Vibration and its Effects?

Bluey2King

Bluey2King

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I would like to learn what effect Vibration has on cue sports. I see Limbsaver has a device to reduce Vibration and the new cue shaft Universal Smart Shaft.
If a cue tip is contact with the cueball for a tiny fraction of a second. What differance does it make if the cuestick is vibrating after the contact is made?
Can anyone help me understand this?
Thanks
 
Bluey2King said:
I would like to learn what effect Vibration has on cue sports. I see Limbsaver has a device to reduce Vibration and the new cue shaft Universal Smart Shaft.
If a cue tip is contact with the cueball for a tiny fraction of a second. What differance does it make if the cuestick is vibrating after the contact is made?
Can anyone help me understand this?
Thanks
Click to expand...

I'm not an expert but I do have some issues with this right now. In short way, "whatever you put in your cue/stroke" it will pass on the rock. It really does matter what cue does after hitting the cue ball. Important thing is to follow through when you execute a shot. Notice what some players do when they striking the rock. For example many players have really bad follow through. Almost on every shot they twist their arms or wrist or jump and at the same time their cue goes on a side after hitting cue ball. It seems like that would not have a effect on a shot but unfortunatelly it does. That is why important is to work on fundamentals of the game. Watch top snooker players (Steve Davis, Stephen Hendry and Allison Fisher) and they fundamentals and the way they stroke the cue ball.
 
Eh, yes and no. "It really does matter what [the] cue does after hitting the cue ball." --This is completely false. The only thing that a good follow through does it make sure that everything leading up to the moment of contact is fluid and consistent. Once contact is made, you can do anything you want the cue or your body/stroke/whatever and you'll not change the reaction of the cue ball.

Look at Julie Kelley -- a long follow through is something she will never have. She pokes the ball (and is even a snooker player!). Yet she'd give most men here a run for their money.

Look at Ismael (Morro) Paez -- he jumps up on every single shot, but it happens a fraction of a second after he's made contact with the ball. Even Efren has a tendency to stand up a bit after hitting the ball -- but only *after* hitting the ball.

I'm not saying good fundamentals shouldn't be established, but there's a lot of misconception about follow through, staying down, etc -- it in fact does nothing except make sure that you don't stray the cue off course, or decelerate on impact. It's more a precautionary measure than it is anything else.


BAZARUS said:
I'm not an expert but I do have some issues with this right now. In short way, "whatever you put in your cue/stroke" it will pass on the rock. It really does matter what cue does after hitting the cue ball. Important thing is to follow through when you execute a shot. Notice what some players do when they striking the rock. For example many players have really bad follow through. Almost on every shot they twist their arms or wrist or jump and at the same time their cue goes on a side after hitting cue ball. It seems like that would not have a effect on a shot but unfortunatelly it does. That is why important is to work on fundamentals of the game. Watch top snooker players (Steve Davis, Stephen Hendry and Allison Fisher) and they fundamentals and the way they stroke the cue ball.
Click to expand...
 
Bluey2King said:
... If a cue tip is contact with the cueball for a tiny fraction of a second. What differance does it make if the cuestick is vibrating after the contact is made?
...
Click to expand...
Essentially none, on that shot. The effect is actually on following shots.

Here's an example from my own experience. My cue stick developed a click. I tried checking the ferrule and joint. The shafts were solid. No rattle in the butt. My game descended into mediocrity. I was tensing up for each shot in preparation for the "tink." I finally discovered that the screw and washer that held the rubber bumper on were slightly loose, and the washer slapping back against the screw head was making the click. Problem solved. Free stroking restored. A slightly loose washer does not affect the mechanics of the hit. The click was happening after the ball had left the tip.

The real effect of the "pliable rubber butt extender" is in how the feedback from the hit of the cue is changed. I have only taken a few shots with one, but my suspicion is that if you are playing well with your current cue and are used to its feedback, this thing can't help you.
 
Bob Jewett said:
Essentially none, on that shot. The effect is actually on following shots.

Here's an example from my own experience. My cue stick developed a click. I tried checking the ferrule and joint. The shafts were solid. No rattle in the butt. My game descended into mediocrity. I was tensing up for each shot in preparation for the "tink." I finally discovered that the screw and washer that held the rubber bumper on were slightly loose, and the washer slapping back against the screw head was making the click. Problem solved. Free stroking restored. A slightly loose washer does not affect the mechanics of the hit. The click was happening after the ball had left the tip.

The real effect of the "pliable rubber butt extender" is in how the feedback from the hit of the cue is changed. I have only taken a few shots with one, but my suspicion is that if you are playing well with your current cue and are used to its feedback, this thing can't help you.
Click to expand...

Lets see if I have this right. If a cue was to Vibrate hard in ones hand. Then the shooter might tense up before contact anticapating the Vibration to come? So a device like limbs saver does work by smoothing out the feel for the shooter. I don't shoot archery but I could see hoe I would tence up anticapting the "Twang!" They seem to be a company that studys vibration and not a company that is just looking to produce a quick buck off pool players. I would guess that pool players is a pretty small market for them.

p.S. Bob what is the tips you prefer...I asked awhile back I need a tips soon I don't think I will bother with Moori.
Thanks
 
Bluey2King said:
I would like to learn what effect Vibration has
Click to expand...


My girlfiend loves it. :p


Like Bob Jewett said, I don't think it has much of a bearing on playability of a cue, other than how the cue "feels" to you.


Eric
 
Bluey2King said:
Lets see if I have this right. If a cue was to Vibrate hard in ones hand. Then the shooter might tense up before contact anticapating the Vibration to come? So a device like limbs saver does work by smoothing out the feel for the shooter. I don't shoot archery but I could see hoe I would tence up anticapting the "Twang!" They seem to be a company that studys vibration and not a company that is just looking to produce a quick buck off pool players. I would guess that pool players is a pretty small market for them.

p.S. Bob what is the tips you prefer...I asked awhile back I need a tips soon I don't think I will bother with Moori.
Thanks
Click to expand...
Some players claim they like a "harder" hit. I assume that means more vibration. Without having them pick out the "best" hit from a range of cues, it's hard to tell what this really means in terms of amount of vibration and maybe frequency of vibration.

As for tips, I just have the tip guy put on a LePro. I tried Mooris, but they didn't last long for what I was using them for, and I haven't tried them since I changed back to gentler shots.
 
drivermaker said:
Anybody have an idea of how much that bumper weighs compared to the normal one for any particular cue? It looks heavy.
Click to expand...
http://www.limbsaver.com/limbsaver/svlproducts/billiards/billiards.aspx
 
Bob Jewett said:
Some players claim they like a "harder" hit. I assume that means more vibration. Without having them pick out the "best" hit from a range of cues, it's hard to tell what this really means in terms of amount of vibration and maybe frequency of vibration.

As for tips, I just have the tip guy put on a LePro. I tried Mooris, but they didn't last long for what I was using them for, and I haven't tried them since I changed back to gentler shots.
Click to expand...

I wonder if there is a "standards" list somwhere... I kind of have a different label as far as hit goes...

Joint
Hard = fast rebound more resistant to compression (steel type)
Soft = slow rebound less resistant to compression (phenolic or wood type)

Shaft
Stiff = less cue vibration, (smaller faster movement)...less noticable..
Whippy = More cue vibration (larger slower movement) more noticable

Tip
Firm = Fast reound more resistant to compression
Soft = Slow rebound less resistant to compression


By the terminology above, I like a Soft / Stiff / Firm hit from a cue.
 
iconcue said:
i guess that means once "contact is made" it is lost in such a fraction of a second that a change won't affect the outcome?
Click to expand...

Yeah, but that being said, if there is a change a split second after then it would have had to start before contact and thus it could potentially affect the shot.
 
drivermaker said:
Anybody have an idea of how much that bumper weighs compared to the normal one for any particular cue? It looks heavy.
Click to expand...

Not Heavy at all, I would no different than stock bumpers. It is Very Springy I like the way it bounces the cue when holding and bouncing on the floor.

Folks may want check out "Limbsaver's" web site have pictures and study vibration
 
Look at Ismael (Morro) Paez -- he jumps up on every single shot, but it happens a fraction of a second after he's made contact with the ball. Even Efren has a tendency to stand up a bit after hitting the ball -- but only *after* hitting the ball.
Click to expand...

I don't think thats correct what you are saying here. Notice, that he (and other players that do the same thing) jumps exacly in the moment of stroke, not after the cue tip contact the rock. Whats the point of jumping after you made a shot anyway? That comes from improper fundamentals skills. Those players do not stay down on the shot and that causes most misses.
 
No, Morro jumps up a fraction of a second after contact. Have you watched him play before? And when Efren stands up after a shot (while still following through) he's already made contact before he does it.


BAZARUS said:
I don't think thats correct what you are saying here. Notice, that he (and other players that do the same thing) jumps exacly in the moment of stroke, not after the cue tip contact the rock. Whats the point of jumping after you made a shot anyway? That comes from improper fundamentals skills. Those players do not stay down on the shot and that causes most misses.
Click to expand...
 
Efren's stroke

StevenPWaldon said:
No, Morro jumps up a fraction of a second after contact. Have you watched him play before? And when Efren stands up after a shot (while still following through) he's already made contact before he does it.
Click to expand...

Here's a link to a slow mo video of Efren's stroke from a couple of different angles:

http://www.billiards-tv.jp/

It's a Japanese website. Click on the small, black, underlined text just above the big purple bar in the middle of this screen. **Learned how to post a picture, see below**
 

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