Unknown Custom Cue?
- Thread starter steveL75121
- Start date
China import for sure
Thanks for your feedback. The butt is heavy like my older Meucci Originals and the shaft was over 4oz as well. Bob Meucci was coating cues in the 70's. It looks like a very old cue and seems light for weighing almost 21oz. I has a really nice hit.
That wrap was used in some 70s cues done by a few U.S. production houses- one of them was the H Betti company which is now known as Imperial Cues - they have been an import cue firm for a very long time now- Mr. Betti- long deceased- his great grandson runs the firm now- bought out the guy who had bought out Saul Rich ( Rich Cues - of NY not Abe Rich of Miami ( Star Cues); when it was still in NY and NJ. They assembled some cues here in the U.S for a while ., then switched to overseas.
That wrap with a weird coating was used on many of their cues, and the last cues assembled in the U.S. used woods left over from the original Rich Cue company- that may also explain why the wood was dense enough to have weight and balanced enough to feel somewhat custom.
For a while, when they first bought the company - they engraved the name H Betti on the cue butt cap. There are very few of those left- I gave the last one I found to MR. Betti's Grandson who runs Imperial now- he is a really nice guy. Mine was Rosewood with pearl inlays- 20/21 ounces and also hit very well- it was in mint condition and the Grandson did no own an H Betti cue.
My guess is that you have a later H Betti / early Imperial cue - during the transition to overseas the cues were not marked. Does it have a 5/16 18 or 5/16 14 joint? the weight bolt is also consistent with the early Imperial cues. Also- they were using those pearl dots on most of their transition cues- mine had them as well. Your cue is most probably a hybrid, using woods and parts left over from the Saul Rich era and assembled quite possibly in Asia, under H Betti/Imperial supervision. Please see my former H Betti cue here: Same WRAP.
That wrap with a weird coating was used on many of their cues, and the last cues assembled in the U.S. used woods left over from the original Rich Cue company- that may also explain why the wood was dense enough to have weight and balanced enough to feel somewhat custom.
For a while, when they first bought the company - they engraved the name H Betti on the cue butt cap. There are very few of those left- I gave the last one I found to MR. Betti's Grandson who runs Imperial now- he is a really nice guy. Mine was Rosewood with pearl inlays- 20/21 ounces and also hit very well- it was in mint condition and the Grandson did no own an H Betti cue.
My guess is that you have a later H Betti / early Imperial cue - during the transition to overseas the cues were not marked. Does it have a 5/16 18 or 5/16 14 joint? the weight bolt is also consistent with the early Imperial cues. Also- they were using those pearl dots on most of their transition cues- mine had them as well. Your cue is most probably a hybrid, using woods and parts left over from the Saul Rich era and assembled quite possibly in Asia, under H Betti/Imperial supervision. Please see my former H Betti cue here: Same WRAP.
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By the way, if you play with that cue and find that the wrap get "sticky" as you play from the sweat of your hands- it can be remedied. You can remove that sticky wrap overlay starting with 2000 sandpaper in a circular motion in direction of the wrap- NOT up and down motion. As you begin to see the wrap coating coming off- go over it in the same circular motion with a dry clean cotton cloth to remove the debris. You can move down to 1500 grit until the wrap remaining is just pure linen, no over coating.View attachment 713410
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Thank you so much for your feed back!
It didn't come with the bumper. It's a beautiful cue and even though the cue weighs almost 21 oz, it feels much lighter
and it's joint is 5/16 ×18 piloted joint (fits nicely and rolls pretty straight
Butt weighs 16.88oz and the shafts weighs 4.10oz
That's a very nice cue you have there!
It didn't come with the bumper. It's a beautiful cue and even though the cue weighs almost 21 oz, it feels much lighter
and it's joint is 5/16 ×18 piloted joint (fits nicely and rolls pretty straight
Butt weighs 16.88oz and the shafts weighs 4.10ozThat's a very nice cue you have there!
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5/16 18 then is also consistent with H Betti / Imperial cues - yes I do believe that you own a very early Imperial cue assembled in Asia with some leftover Rich cue parts and woods - everything about your cue is consistent - once they started using woods and parts sourced from Asia one did not see 21 ounce cues any longer from Imperial in that era. Your cue is more rare and IMO more valued to a very knowledgeable collector / not many of those left either
Yes, the point work appears clean, sharp, done by someone with training. The case is 70s era- looks like it has many attributes of a Fine Brothers cue case- they made cases for the Palmer Cue Company in NJ - would make sense given the time period that your cue was constructed.
I would love to see this cue in person, check out the woods, the balance, the work itself- please keep in mind if you would like to sell.
Regards, Mike
I would love to see this cue in person, check out the woods, the balance, the work itself- please keep in mind if you would like to sell.
Regards, Mike
I'll also lay odds that the case was bought with the cue- Saul Rich sold cue cases along with cues, H Betti certainly had some of those cases when he bought out Saul's partner. They were in the NYC area where Fine Brothers was making those cases for Palmer.
Just a word about H Betti himself- an early owner of bars after prohibition- he was smart enough to realize that putting pool tables in bars made a lot of business sense. His sons ran the firm after him- various gaming machines, etc. in bars- eventually got into pool cues when the Hustler movie exploded the pool scene- and to this day survives as Imperial! Still run by the family! Great American success story related to pool.
I loved finding that H Betti cue= it was a piece of the billiard boom in modern history in America- but I felt that it rightfully belonged to the young man running Imperial today - as he had never owned a cue with H Betti inscription. I offered him the cue as my compliments, and he was very appreciative in return- it is always good to see a cue end up where it really belongs.
Just a word about H Betti himself- an early owner of bars after prohibition- he was smart enough to realize that putting pool tables in bars made a lot of business sense. His sons ran the firm after him- various gaming machines, etc. in bars- eventually got into pool cues when the Hustler movie exploded the pool scene- and to this day survives as Imperial! Still run by the family! Great American success story related to pool.
I loved finding that H Betti cue= it was a piece of the billiard boom in modern history in America- but I felt that it rightfully belonged to the young man running Imperial today - as he had never owned a cue with H Betti inscription. I offered him the cue as my compliments, and he was very appreciative in return- it is always good to see a cue end up where it really belongs.
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It's funny to see how many shopgoodwill cues come up on here for identification.
Benelli
Well-known member
I think the takeaway here is paying $326 bucks for an Asian import cue on shopgoodwill.com is never a recipe for success...
Love that site, but you really really need to know what you're looking at. Hell, I paid $120 more than the OP and got a late 40s Wille Hoppe Pro with two shafts.
But for some reason these Asian cues with points and veneers just bring the bidders out and folks pump them up so fast without noticing any of the indicators that would point to a lower-end import.
Guilty as sin!
Love that site, but you really really need to know what you're looking at. Hell, I paid $120 more than the OP and got a late 40s Wille Hoppe Pro with two shafts.
But for some reason these Asian cues with points and veneers just bring the bidders out and folks pump them up so fast without noticing any of the indicators that would point to a lower-end import.
Benelli - Really? Did it make you feel superior to post the price I paid and where I got it? I just don't get people that have to ridicule others. I liked the cue so I bought it. It has a great hit. I have collected mostly Meucci Originals over the past 30 years. I was just curious about it. Wow, I'm surprised anyone would post a question on this forum with a response like that.
Where did he say that he paid $326? Did I miss something?