higher in central TX ? I thought the rotating locations was a good idea, notwithstanding El Paso or whatever.
I still say read the poll results. More than half are willing to play in a 9-ball event on the barbox. I don't think anyone wants to see 9-ball only. We just want to see one well planned amateur league 9-ball event. Maybe SWAT is not the vehicle for this event. I suggest get rid of the 9-ball season in SWEL if there is no emphasis in tournaments for that game.
Someone else please chime in. I have only been in league for 2 years.
Lonestar_jim said:
I can chime in!
I think Killeen is a good location because it's central in Texas to most cities and b/c it's a VERY low overhead to have it at that venue. In other cities, having it at hotels costs WAY too much money. The reason Grapevine was successful was b/c there are a lot of people in the DFW area. Why wasn't it successful at Houston, though? Why aren't more players IN the Killeen leagues signing up for the Killeen tournaments? It's obvious to me Tabor advertised the Grapevine tournament in SWEL, but other leagues aren't advertising these events. Well, obvious is a strong word, b/c it really is an assumption.
I think 8 ball on bar tables is perfect -9 ball is for 8 foots and 9 foots. As for 9-ball, leagues, I can't speak for. I only play 8ball league to qualify for BCA Nationals in Vegas every year.
For this past event that was canceled - A LOT of my friends had family things going on. Maybe it's b/c of the Summer? And kids are out of school? I think starting on Saturday morning will help a lot. As a matter of fact, we may get complaints it runs late b/c there were too many people and we started it on Saturday morning - wouldn't that be cool?!
Let's face it, true league players don't yet go to 'other' tournaments. The mid level players go to tournaments for the money. So, this in between stage is tough.... but I appreciate what Tabor is doing! I know it's a lot of trial and error, but that's how the OB Cues Ladies tour (previously Hunter Tour) started out - we have made a lot of changes through the 15 years we have been areound.
All this has been said elsewhere
The DFW and surrounding areas were tuned into the Grapevine event and even though SWEL didn't win all the divisions, I think the majority of winners were from the DFW area leagues.
As Melinda stated, the Harker Heights location seems like a good fit. It's large enough to hold all the tables needed and I think the financial arrangement is better suited. When this tournament went places like Grapevine, Houston and Amarillo the only place with a decent turnout was Grapevine.
I have an email from Robert with all the costs and if he gives me permission, I may post the numbers. All I can say is with 64 Scotch, 64 Women and 128 Men, you are still in the hole for a couple of grand after everything is paid for so it's imperative that you get large numbers of players and you run mini's whenever possible. That's the only way you'll keep this tournament going or getting added money.
We have a large player base in this area, however most of them don't play tourney...especially $60 tourneys
We be po' folk
Lastly, the BCA did away with the 9 Ball format for state and I heard rumors it may go away in the National b/c of decreasing numbers. You don't see 8 ball tourneys run on 9 footers and i don't think 9ball on a barbox draws much interest other than bar bangers looking for a change from the usual 8 ball
Lonestar_jim said:
The DFW and surrounding areas were tuned into the Grapevine event and even though SWEL didn't win all the divisions, I think the majority of winners were from the DFW area leagues.
As Melinda stated, the Harker Heights location seems like a good fit. It's large enough to hold all the tables needed and I think the financial arrangement is better suited. When this tournament went places like Grapevine, Houston and Amarillo the only place with a decent turnout was Grapevine.
I have an email from Robert with all the costs and if he gives me permission, I may post the numbers. All I can say is with 64 Scotch, 64 Women and 128 Men, you are still in the hole for a couple of grand after everything is paid for so it's imperative that you get large numbers of players and you run mini's whenever possible. That's the only way you'll keep this tournament going or getting added money.
We have a large player base in this area, however most of them don't play tourney...especially $60 tourneys
We be po' folk
Lastly, the BCA did away with the 9 Ball format for state and I heard rumors it may go away in the National b/c of decreasing numbers. You don't see 8 ball tourneys run on 9 footers and i don't think 9ball on a barbox draws much interest other than bar bangers looking for a change from the usual 8 ball
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participation
My comment about the Grapevine winners was just to indicate the broader attendance outside SWEL.
"All been said before" ? Excuse me, but don't reply if my comments or questions are redundant. I'll get the hint.
In SWEL's summer session they used to play 9-ball, granted play is on O/S 8 footers. 8-ball is on the same size table. State and Nationals is on 7 footers. Where am I going with this ? Not sure but it gripes me that we can't play on reasonable (Diamond) barboxes year round since they aren't going away at the big tourneys. It also gripes me that 9-ball is played in league and we can't do some extracurricular 9-ball events outside the summer league session.
Sorry for not separating SWAT from SWEL from Robert, but it is a fine line.
Sorry for soapboxing your thread too, but for 6 months the Oct. date said 9-ball on the swel website.
Bring some tables to Dallas rooms Bigtruck
I heard that is in the works.
My comment about the Grapevine winners was just to indicate the broader attendance outside SWEL.
"All been said before" ? Excuse me, but don't reply if my comments or questions are redundant.
I'll get the hint.In SWEL's summer session they used to play 9-ball, granted play is on O/S 8 footers. 8-ball is on the same size table. State and Nationals is on 7 footers. Where am I going with this ? Not sure but it gripes me that we can't play on reasonable (Diamond) barboxes year round since they aren't going away at the big tourneys. It also gripes me that 9-ball is played in league and we can't do some extracurricular 9-ball events outside the summer league session.
Sorry for not separating SWAT from SWEL from Robert, but it is a fine line.
Sorry for soapboxing your thread too, but for 6 months the Oct. date said 9-ball on the swel website.
Bring some tables to Dallas rooms Bigtruck
I heard that is in the works.
Well?
Do a search under Texas Open Players Tour and SWAT and almost all of this info was previously discussed.
Grapevine had the larger numbers from DFW. Doesn't matter if it's SWEL or something else, it's still DFW. The stop in Houston had a small number of Houston players.
The October event was billed as 9 ball but the decision was made to change it to 8. Probably a good decision since the majority of the TX BCAPL leagues are 8 ball.
We want as good a turnout as possible if this tournament is to continue.
This is not the best time to experiment with a format change. Once established maybe then it would be safer.
Lonestar_jim said:My comment about the Grapevine winners was just to indicate the broader attendance outside SWEL.
"All been said before" ? Excuse me, but don't reply if my comments or questions are redundant.
In SWEL's summer session they used to play 9-ball, granted play is on O/S 8 footers. 8-ball is on the same size table. State and Nationals is on 7 footers. Where am I going with this ? Not sure but it gripes me that we can't play on reasonable (Diamond) barboxes year round since they aren't going away at the big tourneys. It also gripes me that 9-ball is played in league and we can't do some extracurricular 9-ball events outside the summer league session.
Sorry for not separating SWAT from SWEL from Robert, but it is a fine line.
Sorry for soapboxing your thread too, but for 6 months the Oct. date said 9-ball on the swel website.
Bring some tables to Dallas rooms Bigtruck
I heard that is in the works.
Do a search under Texas Open Players Tour and SWAT and almost all of this info was previously discussed.
Grapevine had the larger numbers from DFW. Doesn't matter if it's SWEL or something else, it's still DFW. The stop in Houston had a small number of Houston players.
The October event was billed as 9 ball but the decision was made to change it to 8. Probably a good decision since the majority of the TX BCAPL leagues are 8 ball.
We want as good a turnout as possible if this tournament is to continue.
This is not the best time to experiment with a format change. Once established maybe then it would be safer.
Lastly, the BCA did away with the 9 Ball format for state and I heard rumors it may go away in the National b/c of decreasing numbers. You don't see 8 ball tourneys run on 9 footers and i don't think 9ball on a barbox draws much interest other than bar bangers looking for a change from the usual 8 ball.
I doubt that the 9-ball tourney at Nationals is going to end. They
have only ran it two years and I believe the numbers went up this
last year.
I doubt that the 9-ball tourney at Nationals is going to end. They
have only ran it two years and I believe the numbers went up this
last year.
Fun Bus
If 60% of the players are coming from the DFW area, maybe Robert could send a couple of party :joyful: buses from DFW down to Harker Heights and back on Sunday one in the morning, the other later on for a small fee? lol (I'm joking guys!)
uttahere:
If 60% of the players are coming from the DFW area, maybe Robert could send a couple of party :joyful: buses from DFW down to Harker Heights and back on Sunday one in the morning, the other later on for a small fee? lol (I'm joking guys!)
uttahere:
I'll Check On It
Are you offering to drive it
Maybe we can get you one of those uniforms like CPT Stuebing
from the Love Boat........gotta have those white shoes.
Is it a deal? :thumbup:
JK
Ricky F said:If 60% of the players are coming from the DFW area, maybe Robert could send a couple of party :joyful: buses from DFW down to Harker Heights and back on Sunday one in the morning, the other later on for a small fee? lol (I'm joking guys!)
Are you offering to drive it
Maybe we can get you one of those uniforms like CPT Stuebing
from the Love Boat........gotta have those white shoes.
Is it a deal? :thumbup:
JK
