An open player
- Thread starter BlaineBarcus
- Start date
Every tour sets ratings up a little differently, so I'm not sure if there is a standard or not. But from what I have seen, an open player is the same as a semi pro. Open players typically pay the same entry fee as a pro, and justifiably so. Watching an open player shoot, most times its very tough to tell if he is a pro or not. Its a relatively short race(plus, its 9 ball) so they are capable of beating just about anyone.
If you want to include performance under pressure, I just like to use tournament results on a regional level to determine ratings. Iusedtoberich has a great scale for mapping progress on a practice level. Take any regional open tour and I think it looks like this.
D: Will never win a match. Donating
C: May win a match every few tournaments entered.
B: Wins about half, depending on the draw. May get a late cash.
A: Consistently around the money very little chance to cash high.
Shortstop: Usually cashes, may get higher cash.
Open: Almost always cashes, threat to win with a gear.
Pro: Always a threat to win.
Packages of runs or beating a ghost mean nothing to me. I know practice champs that claim to beat the ghost but that can't get there in a tournament. Also using iusedtoberich's scale you must be honest with yourself. It is an average not your best set. A, B, C players are that way due to inconsistency and often can play at a higher level.
But what do I know?
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Joking right?
This is ok, but it fails at one key specific point.
You are talking about regional stops correct.
This formula in no way reflects a players ability as the day goes on. In two day events, sure, this is a pretty good measure, but in one day events, this formula completely fails for the A-Pro.
Why?
Simply because regardless of ones playing ability, not everyone can wake up at 7 or 8am, drive 2 hours to some tournament, and then play till 4 in the morning.
There are plenty of talented players who are never going to play good after 7pm, because they just get tired.
I've been around pool for a while now (22years). Just my opinion, to me, there is really no such thing as an 'OPEN' level player. When I was coming up, these were the terms used to designate a player's status/class:
D
C
B
A
AA
I THINK AAA (NOT TOTALLY SURE)
SEMI PRO
PRO
The term 'open' is to indicate the format of a tournament That there is no criteria/exclusion in this tournament. It's 'OPEN' to whoever. Anyone can play.
I think that anyone who would try to achieve a particular class/status is putting a cap on their potential. I feel as though one should just play the best game that they can play each and every time. Don't be concerned with what his/her 'pool world status' is.
Recommendation: It may sound unrealistic but try not to miss a balL for the rest of your life!!!!!!.......lol! Keep shootin for the moon!
P.E.A.C.E.
WUTANG
D
C
B
A
AA
I THINK AAA (NOT TOTALLY SURE)
SEMI PRO
PRO
The term 'open' is to indicate the format of a tournament That there is no criteria/exclusion in this tournament. It's 'OPEN' to whoever. Anyone can play.
I think that anyone who would try to achieve a particular class/status is putting a cap on their potential. I feel as though one should just play the best game that they can play each and every time. Don't be concerned with what his/her 'pool world status' is.
Recommendation: It may sound unrealistic but try not to miss a balL for the rest of your life!!!!!!.......lol! Keep shootin for the moon!
P.E.A.C.E.
WUTANG
This justifies the point, stamina and mental toughness is a contributing factor for ranking. No system can include everything. This is how I look at it.
The Pros/Opens get better as the day goes on because playing at a high level takes less effort and they are more trained to do so.
I on the other hand drain down just like you said.
Keith
No, the majority of people that get better all the way till the end of the day, are the ones on drugs.
Believe me, if you have an all natural final at 3 in the morning, you are watching some pretty bad pool.
If you are watching a half and half final at 3 in the morning, you are usually going to have a blowout.
If you are watching both players jacked up at 3 in the morning, you are going to have a great match.
The problem with regional tournaments, especially the ones that are done in one day, is that it's not about who plays good pool in the end, it's about who hasn't fallen over and started snoring underneath the table.
There have been many times where a so so player who was jacked up on something, crushed the top level player, cause the top guy didn't show up he was so damn tired.
It's not so cut and dry.
It's way more complicated then you think.
Show me the top 5 on some regional tour points list, and i'll show you a drug user.
Wow your bitter. I know many players that are not jacked up at the end of tournaments. Most of those guys are used to playing long sessions. You could call them losers because they don't have jobs and can afford to play till 3am every morning, which us working stiffs cannot do. I agree that drug culture is a big part of the game but to say that every player in top five is a hard core user is a little over the top.
I am sure that Shane and Donny Mills like long sessions and just keep getting better and better and better. They must be jacked up in every match.
they played what, 4 hours per day? That's a pretty decent break ( 20 hours ) in between.
I dont know. Shane and Donny play better than almost everyone at any regional event. Pro pool spaces matches to keep the players fresh. If that play all opponets that play their level playing 8-9 matches over 14 plus hours I think their game would be down at the end.
I watched Shane play Alex in vegas when Alex came from behind and won. Shane was tired and did not play well at the end. You could see he was tired. Alex seemed fresher and was feeding off the crowd as well.
I think Shane had played 1-2 tournaments and many hours of pool up to that time.
Rarely have I ever seen great pool played in the finals of any regional event. Even two day events are a grind and take their toll on the players.
No not bitter at all. Just very realistic.
Please point out where i called anyone a loser. I'd really like to know.
Please also include where i called them losers in this thread because they don't have jobs.
Also, please show me where i said EVERY player in the top 5 REGIONAL points list is a hard core user?
Please also explain to me how a one day regional event which i was talking about, in any way translates into or it interpreted as, 2 players matching up and having a long session? I mean, i like to think that i have a good grasp on speech and vocabulary, but if i mentioned regional tour one day events, and you translated that into 2 players matching up and playing all night, i have no idea what planet you are on.
But, back to the point.
If you don't know which players are on something, that does not mean that they are automatically goodie two shoes. It just means that you despite playing pool, really have no understanding of some of the hardcore realities that are right in front of your face.
Believe me, if they drug tested for stimulants and pain killers before and after every match, i can personally guarantee that you'd have a much more varied outcome to regional one day events.
The fact that you speak with conviction, yet you don't know the dark side of pool leads me to believe that you are overestimating you knowledge of pool.
Where as some of us who have actually witnessed the darker side of pool, can attest to such fact.
There are PLENTY of players who are jacked up every weekend on all sorts of stuff.
If you don't know that, then you are really naive.
Open player
I have never heard the term of being an 'Open player'.
D
C
B
A
Shortstop (A+)
Pro
Local people added plus and minus to the Alpha letters.
There are Open tournaments, and that means that the tournament is Open to any player, no matter what the ranking. Most of the bigger Open tournaments, 64 player or bigger, will mostly contain B players or above.
In Handicapped 9 ball tournaments, the handicaps usually run from 3 or 4 up through 12 (pros are a 12).
Back in the day, players had a money rating only, between 1 and 10 with 10 being pro level. (that is, if they gambled)
I have never heard the term of being an 'Open player'.
D
C
B
A
Shortstop (A+)
Pro
Local people added plus and minus to the Alpha letters.
There are Open tournaments, and that means that the tournament is Open to any player, no matter what the ranking. Most of the bigger Open tournaments, 64 player or bigger, will mostly contain B players or above.
In Handicapped 9 ball tournaments, the handicaps usually run from 3 or 4 up through 12 (pros are a 12).
Back in the day, players had a money rating only, between 1 and 10 with 10 being pro level. (that is, if they gambled)
Well I will explain again. I stated that playing well for a duration of time was a strength that factors into the rating. Superstar knocked some elses rating system because there was no pressure. I provided another metric and superstar once again was not happy with it due to the fact that most regional players are jacked up on something.
The Shane and Donny reference was not directed to their match but their history of play late in regional and pro tournaments. The better players can maintain a top speed longer, it is what makes them open or pro level. I have a pretty good grasp on vocabulary and the english language. You said, "Show me someone on the top five in regional points and I will show you a drug user." Pretty clear to me. I know the darkerside of pool, I have seen it all.
Someone wanted a gauge for that different speeds are, I gave one and now we have sidetracked his thread.
Some people just want to argue. Go ahead and be unhappy.
The Shane and Donny reference was not directed to their match but their history of play late in regional and pro tournaments. The better players can maintain a top speed longer, it is what makes them open or pro level. I have a pretty good grasp on vocabulary and the english language. You said, "Show me someone on the top five in regional points and I will show you a drug user." Pretty clear to me. I know the darkerside of pool, I have seen it all.
Someone wanted a gauge for that different speeds are, I gave one and now we have sidetracked his thread.
Some people just want to argue. Go ahead and be unhappy.
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Not it's not about arguing.
It's about what you are saying that is just wrong.
No one, and i do mean NO one starts playing at noon, and gets stronger with every match till 3 or 4 in the morning. The only ones that do, are on something.
People might have a second or 3rd wind, but that in no way equals the same type of performance as when they were fresh.
Seriously, we are not talking about big events, where matches are scheduled and times are posted so people can gauge how they go about their day to provide themselves with maximum rest (or not) so that they can be at their best. This pool scenario is not what i am addressing.
Your system was based on REGIONAL tour stops, yes?
I found flaw with it.
If you don't want to acknowledge that top level pool at the one day ALL DAY level, and top level pool at the week long level with pre-arranged times for matches are different, then i can't help you.
Believe me, there is NO player that is getting stronger and stronger as the day goes on for 14 hours.
The ones that DO, have help.
It's about what you are saying that is just wrong.
No one, and i do mean NO one starts playing at noon, and gets stronger with every match till 3 or 4 in the morning. The only ones that do, are on something.
People might have a second or 3rd wind, but that in no way equals the same type of performance as when they were fresh.
Seriously, we are not talking about big events, where matches are scheduled and times are posted so people can gauge how they go about their day to provide themselves with maximum rest (or not) so that they can be at their best. This pool scenario is not what i am addressing.
Your system was based on REGIONAL tour stops, yes?
I found flaw with it.
If you don't want to acknowledge that top level pool at the one day ALL DAY level, and top level pool at the week long level with pre-arranged times for matches are different, then i can't help you.
Believe me, there is NO player that is getting stronger and stronger as the day goes on for 14 hours.
The ones that DO, have help.
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So based on the getting better and better throughout the day theory for those that are used to playing long sessions.
Shortstops will play like pros, open players will play like god, and Pros will play like the aliens from another planet at the end of the day long regional event.
Shortstops will play like pros, open players will play like god, and Pros will play like the aliens from another planet at the end of the day long regional event.
I have always understood it as:
D
D+
C
C+
B
B+
A
A+
Open
Pro
and shortstop can mean anyone between an A player and a strong open player. Just the way I have always understood this.
But speeds are different in different regions. When Im visiting in Ohio, Im understood to be a higher speed than in NYC.
D
D+
C
C+
B
B+
A
A+
Open
Pro
and shortstop can mean anyone between an A player and a strong open player. Just the way I have always understood this.
But speeds are different in different regions. When Im visiting in Ohio, Im understood to be a higher speed than in NYC.
normal distribution
IMHO I think that Cleary has listed the rankings as they should be. Most of you know what a normal distribution curve is . It looks like this:
IMHO I think that Cleary has listed the rankings as they should be. Most of you know what a normal distribution curve is . It looks like this:
