Secrets!

JoeyA · Aug 17, 2011

I had a conversation with someone recently who mentioned that the professional pool players will tell you many things that will help your game but that there are some "secrets" that you will never pry from their minds.

This is obviously true and it has been my personal experience as well. I once asked Ralf Souquet what his technique was for maintaining composure and he said he would only reveal that only after his days of competition are over. I can understand that and I'm sure many of you can as well.

There are other things (secrets) that top players know that some of us don't know but I suspect that some secrets are idiosyncratic and may not be as valuable to others as they are for the person who thinks it is "the secret" to their success.

I think we all learn particular things which help our game but that they are relative to us as individuals. Sure, those unique things that we do to help us pocket balls might help others but not always. I haven't tested my theory out on any of the professional players but I would almost bet that they do unusual things to help them pocket balls but may be too embarassed to tell others how they perceive or execute the shots because it isn't in the books.

We all know that if it isn't in the books, then it can't be right.

Mitchxout · Aug 17, 2011

I have a secret but I'm not telling....I think I remember that line from kindergarten?

JarnoV · Aug 17, 2011

JoeyA said:
I think we all learn particular things which help our game but that they are relative to us as individuals. Sure, those unique things that we do to help us pocket balls might help others but not always. I haven't tested my theory out on any of the professional players but I would almost bet that they do unusual things to help them pocket balls but may be too embarassed to tell others how they perceive or execute the shots because it isn't in the books. We all know that if it isn't in the books, then it can't be right.

I think another factor here is that it's so difficult to describe verbally things that you learn in a physical activity such as pool billiards. There are things that you could say, but you realize that they might sound banal and trivial when said out loud.

I think a good example is the concept of relaxed arm. I think it's safe to say that most people agree that it's best to keep arm relaxed when shooting. But term itself is pretty much meaningless. If your hand is completely relaxed, the cue stick will fall to ground. Of course, saying that the hand has to be relaxed, can give some guidance to a newcomer, but eventually everyone has to find just the right level of relaxedness themselves (or, everyone's brain has to figure that out).

The deeper you go, the more difficult it becomes to verbally describe the things you've learned.

John Brumback · Aug 17, 2011

JoeyA said:
I had a conversation with someone recently who mentioned that the professional pool players will tell you many things that will help your game but that there are some "secrets" that you will never pry from their minds.

This is obviously true and it has been my personal experience as well. I once asked Ralf Souquet what his technique was for maintaining composure and he said he would only reveal that only after his days of competition are over. I can understand that and I'm sure many of you can as well.

There are other things (secrets) that top players know that some of us don't know but I suspect that some secrets are idiosyncratic and may not be as valuable to others as they are for the person who thinks it is "the secret" to their success.

I think we all learn particular things which help our game but that they are relative to us as individuals. Sure, those unique things that we do to help us pocket balls might help others but not always. I haven't tested my theory out on any of the professional players but I would almost bet that they do unusual things to help them pocket balls but may be too embarassed to tell others how they perceive or execute the shots because it isn't in the books. We all know that if it isn't in the books, then it can't be right.

Hey Joey A,I'll trade you a few real good ones about banks If you'll stake me at the slots next time.If you don't I'll take them to my grave.So there ya go.John B.

grindz · Aug 17, 2011

JoeyA said:
I had a conversation with someone recently who mentioned that the professional pool players will tell you many things that will help your game but that there are some "secrets" that you will never pry from their minds.

This is obviously true and it has been my personal experience as well. I once asked Ralf Souquet what his technique was for maintaining composure and he said he would only reveal that only after his days of competition are over. I can understand that and I'm sure many of you can as well.

There are other things (secrets) that top players know that some of us don't know but I suspect that some secrets are idiosyncratic and may not be as valuable to others as they are for the person who thinks it is "the secret" to their success.

I think we all learn particular things which help our game but that they are relative to us as individuals. Sure, those unique things that we do to help us pocket balls might help others but not always. I haven't tested my theory out on any of the professional players but I would almost bet that they do unusual things to help them pocket balls but may be too embarassed to tell others how they perceive or execute the shots because it isn't in the books. We all know that if it isn't in the books, then it can't be right.

If there are any D players out there that want to know.......

My "secret" is Beer!!!!!

There I said it out loud, for all to hear. I now feel better with
that weight off my shoulders. Some 'secrets' are just SO hard
to keep to yourself that it just eats you up inside.

td

JAM · Aug 17, 2011

grindz said:
If there are any D players out there that want to know.......

My "secret" is Beer!!!!!

There I said it out loud, for all to hear. I now feel better with
that weight off my shoulders. Some 'secrets' are just SO hard
to keep to yourself that it just eats you up inside.

td

I know another pool player who would agree with you 100 percent. While everybody else has H20 bottles by their designated tables, this player has a brown bottle with a red-and-white label on his designated table. Never leaves home without it! :grin:

sfleinen · Aug 17, 2011

JAM said:
I know another pool player who would agree with you 100 percent. While everybody else has H20 bottles by their designated tables, this player has a brown bottle with a red-and-white label on his designated table. Never leaves home without it! :grin:

Jamweiser, eh? <...Sean blowing raspberries...> You need to have that player change that label to Jam Adams, or something along those lines with real taste.

-Sean <-- Porter- and Guinness-drinkin' foo'. "The beers Ether is workin' up to and practicin' for."

cookie man · Aug 17, 2011

JAM said:
I know another pool player who would agree with you 100 percent. While everybody else has H20 bottles by their designated tables, this player has a brown bottle with a red-and-white label on his designated table. Never leaves home without it! :grin:

Jam, seriously, ask Kieth if this is true. he doesn't have to relay any secrets just a yes or no for now. Thanks

Sarnia Shorty · Aug 17, 2011

grindz said:
If there are any D players out there that want to know.......

My "secret" is Beer!!!!!

There I said it out loud, for all to hear. I now feel better with
that weight off my shoulders. Some 'secrets' are just SO hard
to keep to yourself that it just eats you up inside.

td

Grindz... who'd have thought we were both keeping the same secret. I am a little disapointed you let the cat out of the bag, now I won't be able to beat anyone. :thumbup:

ShootingArts · Aug 17, 2011

just realized you are right!

grindz said:
If there are any D players out there that want to know.......

My "secret" is Beer!!!!!

There I said it out loud, for all to hear. I now feel better with
that weight off my shoulders. Some 'secrets' are just SO hard
to keep to yourself that it just eats you up inside.

td

You are right! My game has never been the same since I quit drinking a half case or so of beer a night. I came back to pool as a nondrinker, gotta be what is wrong with my game. Come to think of it the girls aren't as pretty either . . . For the good of pool and mankind I think I'm going to have to go back to drinking beer!

Hu

onepocketron · Aug 17, 2011

I took a few lessons from a well know pro and he showed me a couple of "gems" that if no one shows you, the average or even above average player would never come to know. It wasn't the big things he showed me that made it worth the lessons, it was those small "gems" he would reveal every lesson. Of course he asked me not to tell anyone.:smile:
His reasoning behind not telling was that I "paid" for the information in the way of purchasing the lessons, and if others wanted to know, they could pay him for a lesson just like I did. It wasn't anything more than a business request VS some hidden and secret cult thing with pool players. I did honor his request.:thumbup:

BarneyCalip · Aug 17, 2011

The secret to banking

Hal Mix told me one day I was a One Pocket player and to come over his house on Constitution Avenue in San Jose. He told me there was a secret to banking and he would tell it to me the secret after six lessons in two week intervals.

First week was the basic formula for banking. Well, I was amazed and after 6 hours of banking, I was chomping at the bit for the secret. I have my own table 1923 Madison Brunswick Balke Collender with 1 1/2 inch slate with tight pockets. I played every day for 6 hours banking. 2nd lesson was the Mirror System, man it worked great. 3rd lesson was low left, I was to hit every ball with low left, 4th Lesson high Left. 5th lesson was low right. 6th lesson was high right. Man I was banking everything in sight, I kept begging Hal to tell me the secret but he wouldn’t.

Finally the day came and I was higher than a kite. I practiced for an hour and Hal finally came in. Barney, I am going to tell you the secret. Hal said “Don’t Aim”. I said what that’s the most ridiculous thing I ever heard. He looked at me with that stern face of his and said. Barney you have always known how to bank. Don’t think and let it go. Well for the next several months, I never missed a ball. I would pick up Hal every day and off we would go to play pool.

Hal left shortly to hook up with some kid back east, Nick Varner.

Yes, “the secret was don’t aim”.

I kept trying to figure out if it was something else. Was it because of all the practice? Was it because of Hal’s presence when I practiced? Was it because I wasn’t playing pool but feverishly working at it? My wife would comment how can someone sweat so much walking around the table.

Hal taught me other secrets but that is for another day. Rest in Peace Hal, Barney :smile:

leehayes · Aug 17, 2011

onepocketron said:
I took a few lessons from a well know pro and he showed me a couple of "gems" that if no one shows you, the average or even above average player would never come to know. It wasn't the big things he showed me that made it worth the lessons, it was those small "gems" he would reveal every lesson. Of course he asked me not to tell anyone.:smile:
His reasoning behind not telling was that I "paid" for the information in the way of purchasing the lessons, and if others wanted to know, they could pay him for a lesson just like I did. It wasn't anything more than a business request VS some hidden and secret cult thing with pool players. I did honor his request.:thumbup:

you could at least reveal his name so we would know who to get the lesson from!! Or is that your little secret....

C.Milian · Aug 17, 2011

JoeyA said:
We all know that if it isn't in the books, then it can't be right.

They still hang people for doing extraordinary things such as giving away a 5000$ pool secret.

It'll go something like this:

"Hey you know it's better if you you do it this way, you'll get better results, I've paid my instructor $5000 to get to this point, and trust me this is the correct way to do it."

Reply:

"Well, that dose not make any sense. Maybe you should tell your instructor to eat a shoe.....oh, you wanna try out this product? since you happen to be here anyways? It'll only take a minute for me to explain all my bullshit in full detail"

(Value for a non value)

poolhustler · Aug 17, 2011

JoeyA said:
I had a conversation with someone recently who mentioned that the professional pool players will tell you many things that will help your game but that there are some "secrets" that you will never pry from their minds.

This is obviously true and it has been my personal experience as well. I once asked Ralf Souquet what his technique was for maintaining composure and he said he would only reveal that only after his days of competition are over. I can understand that and I'm sure many of you can as well.

There are other things (secrets) that top players know that some of us don't know but I suspect that some secrets are idiosyncratic and may not be as valuable to others as they are for the person who thinks it is "the secret" to their success.

I think we all learn particular things which help our game but that they are relative to us as individuals. Sure, those unique things that we do to help us pocket balls might help others but not always. I haven't tested my theory out on any of the professional players but I would almost bet that they do unusual things to help them pocket balls but may be too embarassed to tell others how they perceive or execute the shots because it isn't in the books. We all know that if it isn't in the books, then it can't be right.

Didn't you post this same thing a year ago?? Maybe it was someone else, but I remember a thread jus tlike this one.

scottjen26 · Aug 17, 2011

Barney, those types of "tips" are so true. Not really secrets per se - we all know how to make balls, bank, standard position plays and theory, at least to varying degrees. Nothing is going to make you magically play mistake-free pool except lots and lots of repetition and practice.

But it's those intangibles, some of which are true and some of which are just opinions or feelings to get you to do the right thin, that I think the top players know or have figured out along the way that they are hesitant to divulge openly.

I just broke out of my mini-slump I've been on for the last month yesterday by doing exactly what you said, not aiming. More specifically, not trying to be so precise about aiming and my PSR and everything else I've been working on since Feb/Mar. I just let it flow, allowed extra time or aiming where needed, and what do you know, rack after rack just dropping into the holes. Now if I can only remember that for next time...

Scott

JoeyA · Aug 17, 2011

JBKY said:
Hey Joey A,I'll trade you a few real good ones about banks If you'll stake me at the slots next time.If you don't I'll take them to my grave.So there ya go.John B.

LOL. Good one John!

3andstop · Aug 17, 2011

JoeyA said:
I would almost bet that they do unusual things to help them pocket balls but may be too embarassed to tell others how they perceive or execute the shots because it isn't in the books. We all know that if it isn't in the books, then it can't be right.

I absolutely agree ... we all have those little ways of gaining confidence with certain shots. I'd be embarrassed to talk about the popcorn stroke, or the smoothy, or the static aim, dynamic confirmation stroke .... (that's a good one)

or the popeye stroke for that matter.

Here's another guy that plays some and won't tell ....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKvhVssO348&playnext=1&list=PLAD7D205254DEF5A0

JoeyA · Aug 17, 2011

BarneyCalip said:
Hal Mix told me one day I was a One Pocket player and to come over his house on Constitution Avenue in San Jose. He told me there was a secret to banking and he would tell it to me the secret after six lessons in two week intervals.

First week was the basic formula for banking. Well, I was amazed and after 6 hours of banking, I was chomping at the bit for the secret. I have my own table 1923 Madison Brunswick Balke Collender with 1 1/2 inch slate with tight pockets. I played every day for 6 hours banking. 2nd lesson was the Mirror System, man it worked great. 3rd lesson was low left, I was to hit every ball with low left, 4th Lesson high Left. 5th lesson was low right. 6th lesson was high right. Man I was banking everything in sight, I kept begging Hal to tell me the secret but he wouldn’t.

Finally the day came and I was higher than a kite. I practiced for an hour and Hal finally came in. Barney, I am going to tell you the secret. Hal said “Don’t Aim”. I said what that’s the most ridiculous thing I ever heard. He looked at me with that stern face of his and said. Barney you have always known how to bank. Don’t think and let it go. Well for the next several months, I never missed a ball. I would pick up Hal every day and off we would go to play pool.

Hal left shortly to hook up with some kid back east, Nick Varner.

Yes, “the secret was don’t aim”.

I kept trying to figure out if it was something else. Was it because of all the practice? Was it because of Hal’s presence when I practiced? Was it because I wasn’t playing pool but feverishly working at it? My wife would comment how can someone sweat so much walking around the table.

Hal taught me other secrets but that is for another day. Rest in Peace Hal, Barney :smile:

I remember Hal. Somewhere in my pool book collection (which got scattered after Hurricane Katrina) is a copy of Hal's book with his signature. He corrected me and told me that he did not teach Nick Varner how to play pool but that he traveled with him and on occasion he would coach Nick. It's been years since that conversation but Hal seemed to be a really nice guy.

Perhaps, the next time that Nick comes to town to eat Willie May's Scotch House Chicken I will ask him to talk for a long time about Hal Mix. I would love to know more about Hal and not just his "secrets". :smile:

Thanks!

jimmyg · Aug 17, 2011

Isn't there the classic conversation?:

Player A: He taught me everything that I know.

Player B: Yes I did, but not everything that I know. :smile:

J

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