Secrets!

[JoeyA]

Didn't you post this same thing a year ago?? Maybe it was someone else, but I remember a thread jus tlike this one.

Most likely. I know I have talked about "secrets" and Ralf Souquet's special "secret" before. Some people never tire of talking about "secrets".

If I hadn't started this thread I might never have known the interesting things about Hal Mix.

I guess I find it interesting to see how the answers to these threads change in time, with new and old posters answering them with current replies.

Your memory is probably spot on.

 

[lfigueroa]

I had a conversation with someone recently who mentioned that the professional pool players will tell you many things that will help your game but that there are some "secrets" that you will never pry from their minds.

This is obviously true and it has been my personal experience as well. I once asked Ralf Souquet what his technique was for maintaining composure and he said he would only reveal that only after his days of competition are over. I can understand that and I'm sure many of you can as well.

There are other things (secrets) that top players know that some of us don't know but I suspect that some secrets are idiosyncratic and may not be as valuable to others as they are for the person who thinks it is "the secret" to their success.

I think we all learn particular things which help our game but that they are relative to us as individuals. Sure, those unique things that we do to help us pocket balls might help others but not always. I haven't tested my theory out on any of the professional players but I would almost bet that they do unusual things to help them pocket balls but may be too embarassed to tell others how they perceive or execute the shots because it isn't in the books. We all know that if it isn't in the books, then it can't be right.

I believe there are two kinds of secrets out there: some are shot specific (like a 1pocket bank Freddy the Beard showed me when I took a lesson with him and made my peepers open up wide). And then there are those secrets that, while they might have value to others, are more idiosyncratic to the player. These secrets revolve around their PSR and being able to always produce an accurate stroke, day-in-day-out, for all kinds of shots, and under all kinds of pressure. These would be the toughest to pry loose

Lou Figueroa

 

[lfigueroa]

Hal said “Don’t Aim”. I said what that’s the most ridiculous thing I ever heard. He looked at me with that stern face of his and said. Barney you have always known how to bank. Don’t think and let it go. Well for the next several months, I never missed a ball.

You just gave a half a dozen hardcore CTErs heart attacks.

Lou Figueroa

 

[Pushout]

Isn't there the classic conversation?:

Player A: He taught me everything that I know.

Player B: Yes I did, but not everything that I know. :smile:

J

Yeah, from the movie The Baltimore Bullet.

 

[Pushout]

You just gave a half a dozen hardcore CTErs heart attacks.

Lou Figueroa

Gulp, wheeze, ack, sputter, ad infinitum.

 

[Pushout]

I've had, for me, an ephifeny of sorts. It's something I've mentioned before and been flamed a bit for it being rediculous. I hesitate to share it:embarrassed2:
And, no Lou, it's NOT CTE!

 

[sfleinen]

I've had, for me, an ephifeny of sorts. It's something I've mentioned before and been flamed a bit for it being rediculous. I hesitate to share it:embarrassed2:
And, no Lou, it's NOT CTE!

Let me guess, Pushout. You discovered that Irish Linen wrap... SUCKS?!?



(Sorry, couldn't resist that one. )

J/K,
-Sean

 

[hang-the-9]

Hal Mix told me one day I was a One Pocket player and to come over his house on Constitution Avenue in San Jose. He told me there was a secret to banking and he would tell it to me the secret after six lessons in two week intervals.

First week was the basic formula for banking. Well, I was amazed and after 6 hours of banking, I was chomping at the bit for the secret. I have my own table 1923 Madison Brunswick Balke Collender with 1 1/2 inch slate with tight pockets. I played every day for 6 hours banking. 2nd lesson was the Mirror System, man it worked great. 3rd lesson was low left, I was to hit every ball with low left, 4th Lesson high Left. 5th lesson was low right. 6th lesson was high right. Man I was banking everything in sight, I kept begging Hal to tell me the secret but he wouldn’t.

Finally the day came and I was higher than a kite. I practiced for an hour and Hal finally came in. Barney, I am going to tell you the secret. Hal said “Don’t Aim”. I said what that’s the most ridiculous thing I ever heard. He looked at me with that stern face of his and said. Barney you have always known how to bank. Don’t think and let it go. Well for the next several months, I never missed a ball. I would pick up Hal every day and off we would go to play pool.

Hal left shortly to hook up with some kid back east, Nick Varner.

Yes, “the secret was don’t aim”.

I kept trying to figure out if it was something else. Was it because of all the practice? Was it because of Hal’s presence when I practiced? Was it because I wasn’t playing pool but feverishly working at it? My wife would comment how can someone sweat so much walking around the table.

Hal taught me other secrets but that is for another day. Rest in Peace Hal, Barney :smile:

This is the same lesson as "Wax the car! Paint the fence". Mr. Miagi knew the secret also. Train train train to do one thing, then you will learn to do it automatically.

 

[Pushout]

Let me guess, Pushout. You discovered that Irish Linen wrap... SUCKS?!?



(Sorry, couldn't resist that one. )

J/K,
-Sean

Sean, are you coming to the Open? I'll show you how slippery my linen wrap is

 

[cookie man]

You just gave a half a dozen hardcore CTErs heart attacks.

Lou Figueroa

See just exactly what you guys dont get about cte. It helps me by giving me something concrete to look at, instead of guessing where to hit, but then everything is still the same, let it go- let it flow.

 

[sfleinen]

Sean, are you coming to the Open? I'll show you how slippery my linen wrap is

<...Sean doin' the MacCauley Culkins Home Alone "Yesssssss!" fist pump...>

You might've seen a good-natured ribbing offered by "Kickin' Chicken" (Brian) to Canucks "pt109" and "Blue Hog ridr" concerning a "Team USA vs Team Canada" challenge down there at the Open. (The winning Team USA, looking forward to their steak dinner, will consist of Brian and myself. The goes-without-saying-vanquished Team Canada, with their plastic already displaced from their wallets [placed on the dinner table for the waiter to pick up with the tab], will consist of the aforementioned pt109 and Blue Hog ridr.)

I'm going to do my best to make it down there. It might have to be a weekend-only visit for me, since, at that time, I'll still be in the middle of third-quarter project closeouts for my job (incredibly busy), and may not be able to take many days off. But I'll definitely try to move mountains to make it down there. After all, how can I pass-up a free steak dinner?

-Sean

P.S.: you keep those slippery linen wraps to yourself!

 

[cookie man]

Well for the next several months, I never missed a ball.

If a CTE player said this than this thread would reach 40 or 50 pages with 5 naysayers dominating the posts.

Anyway, glad the lesson worked out for the OP.

 

[Sam Waltz]

Secrets

Those inherent "secrets" are what my friend Darren calls "the one up". He's showed me MANY things, but always said that he'd never tell me all he knows 'cause that would give me "the one up" on him and he just couldn't have that! LOL

P.S. - Please don't take my humor as disrespect, as I have been blessed to be surrounded by some of the most talented players around and I'm MUCHO appreciative to what they've taught me. I just think it's funny that Darren even has a phrase for those deeper secrets that we're talking about here. The "ONE UP" is for REAL folks, believe that! Nobody is ever done learning...

 

[irock]

Anyone who believes, some of the Pros do not know a few little extra things are kidding themselves. Once you are told one of them, or figure it out on your own, and it works immediately for you, and continues to work, it causes you to dig for more nuggets. And to quote the previous poster, it does give you a one up, and you know it. I think the game has really changed over the years, and some of the things you were instructed to do then, have changed. I could show the guys on my league team, some things that would really improve their game, but then they switch teams and tell someone and then they tell someone else, then you are in a tournament getting beat by something you passed on.

 

[Mr441]

It's interesting to note the difference between pool players and billiard players in regards to secrets. Pool players seem to heavily guard their little secrets whereas billiard players are the complete opposite. Top Billiard players openly share all their secrets and knowlegde with each other and anyone else for that matter. A top player will discover something for the first time and will immediately show everyone else and those players might use it in a different way and then show what he learned.

 

[JoeyA]

Anyone who believes, some of the Pros do not know a few little extra things are kidding themselves. Once you are told one of them, or figure it out on your own, and it works immediately for you, and continues to work, it causes you to dig for more nuggets. And to quote the previous poster, it does give you a one up, and you know it. I think the game has really changed over the years, and some of the things you were instructed to do then, have changed. I could show the guys on my league team, some things that would really improve their game, but then they switch teams and tell someone and then they tell someone else, then you are in a tournament getting beat by something you passed on.

I've always thought of the pool world as a pie as far as "secrets" are concerned. If by sharing "secrets" I can help to make the pie larger and taste better, there will be more slices for me and others to partake.

Also, when you share a pool "secret", it "MAY" enhance another person's play and that person may come back to beat you at a later date but that should only foster increased resolve on your part to give you impetus to work even harder, to better your game.

The sad truth is that most people are too lazy to put in the time that it takes to learn how to execute the knowledge that they already have. Don't worry, most people aren't even "listening" to the secrets. :smilewinkgrin:

 

[JoeyA]

It is interesting...............

It's interesting to note the difference between pool players and billiard players in regards to secrets. Pool players seem to heavily guard their little secrets whereas billiard players are the complete opposite. Top Billiard players openly share all their secrets and knowlegde with each other and anyone else for that matter. A top player will discover something for the first time and will immediately show everyone else and those players might use it in a different way and then show what he learned.

Some pool players do it for the money.
Some pool players do it for the love.
Most billiard players seem to do it for the love.

 

[Blue Hog ridr]

Thats pretty presumptuous of you Sean.
You haven't seen PT and myself play yet.

Besides, if PT and myself are not able to make it, we will be issuing invitations to the Clash of the Titans ll next year in Toronto.

No one has told me the format yet. Are we playing singles, Scotch or what.
Anyway, I don't mind springing for steak and beer as long as we have a good time, which I am sure we will.

This has the potential to turn into either a every second year thing or at the very least, a Bucket List meeting.

 

[sfleinen]

Thats pretty presumptuous of you Sean.
You haven't seen PT and myself play yet.

Besides, if PT and myself are not able to make it, we will be issuing invitations to the Clash of the Titans ll next year in Toronto.

No one has told me the format yet. Are we playing singles, Scotch or what.
Anyway, I don't mind springing for steak and beer as long as we have a good time, which I am sure we will.

This has the potential to turn into either a every second year thing or at the very least, a Bucket List meeting.

<...giggling...>

Well Terry, Brian asked me to stir the pot a bit, so I dropped a bunker buster. Perhaps that was a bit of overkill -- maybe a simple shaped charge was enough? Or perhaps an M-80 / cherry bomb? I'm kinda handy with those, especially with carcasses... I mean... deer carcasses.

Regardless, I think this is going to be fun, no matter what happens. Get a steak dinner and a couple pints of Guinness in me, and I'm a happy camper.

As for format, I'm thinking a multi-discipline format -- say, some 10-ball (the real call-pocket rules, not any of this T.E. crap), short-rack banks, and maybe some one pocket? We can either do teams, or scotch doubles. We have time, though, to determine the format.

I echo your thoughts on what it could morph into, years down the road.

Cool stuff -- I'm looking forward!
-Sean

 

[JoeW]

I think that most of the “secrets” can be learned by simply watching the pros very closely. For instance, ever notice how many of them shift their weight to the front foot for a power break? Ever see the grip tighten up for some shots and not others? Close observation tells many things. Why do many pros have such a long bridge when the opposite is taught by many instructors?

Sure there are probably a few closely held secrets for some special shot here and there. Even Freddy the Beard seems to imply that he has not told us everything. But for the most part -- The truth is out there