Zero x system

[nobcitypool]

It may be a bit hasty to condemn Tor completely. I don't believe the content was completely revolutionary when Jimmy Reid might have produced the videos. While it would have likely been a civil violation for Tor to have been selling Jimmy Reid videos, I believe he is perfectly within his rights to have put his own slant on things and re-produced the videos. Needless to say, he did a reasonably good quality job with the videos he produced. I've never seen Jimmy's videos and therefore can't comment on how they compare, either from a content or quality point of view.

Would it have been nice for Tor to give credit to Jimmy, in the video introduction, for much of the material? Yes, it would have. Is Tor a horrible villain for repackaging, slightly modifying and selling his work? I don't think so. To give credit where credit is due, Tor did a very smart thing by making these video downloads. I wish all the instructional videos would do this as it makes it relatively easy to put the video on an iPad or tablet pc.

At the end of the day, here's the important question IMHO. Did Tor take anything away from Jimmy, or take money out of his pocket, by producing these videos? Very, very minimal if any to my way of thinking.

I have no horse in this race, just my unbiased objective opinion. I don't believe Tor is going to make big bucks out of this, don't see the huge deal.

 

[Joe Pickens]

Okay, what I don't understand is when Tor posted a year or two ago about Jimmy's health problems he stated that someone else had ripped Jimmy's website off and he wasn't receiving any money for his DVD sales. How did this get changed around to Tor being the one that ripped Jimmy off from any sales?

I know I'm getting old and some things fly over my head, but what am I missing here if anything?

 

[jimmyg]

I don't have a clue as far as what actually happened here, but if it did happen as Jimmy suggests, then somehow most everyone here is missing the most important issue, the difference between basic right and wrong, ethics, kindness, consideration, and love.

Something doesn't have to be illegal to be outright wrong, and taking financial advantage of anyone who is ill and unable to fend for themselves is despicable.

Karma can be a treacherous teacher.

J

 

[iusedtoberich]

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=308450

Here is Tor's response. Read it and then make up your own minds. I'm not in the market for any instructionals right now, but if I were, I'd buy everyone that Tor made.

 

[JB Cases]

FWIW it looks to me like Jimmy's site www.freepoollessons.com is fully functional with the paypal going to Jimmy's email which presumably is a paypal account he controls.

I also don't get the vibe that Tor is ripping Jimmy off. I think maybe Jimmy is confused and hurt somehow and is possibly mixing up situations. If someone is not computer literate then it's really hard to understand that 99.99% of the time no one actually installs viruses on purpose.

I get emails all the time from my customers and pro players which contain links to trojan viruses and that tells me that their computers have been compromised.

My thought here is that this is an unfortunate situation. As for Tor putting out his own videos...well anyone can make videos just like anyone can make cases or cues. Tor has done a great job with his material and he hasn't ripped anyone off as far as I can tell with the material. And even if he did take a method that was made up by someone else those aren't protectable anyway. Credit would be nice but no one owns techniques. Once you put out a technique on how to play then it's out there. The only thing you can copyright is your presentation/performance of it. If someone were to duplicate that performance then there is a potential copyright violation.

Anyway, for $9 Tor's information is solid and a good value. The 120 minute free video on basics is a great asset to pool.

Just a bummer all the way around to see a US Open winner down and angry like this. I hope Jimmy and Tor can talk it out and put this to rest.

 

[david(tx)]

I don't have a clue as far as what actually happened here, but if it did happen as Jimmy suggests, then somehow most everyone here is missing the most important issue, the difference between basic right and wrong, ethics, kindness, consideration, and love.

Something doesn't have to be illegal to be outright wrong, and taking financial advantage of anyone who is ill and unable to fend for themselves is despicable.

Karma can be a treacherous teacher.

J

Karma can be a treacherous teacher.



Yes , but if there is karma then everyone has it . I have a friend who uses this logic , but he can't see his own errors .Does one persons bad karma trump anothers in the retribution game ?

 

[Blue Hog ridr]

Sorry if I don't quite follow. I also have Jimmy's dvds. They were probably the first ones I bought when I started getting more serious.
So much info on them that truthfully, I haven't gotten thru everything yet. Lots of great stuff and things that have helped and I use daily.

Does this mean that anyone that uses the Diamonds on a table and counts them as being zero to 80 etc, is copying. If so, then there are 100 of people
that copied someone in the past.

Can someone give me specific examples of what exactly was copied by Tor.

Thanks.

 

[jimmyg]

Karma can be a treacherous teacher.

Yes , but if there is karma then everyone has it . I have a friend who uses this logic , but he can't see his own errors .Does one persons bad karma trump anothers in the retribution game ?

I don't believe that there are "standard" karma themes which play out exactly the same for everyone, nor do I believe that we get to participate in the negotiations.

J

 

[david(tx)]

I don't believe that there are "standard" karma themes which play out exactly the same for everyone, nor do I believe that we get to participate in the negotiations.

J

If they don't play out the same then they aren't fair , and yes we shouldn't be involved in the negotiations .

 

[JB Cases]

Karma can be a treacherous teacher.



Yes , but if there is karma then everyone has it . I have a friend who uses this logic , but he can't see his own errors .Does one persons bad karma trump anothers in the retribution game ?

Exactly. For example my friend was brutally beaten when a robber forced his way into his business. Some people said that my friend deserved it for being rude to his customers. That this was his karma. I then wondered what sort of karma points get deducted for wishing harm on someone else?

People who say that so and so deserved it don't seem to understand that this isn't how karma works. You can't USE karma, it simply exists as the product of your efforts. If you believe that one invites bad karma by bad deeds then the act of wishing for or taking joy in the misfortune of others is itself inviting bad karma. That is if you really believe in karma.

I think at this point in my life I have come to understand that being at peace with everyone in my life is simply less stressful and that this creates an environment where negativity is kept to a minimum. I don't consider that if something bad happens to me or my family that it's because I did something bad to someone else. However not doing anything bad to others keeps me from feeling guilty about things I have done and wondering if this is my karma.

 

[david(tx)]

Exactly. For example my friend was brutally beaten when a robber forced his way into his business. Some people said that my friend deserved it for being rude to his customers. That this was his karma. I then wondered what sort of karma points get deducted for wishing harm on someone else?

People who say that so and so deserved it don't seem to understand that this isn't how karma works. You can't USE karma, it simply exists as the product of your efforts. If you believe that one invites bad karma by bad deeds then the act of wishing for or taking joy in the misfortune of others is itself inviting bad karma. That is if you really believe in karma.

I think at this point in my life I have come to understand that being at peace with everyone in my life is simply less stressful and that this creates an environment where negativity is kept to a minimum. I don't consider that if something bad happens to me or my family that it's because I did something bad to someone else. However not doing anything bad to others keeps me from feeling guilty about things I have done and wondering if this is my karma.

You know , i wish the best for Jimmy , and i'm not going to try to sort things out from limited information and the fact that i know neither of these guys . When things get tough in life people tend to start blaming others for their predicaments , i've done it myself. When people started dogging CJ Wiley over promoting his DVD's i thought with the limited market for such material i doubt anyone , pro or not is making alot of money off it .

If the Tor guys DVD's offer good competent material for 8.99 , it is a steal.I hope they get it worked out , seriously . Maybe it could have been resolved in a private way .

 

[Blue Hog ridr]

If you believe that one invites bad karma by bad deeds then the act of wishing for or taking joy in the misfortune of others is itself inviting bad karma. That is if you really believe in karma.

Basically true John. Ones thoughts that you project can be dangerous.

Some time ago, someone wrote a book on Manifestation. They are probably millionaires many times over. Wouldn't it be grand to put your wishes to win the big lotto out there and Bingo, its yours. Problem is, everyone in the world is also trying to manifest the same.

Doesn't quite work that way.

But, your idea of unconditional love/peace toward everyone is the one true and main theme of good Karma.

It has been written and explained many different ways but that is what it does boil down to. LOVE.

If you can truly live by that rule, then you have it mastered.

And yes, we are allowed our mistakes. The Ascended Masters don't expect anyone to be perfect. Perfection is impossible.
Yet, that is all we can do is try our hardest and it is recognized that way. Good thoughts manifest good things as bad thoughts can do the same.

See, you've had your transgressions on AZ, you recognize them and are trying to over come the past. That is progress. The Higher powers do recognize this.

Example: You do a good deed for someone and you are rewarded with a flat tire on the way home when you are in a hurry. Your immediate thoughts are back to this. I just did a good deed and this is the crap I am rewarded with. You get the tire changed and come upon a bridge that you would cross. It is blocked off because of a nasty car accident. If you hadn't had the flat tire, what if.
Karma does work in mysterious ways it does.

 

[david(tx)]

Basically true John. Ones thoughts that you project can be dangerous.

Some time ago, someone wrote a book on Manifestation. They are probably millionaires many times over. Wouldn't it be grand to put your wishes to win the big lotto out there and Bingo, its yours. Problem is, everyone in the world is also trying to manifest the same.

Doesn't quite work that way.

But, your idea of unconditional love/peace toward everyone is the one true and main theme of good Karma.

It has been written and explained many different ways but that is what it does boil down to. LOVE.

If you can truly live by that rule, then you have it mastered.

And yes, we are allowed our mistakes. The Ascended Masters don't expect anyone to be perfect. Perfection is impossible.
Yet, that is all we can do is try our hardest and it is recognized that way. Good thoughts manifest good things as bad thoughts can do the same.

See, you've had your transgressions on AZ, you recognize them and are trying to over come the past. That is progress. The Higher powers do recognize this.

Actually you can think bad thoughts and commit bad deeds and live a prosperous and long life with no retribution . It rains on the just and unjust alike .

 

[Blue Hog ridr]

Sure you can and it does seem like that in the physical world.
You will most certainly pay for that later on.

 

[david(tx)]

Sure you can and it does seem like that in the physical world.
You will most certainly pay for that later on.

I agree , maybe we may disagree on how we may pay , everyone needs a compass .

 

[Blue Hog ridr]

A compass. Thats a good way of looking at it.

 

[Rico]

zero x

I did what some suggested after reading this stuff on here i called Jimmy who ive known since the early 80,s . I listen to him for almost an hr. Some of the things he told me i can believe are misunderstandings. Some are definetly wrong .Like Tor couldnt play any level didnt know one thing about pool when he came to his hometo help with his web problems. Tor grew up in the Quad Cities. hung out at Millertime Billiards. Jesse Bowman Rod FLENOI, Johnnie Kacero. they all know him. Yes he has apool background. Italked to Tor he will not say one bad word about Jimmy. HE would still help him. I believe we should not take sides but hope they can work this out.

 

[Blue Hog ridr]

Looking like Jam instigated this one.

Sorry Jen, sometimes you just bring on things one might be best to keep their nose out of.

If its between Tor and Jimmy, leave it at that.

So, you can create a S hit storm and just step out of the way and watch the proceedings there after.

 

[JB Cases]

Looking like Jam instigated this one.

Sorry Jen, sometimes you just bring on things one might be best to keep their nose out of.

If its between Tor and Jimmy, leave it at that.

So, you can create a S hit storm and just step out of the way and watch the proceedings there after.

You can't fault Jennie for this. She is dealing with the loss of one friend in Ronnie Allen and Keith's grief over that and then comes Jimmy Reid's situation. How can you not listen to a friend and honor his request to relay his story? Jennie posted what she was asked to, posted Jimmy's contact information and the result is that we all now know some of the story between Jimmy and Tor.

I am relieved to know that this isn't a ripoff story. I like Jimmy and I like Tor. If I were in Jennie's shoes I probably would have done the same thing out of support and sympathy for my ailing friend.

You know, Jennie remembers the old school days. Jimmy and Keith came up at the same time and at times the only family these guys had was the people they ran the roads with. A lot of their best memories aren't of Christmases around the fire with the family but instead that time in New Mexico around Christmas where they busted that bookie wearing an elf's hat. We shouldn't be judgmental on any side here I don't think.

 

[n0th1ng]

Many ppl out there still believing Tor is scumbag. I will copy and paste those posts to other Thread