The answer seems pretty simple. Take probable annual winnings and deduct travel and related expenses, then back out the normal living costs, then income taxes, and it equals broke.
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Why are professional players broke?
- Thread starter JB Cases
- Start date
Sometimes even the winner doesn't win.
Gambling and buying luxury items are not the only ways they have of divesting themselves of their money. I won't mention his name because he's a friend, but I was present when one of the best known players in the world won a tournament that paid out huge. At the time it was one of the largest payouts in the history of the sport.
You may find this hard to believe, but by the time he paid off his backer, paid off his "savers", and paid off various other debts he had incurred during the tournament, he didn't have enough money left to pay the taxes on the money he had won.
How could this possibly happen, you ask? Well, for starters one of the savers he took was for half of whatever he won. That's an unusally large amount for a saver and oddly enough, he didn't make that saver until the final day of the tournament. Why did he make it? Because he had a dream the night before the final day that another player won the tournament. When he approached that player with the saver offer, that player was more than happy to accept since he was already on the one lost side.
Gambling and buying luxury items are not the only ways they have of divesting themselves of their money. I won't mention his name because he's a friend, but I was present when one of the best known players in the world won a tournament that paid out huge. At the time it was one of the largest payouts in the history of the sport.
You may find this hard to believe, but by the time he paid off his backer, paid off his "savers", and paid off various other debts he had incurred during the tournament, he didn't have enough money left to pay the taxes on the money he had won.
How could this possibly happen, you ask? Well, for starters one of the savers he took was for half of whatever he won. That's an unusally large amount for a saver and oddly enough, he didn't make that saver until the final day of the tournament. Why did he make it? Because he had a dream the night before the final day that another player won the tournament. When he approached that player with the saver offer, that player was more than happy to accept since he was already on the one lost side.
Winner, winner chicken dinner!
Pro player: Uh, hey buddy can you buy me a chicken dinner?
Can you elaborate on this event. This is the first I have heard of it.
Me too. I want all the details. I never heard of this scandal until reading this thread
It was televised and was held in a casino. The casino made a line on the different matches and the players fixed the matches depending on the odds. They didn't even make it look good. I remember one match with David Howard missing the 9 twice before the other guy finally made it. Needless to say the casino stopped betting on the matches midway through the tournament. I am sure others who were actually there can elaborate but that is the gist.
Scroll down to post #3 in the following thread by the "Professor":
http://southernbilliards.yuku.com/topic/1834#.TewXbVt3nzM
Was this incident investigated? In any other professional sport, the players involved would have been severely penalized and possibly barred from ever playing again.
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The Camel Tour was great but it wasn't going to last. Sponsorship by the tobacco companies was a losing proposition in the long run. The events were poorly attended and that's part of the problem. Pool just isn't a very good spectator sport. I still think that a viable tour that has the support of the industry is possible but It wouldn't have huge paydays associated with mainstream sports.
It is possible to make a decent living being a player but it takes work and marketing. Jeanette Lee has done pretty well with herself by creating a brand that supersedes the game/sport of pool.
My last comment is about doing something you love for a living. It has its own rewards that transcends money. Who was it that said "do something that you love and you will never work a day in your life"? It has some merit. So don't just pile on people that take a chance and try do something different than "normal" way of life (working everyday with the hope that you have enough money saved that you can retire if you make it that long). Because maybe being normal is really abnormal? Just saying.......
Look the fact is that based on the current economic model it can't work for anyone but the Top 10. If your 11~200 tough luck. Nobody cares and I hope you like living in your car or on your friend's sofa.
Check out the money on the PBA list. Nothing special except they have a bunch of NON-BOWLING sponsors and wear shirts that would make a Nascar vehicle blush.
Pepsi, Denny's & Bud. A couple of these could change the whole picture. We need more Viagra and less Predator.
http://www.pba.com/SeasonStats/TotalWinnings/58
Nick
Check out the money on the PBA list. Nothing special except they have a bunch of NON-BOWLING sponsors and wear shirts that would make a Nascar vehicle blush.
Pepsi, Denny's & Bud. A couple of these could change the whole picture. We need more Viagra and less Predator.
http://www.pba.com/SeasonStats/TotalWinnings/58
Nick
The funny thing about the bowling is, they were making close to that 20 years ago, they seemed to have hit a ceiling. I remember $10,000 first prizes back in the 50's for bowling about what pool is now.
Most players treat pool like a game (or a $200 score) and not a lifetime business. Most... not all. Jeanette Lee is a perfect example of how to market yourself and focus more about the big picture and molding yourself to a specific client demographic. The few times I have spoken to her on a professional level at BCA conventions etc, she was always concerned about the future, the long run. She speaks to every banger like a potential client. Not like they are her next "score". If all the pro players approached pool like a 40 year business plan our sport would be looked at very differently.
I believe in my heart that there are things out there that the pro player could do to generate an income. Exhibitions are the first that come to mind. Let's be real though, you have to have more than the ability on the table to do an exhibition, or do one and expect to be asked to do another. Personality goes a long way and let's face it, there are a lot of slugs out there calling themselves pros. You gotta have charisma. God love Efren, he draws a crowd wherever he goes, but he draws it on his name alone. Every time I've seen him doing some sort of exhibition, when he's not on the table, he slumps down in a chair, smokes, etc... etc... Don't take that the wrong way, I've met him several times and I think he's a really nice guy. But other than watching him play pool he doesn't do much to draw a crowd. That is the biggest reason Fats was so popular. We all know he wasn't the best player out there, but he had the ability to take over a crowd and keep them. THAT is what is needed, and that is something that can't be taught. Either you got it or you don't. Most don't. And I'm not saying that this is the sole reason that pool doesn't get more recognition or why all pool players are broke. This is just my opinion on one area of the topic at hand....and Yes, I smoke so Efren's smoking doesn't bother me in the least.
MULLY
winning a tournament then heading to the casino or dropping it down on a bet with the first person that comes up doesn't help keep money in your pocket either.
MULLY
winning a tournament then heading to the casino or dropping it down on a bet with the first person that comes up doesn't help keep money in your pocket either.
Thank you sir. That pretty much sums it up right there. I would love to get a copy of the finals to check it out and see all the horrible misses.
That is a fantastic tale by Grady. Very interesting to see him saying that too. I thought he and Buddy were pretty tight.
MULLY
I too would love to see this match
me too
Looking back, and not knowing what had really occurred, at the time I was so surprised and kinda glad for Mike LeBron winning the $50K match. It was so American, the classic underdog coming through and winning....maybe like the year Tommy Kennedy won the U.S. Open......then I read that it was fixed!
Looking back, and not knowing what had really occurred, at the time I was so surprised and kinda glad for Mike LeBron winning the $50K match. It was so American, the classic underdog coming through and winning....maybe like the year Tommy Kennedy won the U.S. Open......then I read that it was fixed!
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In the 1990's a lot of bowlers found it was better to retain their amateur status as there was actually better money in amateur bowling than there was in professional bowling. You could win the High Roller ($250,000) or the Super Hoinke ($100,000) and in one tournament make what a top pro made for the entire season. It wasn't until many top amateur bowlers got blacklisted from these events that they were pretty much forced to turn pro. Nowadays, with some budding sponsorship, there is some money in professional bowling, but just like pool players, unless you're top 10 material or have sponsorship, don't quit your day job.
But at least bowling has big money amateur events, pool doesn't. What pool needs is committed sponsors and wider coverage. It's just that in the age of video games and social networking, the public interest just isn't there. And until someone injects some money into the sport, pool players will be, for the most part, broke. And that doesn't look like it's going to happen.
Hill-Hill
I have a copy of that tape somewhere. What Grady fails to mention is that at one point in the hill-hill game Mike has an easy out on the 8 and 9 and he dogs the 8. The look on Buddy's face is priceless.
I have a copy of that tape somewhere. What Grady fails to mention is that at one point in the hill-hill game Mike has an easy out on the 8 and 9 and he dogs the 8. The look on Buddy's face is priceless.
This story is terrible and yes, in my opinion, all of those guys should have been banned from ever competing in professional pool again. Of course, there is no professional federation if I understand correctly, so there would have been no governing body to enforce such a ban