why the focus on ball aiming?

N

ndakotan

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
As far as skill in 8 ball, I'm very much a league player, no shortstop here. I can play well time to time, but do not put the time in necessary to play short-stop or better. I have limited access to reputable coaches/teachers, but I watch most videos and read most books on billiards. I love bank/kick systems, and understand the need for systems and feel/touch in banks. I think the byrnes videos, the beard videos, and the VEPS videos have had the most relatable information for me as far as how to play pool.

I have 2 issues to deal with. Stroking straight through the ball (I have grip issues and elbow/pendulum issues), and perception issues (I may not always perceive the direction my cue is aimed correctly relative to the ball). I do not believe I have issues with how the cue ball should hit the object ball to send the object ball in the desired direction. The fact that I can run an 8ball rack leads me to believe I can determine where to contact the ob with the cb relatively accurately enough to pocket balls, or even make some combo shots.

The marketable billiards self-help videos of late seem to be focusing on ball aiming and don't deal with fundamentals or perception. Watching my friends play, people seem to intuitively know where to hit the ball, most could place a ghost ball in the correct spot. I think there should be a distinction between ball aim systems, bank aim systems, ball/cue perception, and fundamentals and I am working on a way to demonstrate whether people can put the cuestick in the correct line and/or stroke the stick in the correct direction.

My theory is that people know what should be done, but some cannot perceive the correct line and most cannot deliver the cue straight enough to consistently make balls.

I'm interested in thoughts regarding ball aiming, aim perception, and fundamentals. What issues cause most people to miss shots more than others?
 
A couple of points:

A) the english you put on the CB does interact in the line the CB needs to follow and contact point in non-negligible ways. This changes what you perceive to the the right line from being the actual right line.

B) the fact you CAN run an 8-ball rack and don't do it more often is a symptom of concentration. This problem is often helped by spending more time thinking about the shot while standing up observing the table and less time thinking about the shot while down on it.
 
I personally love my aiming system because i can sight the shot quickly with confidence which allows me to concentrate on my stroke. An Aiming system is just a Method. I like to learn as many systems as i can. That way i have different points of the veiw. The target he is the same. I use ghost ball aiming, fractional aiming, reference point for what I call clicks,contact point aiming, i also adjust for cling time. I am blind in one eye and wear glasses. I think it's absolutely amazing I can play pool. Amy systems are like magnifying glasses.
 
Fundamentals is a big word, it encompasses so many things. Without this solid core, stroking straight becomes much harder. This can also engrain an array of bad habits.

If you can shoot straight, balls will eventually start dropping regardless of your aiming method. When things go bad, proper fundamentals also makes it easier to figure out what went wrong. Did you follow through? Did you stay down, etc, etc.
 
ndakotan said:
As far as skill in 8 ball, I'm very much a league player, no shortstop here. I can play well time to time, but do not put the time in necessary to play short-stop or better. I have limited access to reputable coaches/teachers, but I watch most videos and read most books on billiards. I love bank/kick systems, and understand the need for systems and feel/touch in banks. I think the byrnes videos, the beard videos, and the VEPS videos have had the most relatable information for me as far as how to play pool.

I have 2 issues to deal with. Stroking straight through the ball (I have grip issues and elbow/pendulum issues), and perception issues (I may not always perceive the direction my cue is aimed correctly relative to the ball). I do not believe I have issues with how the cue ball should hit the object ball to send the object ball in the desired direction. The fact that I can run an 8ball rack leads me to believe I can determine where to contact the ob with the cb relatively accurately enough to pocket balls, or even make some combo shots.

The marketable billiards self-help videos of late seem to be focusing on ball aiming and don't deal with fundamentals or perception. Watching my friends play, people seem to intuitively know where to hit the ball, most could place a ghost ball in the correct spot. I think there should be a distinction between ball aim systems, bank aim systems, ball/cue perception, and fundamentals and I am working on a way to demonstrate whether people can put the cuestick in the correct line and/or stroke the stick in the correct direction.

My theory is that people know what should be done, but some cannot perceive the correct line and most cannot deliver the cue straight enough to consistently make balls.

I'm interested in thoughts regarding ball aiming, aim perception, and fundamentals. What issues cause most people to miss shots more than others?
Click to expand...

It is VERY hard to get your body in a proper stance, with cue alignment that works for you without having someone watch what you do. An instructional video may get you started with the general idea of how to stand and line up your shoulder, elbow wrist and head, but only someone that knows what they are doing can help you do that on the table.

In my case, I was missing many shots because what I would see as the aiming point was just a few mm off due to my head not being in the right position to view the shot. For most beginners and intermediate players, WHERE to aim causes as many misses as a flaw in hitting the cue ball. For advanced players, actually making contact with that spot causes more issues, that's what it seems to me at least. And was the case with me. Once I moved my head about 1/2 inch I was able to pocket straight and slight angled shots a lot better, but my cut shots of 25% or more really suffered. I am still trying to make cut shots well while in the new stance.
 
ndakotan said:
As far as skill in 8 ball, I'm very much a league player, no shortstop here. I can play well time to time, but do not put the time in necessary to play short-stop or better. I have limited access to reputable coaches/teachers, but I watch most videos and read most books on billiards. I love bank/kick systems, and understand the need for systems and feel/touch in banks. I think the byrnes videos, the beard videos, and the VEPS videos have had the most relatable information for me as far as how to play pool.

I have 2 issues to deal with. Stroking straight through the ball (I have grip issues and elbow/pendulum issues), and perception issues (I may not always perceive the direction my cue is aimed correctly relative to the ball). I do not believe I have issues with how the cue ball should hit the object ball to send the object ball in the desired direction. The fact that I can run an 8ball rack leads me to believe I can determine where to contact the ob with the cb relatively accurately enough to pocket balls, or even make some combo shots.

The marketable billiards self-help videos of late seem to be focusing on ball aiming and don't deal with fundamentals or perception. Watching my friends play, people seem to intuitively know where to hit the ball, most could place a ghost ball in the correct spot. I think there should be a distinction between ball aim systems, bank aim systems, ball/cue perception, and fundamentals and I am working on a way to demonstrate whether people can put the cuestick in the correct line and/or stroke the stick in the correct direction.

My theory is that people know what should be done, but some cannot perceive the correct line and most cannot deliver the cue straight enough to consistently make balls.

I'm interested in thoughts regarding ball aiming, aim perception, and fundamentals. What issues cause most people to miss shots more than others?
Click to expand...

8 ball, 14.1, and one pocket are games that give more options as far as position play; therefore, we tend to take an easy shot to get to make another easy shot; often we do not shoot with fast or very fast speed unless we are stuck for position, or are hitting an easy shot hard to get position; on the other hand, 9, and 10 are games where you must get position on next ball, and at times you have to shoot hard off angle shots fast, soft, medium, all kind of shots to try to get shape. So IMO if you are good in 9, and 10 ball games (i mean you run two racks or more often under pressure) then you are good in pool, your aim, stroke, knowledge are solid. Are you good in these games? if not, and you are trying to learn pool, quit playing 8 ball, it is bad to your pool game, practice all 4000 shots possibilities, and only when you graduate move to 9 ball.

As far as aim, for those short 1/2 ball cuts and less shots, knowing where to aim is 1/3 the battle, knowing how to aim is the other 1/3, going down on the shot, prewarm up routine, and stroke is the other 1/3rd.

The unfortunate truth no one have good tool for those long, more than 1/2 ball cut, where your peripheral vision, focus, concentration which are body chemicals dependents, changes from day to day, and all three items for less than 1/2 ball above are required to make such shots; sure some system utilize english, but that too adds another variable that has to be adjusted to for every shot.

Some people on AZB say do not think too much, just go down and shoot; i have bad news for them, if you serious about the game, looking for consistency in pocketing, and not just a banger, then you better think and quickly run through the check list for those harder shots, not only to make them, but also know why you miss them.

Best of luck.
 
Cause its just so much easier to put an aiming system in a pretty little box with a bow on it and sell as the answer to all your problems.
 
ndakotan said:
My theory is that people know what should be done, but some cannot perceive the correct line and most cannot deliver the cue straight enough to consistently make balls.

I'm interested in thoughts regarding ball aiming, aim perception, and fundamentals. What issues cause most people to miss shots more than others?
Click to expand...

You pretty much said it. Even if you know where to aim, most of us can't perfectly deliver the cue ball to that spot under every condition (using spin, on the rail, different cue, whatever). Perfect delivery is much more challenging than finding the right place to aim, otherwise we'd never miss straight in shots, even from far away.

Find me a guy who makes a certain long straight in 9/10 times, vs. another guy who only makes it 7/10, and I can virtually guarantee you the first guy also cuts balls better from a variety of angles. There's no aiming trick the second guy can use that will let him pocket balls better than someone with far better fundamentals.

Arguably, a lot of instructional material put the focus on the wrong part...
they figure "you need to know where you're aiming before you start worrying about
delivering it there every time"

...but really it should be "Make sure you can send the ball where you want every time.
Then worry about figuring out where you want to send it".
 
CreeDo said:
You pretty much said it. Even if you know where to aim, most of us can't perfectly deliver the cue ball to that spot under every condition (using spin, on the rail, different cue, whatever). Perfect delivery is much more challenging than finding the right place to aim, otherwise we'd never miss straight in shots, even from far away.

Find me a guy who makes a certain long straight in 9/10 times, vs. another guy who only makes it 7/10, and I can virtually guarantee you the first guy also cuts balls better from a variety of angles. There's no aiming trick the second guy can use that will let him pocket balls better than someone with far better fundamentals.

Arguably, a lot of instructional material put the focus on the wrong part...
they figure "you need to know where you're aiming before you start worrying about
delivering it there every time"

...but really it should be "Make sure you can send the ball where you want every time.
Then worry about figuring out where you want to send it".
Click to expand...




Ain't that the truth!

randyg
 
CreeDo said:
You pretty much said it. Even if you know where to aim, most of us can't perfectly deliver the cue ball to that spot under every condition (using spin, on the rail, different cue, whatever). Perfect delivery is much more challenging than finding the right place to aim, otherwise we'd never miss straight in shots, even from far away.

Find me a guy who makes a certain long straight in 9/10 times, vs. another guy who only makes it 7/10, and I can virtually guarantee you the first guy also cuts balls better from a variety of angles. There's no aiming trick the second guy can use that will let him pocket balls better than someone with far better fundamentals.

Arguably, a lot of instructional material put the focus on the wrong part...
they figure "you need to know where you're aiming before you start worrying about
delivering it there every time"

...but really it should be "Make sure you can send the ball where you want every time.
Then worry about figuring out where you want to send it".
Click to expand...

I partially agree with what you saying, it seems that cb direction is the cause of the miss 99.5% of times for 1/2 ball cut or less short distance shots (OB within 2-3 diamonds from pocket, CB 3-5 diamonds away from OB), for 1/2 ball or less cuts where cb is about 3-4 diamonds from ob, and ob is 3-4 diamonds from pocket, seem to be 70% cb direction, 30% aim, for more than 1/2 ball cuts long shots it is 90% aim, 10% direction, (by long i mean distance between ob and pocket, of which CB travel is not more than a diamond or 2 at the most, of which change of cb direction might not impact pocketing as much).
Worst shots are ob at center of table, and cb near top rail with sever cut angle, this i think 50/50 aim cb direction very hard to make.
 
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