Will someone w/break speed app do a test???

Maniac said:
But....I've already been shown two examples here already showing that the rail break generates more speed. Hmmmmm.......I guess it's all in whoever does the breaking.

Maniac
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Each individual has a method that will work best for them, however, until using your method sets the record which is approximately 27 miles per hour, the most that we as individuals can say is that this method or that method works best for us individually.

To achieve the speed outlined above not only is location important, but the technique itself must be flawless as well.

JIMO
 
I got the app

in Nov. and the best I got was 21.97 on a 9' table and I break pretty hard. Then I had a friend try it on a 8' bar table and he recorded a mind boggling 40.18 mph fluke,and he's not a shooter, his next break was 12.59..lol yes it was set up properly as the instructions told me. Is it accurate? I don't really know. Maybe the battery power has something to do with it.
 
After about 40 breaks I averaged about 2 mph faster from the headstring than from the back rail. I had a house pro do 10 breaks and he had similar results.
 
djpstacked03 said:
The greater the distance from the cue ball to the rack the greater potential for a faster break speed. Look at it this way. Can you reach a higher top speed in your car in 10 feet or 100 feet? Pros may not always place the cue ball as far away because they have such great control and precision. It's not always about break speed but how the balls spread more so.
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Sure, but how much does a cueball with a motor cost these days?
 
I broke 5 times from the headstring with a closed bridge and my results were: 20.16, 20.52, 19.44, 19.80 and 19.34.
I broke 5 times a half a diamond back with a closed rail bridge and my results were: 20.79, 20.57, 21.77, 21.68 and 20.81.
Results will vary I'm sure from player to player but for me the closed rail bridge generates more speed.
 
manwon said:
...the record which is approximately 27 miles per hour...
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from sfleinen:

Here's of one of the most powerful (and controlled) breakers in the world -- the mighty Russian, Evgeny Stalev:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=PkCG3q2PDa4#t=560

He's all of 150lbs soaking wet, yet clocks in 35+ mph breaks (he was averaging that in the U.S. Open the video above was taken from). Evgeny (pronounced "yev genny" with a hard "g" sound in the second syllable, for those Russian-pronunciation-challenged like us Americans) uses shoulder, elbow, and his pectoral (chest) muscle to achieve this power. You'll notice he doesn't use any "lunging" motion at all, but rather a very smooth "forward drift" motion in his stance. ... And he does all this with his playing cue!

In my opinion, Evgeny's got one of the smoothest, most powerful, and, for what's going on in his arm, accurate breaks around. Ask yourself, have you ever heard that kind of sound from a break? It's one thing to hear it in this video; quite another to hear it in person (the video lacks some of the auditory fireworks that seeing/hearing this live gives).​



From: http://billiards.colostate.edu/threads/break.html

Bob Byrne wrote something about some skinny karate guy who hit 30 mph 20+ years ago.
 
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speed wears off over distance on a break shot.
on a 7ft er from the rail the fastest controlled break i have hit is 30.2mph though a really controlled break is about 25-26mph where i consistently can squat the cue ball.
on a 9fter the fastest i can get is 27.2mph and my controlled break speed is 23-24mph.
i find i dont break any harder/faster from the middle or the rail.
 
rhyno said:
speed wears off over distance on a break shot.
on a 7ft er from the rail the fastest controlled break i have hit is 30.2mph though a really controlled break is about 25-26mph where i consistently can squat the cue ball.
on a 9fter the fastest i can get is 27.2mph and my controlled break speed is 23-24mph.
i find i dont break any harder/faster from the middle or the rail.
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The maximum speed of the cue ball achieved after the break shot is the same on any size table....on larger tables the cue ball has more time to slow down...I believe when you are talking about break speed, you are talking maximum and not the speed when it hits the rack.....
 
Correction: There is the initial acceleration from the impact of the cue stick, but the cue ball does not continue to accelerate after impact.[/QUOTE]

Ya your right. That makes sense. It will lose speed with friction over distance. It must be that I have better form with a closed rail bridge opposed to my form with a closed bridge near the headstring to get the results I do consistently.

PoolBum if you have anything of value to contribute to the thread im all ears :)
 
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jrackman said:
in Nov. and the best I got was 21.97 on a 9' table and I break pretty hard. Then I had a friend try it on a 8' bar table and he recorded a mind boggling 40.18 mph fluke,and he's not a shooter, his next break was 12.59..lol yes it was set up properly as the instructions told me. Is it accurate? I don't really know. Maybe the battery power has something to do with it.
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The Breakspeed app uses sound to figure out the speed of a break. It listens to the sound of the tip hitting the cue ball and the sound of the cue ball hitting the rack and times how long the interval is in between those two events. If your friend clocked a 40mph break, he either is the hardest breaker in the world or you phone just mistook background noise for one of the sounds it is listening to. Also, it helps to have the settings for the cue ball and table size accurately entered in.

As for breaking from the short rail and breaking from the headstring, there are advantages for both.

Breaking from the rail offers a more comfortable bridge for most people and thus they can often get more power and maybe a more accurate stroke.

Breaking from the headstring offers the advantage in that it is closer and, consequently, less travel time. This may not seem like much, but being closer helps with accuracy (would you rather shoot a 5 foot shot or a 7 foot shot?) and there is a slight loss of speed to friction which, given a shorter distance, is smaller when you are closer to the rack.

Considering the pros all have extremely accurate strokes, their stroke is most likely the same no matter where they break from, thus bridging from the short rail offers only a disadvantage in being at a longer distance. I believe that is why you never see the pros breaking from the short rail.

Breaking from the rail on the headstring is a whole different story, however. Breaking from the rail on the headstring makes it easier to make the wing ball in 9 ball due to the mechanics of the diamond shaped rack.
 
SnapdaNine said:
The maximum speed of the cue ball achieved after the break shot is the same on any size table....on larger tables the cue ball has more time to slow down...I believe when you are talking about break speed, you are talking maximum and not the speed when it hits the rack.....
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breakspeed measures the speed by using the distance travelled by time taken....so in theory its an average speed isnt it as the cue ball is slowing down straight after you hit it due to friction of the cloth etc.
the speeds given are measured using the breakspeed app on my android phone
 
rhyno said:
breakspeed measures the speed by using the distance travelled by time taken....so in theory its an average speed isnt it as the cue ball is slowing down straight after you hit it due to friction of the cloth etc.
the speeds given are measured using the breakspeed app on my android phone
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That would be correct. Although the speed lost in between the cue tip and the rack is probably very small.

Actually, some people I know who have a radar gun at their pool hall were saying the the breakspeed app is consistently 2-3kph slower than the radar gun measurement. This could possibly be the difference between maximum speed and average speed.
 
Masayoshi said:
Actually, some people I know who have a radar gun at their pool hall were saying the the breakspeed app is consistently 2-3kph slower than the radar gun measurement. This could possibly be the difference between maximum speed and average speed.
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I have a radar gun, and the app. Guns are sensitive to angles, which makes the shown speed less than the actual speed. Paul may have written the app to extract maximum speed. Maybe he'll post to this thread.
 
Bob Callahan said:
I have a radar gun, and the app. Guns are sensitive to angles, which makes the shown speed less than the actual speed. Paul may have written the app to extract maximum speed. Maybe he'll post to this thread.
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I don't think you can calculate maximum speed unless you know how friction affects the cue ball, which should be different for different tables and cue elevations.
 
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Masayoshi said:
I don't think you can calculate maximum speed unless you know how friction affects the cue ball, which should be different for different tables...
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Sure. Sample a bunch of tables...take an average, skew the results to the fast cloth side, since most folks buying the app play on better tables. Plug it into the equation....

Masayoshi said:
...cue elevations.
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Lost me. Maybe it's because I've been up all night shooting pool. :confused:

How do you see elevation affecting friction after the ball leaves the cue? Are you talking about airborne breaks? An app that used friction to estimate max speed would be off a bit in that case.
 
Bob Callahan said:
Sure. Sample a bunch of tables...take an average, skew the results to the fast cloth side, since most folks buying the app play on better tables. Plug it into the equation....



Lost me. Maybe it's because I've been up all night shooting pool. :confused:

How do you see elevation affecting friction after the ball leaves the cue? Are you talking about airborne breaks? An app that used friction to estimate max speed would be off a bit in that case.
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If the cue ball is in the air for part of the time before it hits the rack, the friction will be less than if it traveled on the table the whole way.

Also, i don't think an average of table cloth would give accurate results considering how much table speed tends to vary.
 
I break harder off the short rail. I attribute this mostly to the fact that I feel more comfortable and therefore can hit them harder.
 
I'm no physicist. That said, I believe the laws of physics and gravity would cause the cue ball to begin decelerating immediately after contact no matter whether it's airborne or rolling on the table. This has been shown and discussed for a long time; go see Dr. Dave Alciatore's website for further details.

The reason people are getting differing results with the app and where they break has to do with the quality of the hit their cue tip is applying to the ball. It only takes a millimeter's difference to greatly affect the speed imparted to the cue ball. Unless the breaker is hitting the cue ball in exactly the same spot every single time, the results are going to vary. If you want to smooth out the variances, you need more data. Track 100 breaks or so and you'll begin to get a much better idea.

With all that in mind, I agree with whoever said that the best break is the one that works best for you. In my case, it's not my hardest break; it's at about 80% or so of max power that makes balls and controls the rock. How do you learn this? Break about 100 racks and when you get a break that does that, try to replicate it. Trust me, you'll get better!

Brian in VA - not the loudest breaker but a good one, nonetheless
 
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