Why the jump cues?

S

spindoctor9

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I play APA league, where jump cues are not allowed, so jumping with my playing cue is something I do often.

I have a jump cue for the close jumps (8-9 inches or closer) for non-league nights/tournaments.

Here's my question; why do I see so many players, even top pros, take out the jump cue for longer/easy jumps? I am much more accurate with my playing cue. I feel that a jump shot is about as difficult as any other shot where you're jacked up (assuming the ball to be jumped is in the range of 1-2 feet away). It always confuses me to see a top player jump and miss with a short cue on a shot that I feel would have been easy with a full cue... Is this because they're playing with a soft tip and don't want to flatten it? I can't think of any other reason to use a jump cue for a jump longer than 8-9 inches. I've been wondering about this for a long time, because I can nail jump shots with my playing cue like they're hangers, but I struggle to aim with the short cue. Am I missing something here? Or is my stroke just more powerful than I think?
 
Lots of reasons. I prefer jumping with a full cue too (when possible), however when you do you tend to have to hit the CB lower and relatively hard just to get the CB up since the tip is softer, which means you almost always end up drawing the ball hard. With a short cue and a phenolic tip, you can jump and stop, jump and follow, or jump and draw - just more options, with more control. Even Earl, who is one the best full cue jumpers ever, always ends up drawing the CB because he has to. Not to mention, with a full cue you have to have (more) distance between the CB of object ball, with a short cue, you can be close or far..
 
Its a safe bet your not playing with a Predator or OB shaft. Cant jump squat with those low deflection shafts. So if they are using low deflection shafts they need to go the lil stick to be able to. I dont use one and don't particularly like them being part of the game. I can't tell you how much i love the Joe Rogan/Earl Strickland video where 'Earl' addresses jump cues. While bowling if i'm left a 7-10 split i dont go to my bag and pull out a 3 ft wide 7-10 split ball.
my player is a BB with an ivory ferrule. Its my break cue, my jump cue, and hell, even my masse cue.
 
I play with a milk dudded elkmaster which is a very hard tip, so I can stun a jump shot or use a little english, but you're right that it's generally more difficult to control the cue ball.

You are right in assuming that I don't use a 'LD' shaft... I think they feel terrible.I, too, use my playing cue for breaking. Ever since putting these hard pressed elkmasters on my shafts, the cue ball has been popping up higher and sticking center table better than ever... so I haven't even had the desire to pull out my phenolic tipped Mezz breaker. And they jump effortlessly. I can't say enough about these milk duds... the power of a super hard tip with the grab of a soft tip.
 
spindoctor9 said:
I play APA league, where jump cues are not allowed, so jumping with my playing cue is something I do often.

I have a jump cue for the close jumps (8-9 inches or closer) for non-league nights/tournaments.

Here's my question; why do I see so many players, even top pros, take out the jump cue for longer/easy jumps? I am much more accurate with my playing cue. I feel that a jump shot is about as difficult as any other shot where you're jacked up (assuming the ball to be jumped is in the range of 1-2 feet away). It always confuses me to see a top player jump and miss with a short cue on a shot that I feel would have been easy with a full cue... Is this because they're playing with a soft tip and don't want to flatten it? I can't think of any other reason to use a jump cue for a jump longer than 8-9 inches. I've been wondering about this for a long time, because I can nail jump shots with my playing cue like they're hangers, but I struggle to aim with the short cue. Am I missing something here? Or is my stroke just more powerful than I think?
Click to expand...

When u jump with an entire cue, the cue balls trajectory is low and long?..and moving very fast...if there isnt a lot of green between CB AND OB, many times it will actually LAND into the object ball...and if there's any angle, the CB will bounce off the object ball causing cb on the floor:rolleyes:

At the very least, the CB landing into the O B will jump the O B off table...and then there's the fact that when the c b is off the table...when it lands on the o b it has a different angle than if it were actually on the green...

A jump cue allows the cue ball to jump with more "hop" thereby allowing it to land in time for it to make contact with the object ball...and avoid the foul.

Hope this helps.
 
8onthebreak said:
When u jump with an entire cue, the cue balls trajectory is low and long?..and moving very fast...if there isnt a lot of green between CB AND OB, many times it will actually LAND into the object ball...and if there's any angle, the CB will bounce off the object ball causing cb on the floor:rolleyes:

At the very least, the CB landing into the O B will jump the O B off table...and then there's the fact that when the c b is off the table...when it lands on the o b it has a different angle than if it were actually on the green...

A jump cue allows the cue ball to jump with more "hop" thereby allowing it to land in time for it to make contact with the object ball...and avoid the foul.

Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

It's easier to jump with a lessor stroke using a jump cue. You can hop the ball medium paced with control with a full cue if you can handle the weight and balance of the cue when elevated. Being tall helps. Otherwise the only difference between a full cue and jump cue is the harder tip and stiffer shaft transferring a little more energy. So anything you can do with a jump cue you can do with a full cue (aside from close jumps of course), if you can generate as much power while hitting it as purely...

I understand the benefits of a short cue and I do use it when I need to.

I should rephrase my post: I'm surprised to see so many players pull out the short cue for a shot that I feel would be easier to pocket and control with a full cue. I only say that because I've watched at least hundred matches on youtube, and I've seen many many shots where that was the case. Like jumping half a ball a foot away to cut a ball down the rail... I shoot it with my playing cue because half a ball a foot away is very easy to get over and I want the accuracy in my stroke to cut that ball... but I see top players grab the short cue. I'm stumped...

I like those longer jump cues.
 
Professional golfers can get "up and out" of the sand with a nine iron, but they'll certainly use a sand wedge because it's easier and more accurate. Use the tools you have.
 
Asking "Why the jump cues?" is kind of like asking "Why the Break cues?"

For any task there is a tool. If you can jump well with your player (I can) then you will jump better with a QUALITY jump cue. I can put, top, bottom, left and right on my jumps with my jumper, A LOT easier! Force follow is MUCH MUCH MUCH easier, with my jump cue.


best,

Justin
 
spindoctor9 said:
I play APA league, where jump cues are not allowed, so jumping with my playing cue is something I do often.

I have a jump cue for the close jumps (8-9 inches or closer) for non-league nights/tournaments.

Here's my question; why do I see so many players, even top pros, take out the jump cue for longer/easy jumps? I am much more accurate with my playing cue. I feel that a jump shot is about as difficult as any other shot where you're jacked up (assuming the ball to be jumped is in the range of 1-2 feet away). It always confuses me to see a top player jump and miss with a short cue on a shot that I feel would have been easy with a full cue... Is this because they're playing with a soft tip and don't want to flatten it? I can't think of any other reason to use a jump cue for a jump longer than 8-9 inches. I've been wondering about this for a long time, because I can nail jump shots with my playing cue like they're hangers, but I struggle to aim with the short cue. Am I missing something here? Or is my stroke just more powerful than I think?
Click to expand...

The pros have more to lose if the jump shot isn't executed properly and they give up BIH (or even a good shot) to their opponents than you do. Pool tournaments are the way for many of them to pay the bills. They cannot afford to mess the shot up or it could literally cost them hundreds (possibly thousands) of dollars. You have to at least admit that the jump cue increases the odds of making a good hit. Hell, even I can make at least a good hit MOST of the time with one and I suck at pool.

Maniac
 
Pretty much anytime I jump, I use a 'jump' cue. Its the cue I jump with and I know precisely how to you use and control it for maximum consistency.

It gives me reliable and repeatable speed, spin and trajectory control.

Of course I'm no Pro but, and not to mean...but unless you happen top be a pro I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest they may know a tad bit more about it than you. ;) If it wasn't the right move I suspect they would have figured that out don't you think?

:)
 
I understand the use of a jump cue I'm not that dense... I'm a 7/9... I'm talking SPECIFICALLY about shots that are easier to execute full cue. Like say a long straight shot where you have to draw back full table, and you have to jump a ball 16" away. Pocketing that long distance and drawing back is f***ing hard with a jump cue, but fairly simple full cue because at that distance of a jump, it's pretty much just a regular elevated draw stroke... but I still see guys grab the jump cue, then either miss the shot or not get the action they wanted on the cue ball... and I think to myself, "if they had just jacked up a little and pretended that blocking ball wasn't even there, they would've made that ball no problem with their playing cue..." I see this all the time...

I don't know maybe it's harder than I think and I'm just a freak of nature with a talent for jumping, because that's what it sounds like from all your responses...
 
spindoctor9 said:
I don't know maybe it's harder than I think and I'm just a freak of nature with a talent for jumping, because that's what it sounds like from all your responses...
Click to expand...

Maybe you are, maybe you aren't.. we'll find out when you get back to Portland! :eek:

I'm just a 7, so take it easy on me. :embarrassed2:
 
the pro's are pretty much eliminating jump cues anyway..through improved safety play

it's at the point now where if you leave a jump shot.. you didn't get safe.. and it should count as an error

the only time you see them anymore is right after the break or an unforced error..

it was a fad and it's just about run it's course
 
softshot said:
the pro's are pretty much eliminating jump cues anyway..through improved safety play

it's at the point now where if you leave a jump shot.. you didn't get safe.. and it should count as an error

the only time you see them anymore is right after the break or an unforced error..

it was a fad and it's just about run it's course
Click to expand...

Unless they ban them, I think you're gonna see jump cues used in league play for many years to come. Even if someone is a high-rated league player, they don't always execute a "lock up" safety as often/well as the pros do.

Maniac
 
spindoctor9 said:
Like say a long straight shot where you have to draw back full table, and you have to jump a ball 16" away.Pocketing that long distance and drawing back.....
Click to expand...

Long straight in... Jumping a ball... Draw back the length of the table...

Wow, I'd love to see that shot.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say , I don't think too many people are going to be playing that shot a high percentage of the time. I think seeing a person opting for that shot choice would pose a bigger question to me than , why is he using that cue.

:)

Clearly....

YMMV
 
RRfireblade said:
Long straight in... Jumping a ball... Draw back the length of the table...

Wow, I'd love to see that shot.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say , I don't think too many people are going to be playing that shot a high percentage of the time. I think seeing a person opting for that shot choice would pose a bigger question to me than , why is he using that cue.

:)

Clearly....

YMMV
Click to expand...

I'm talking about a seven foot table.... next time my buddy comes over with his smart phone I'll have him video me shooting some jump shots. If I nail it and draw back 3 or 4 times out of 5, you might reconsider...

But of course in a match with higher stakes, play a kick safe if you're more likely to pull it off. But I'm comfortable enough with my jump stroke, that I'm more likely to make the jump than get safe with a kick in some situations.

I should have worded the thread a little differently; of the hundred or more matches I've watched on youtube/ustream, I've never seen anyone jump full cue... except Earl once or twice... they always go for the jump cue, and sometimes miss the pocket or miss shape... when they could have jumped full cue and retained their accuracy and control. Maybe they're all shooting with Meucci and elkmasters...

I get it, more than half of the jump shots we face are easier to execute with a short cue. But for me to have NEVER seen a full cue jump in a professional match is off-putting, considering I find myself jumping full cue often and with accuracy as only an amateur player.

It's Just a curiosity I've had. I'm in no way hating on jump cues. I love my Lomax.
 
spindoctor9 said:
I'm talking about a seven foot table.... next time my buddy comes over with his smart phone I'll have him video me shooting some jump shots. If I nail it and draw back 3 or 4 times out of 5, you might reconsider...

But of course in a match with higher stakes, play a kick safe if you're more likely to pull it off. But I'm comfortable enough with my jump stroke, that I'm more likely to make the jump than get safe with a kick in some situations.

I should have worded the thread a little differently; of the hundred or more matches I've watched on youtube/ustream, I've never seen anyone jump full cue... except Earl once or twice... they always go for the jump cue, and sometimes miss the pocket or miss shape... when they could have jumped full cue and retained their accuracy and control. Maybe they're all shooting with Meucci and elkmasters...

I get it, more than half of the jump shots we face are easier to execute with a short cue. But for me to have NEVER seen a full cue jump in a professional match is off-putting, considering I find myself jumping full cue often and with accuracy as only an amateur player.

It's Just a curiosity I've had. I'm in no way hating on jump cues. I love my Lomax.
Click to expand...

OK, first the slam...

7 footer ? :eek: Are there any long shots on a 7 footer ? :)

Sarcastic...

How many of these shots do you see the Pros missing are ON 7's ?

Serious...

On a 7' yea, any jump is a 'gimmie' with a jump cue regardless, honestly the only reason to use a full cue MAYBE would be a minor jump at great length since it's hard to generate a ton of CB speed with a jumper.

Inquisitive...

Why do you believe these 'missed' jump shots would be executed any better by these same players with a full cue? Would it not make sense that they are shooting the shot in a way that offers the highest probability for them to make based on thier previous experience? What if they jump worse with a full cue at any distance?

:)
 
RRfireblade said:
OK, first the slam...

7 footer ? :eek: Are there any long shots on a 7 footer ? :)

Sarcastic...

How many of these shots do you see the Pros missing are ON 7's ?

Serious...

On a 7' yea, any jump is a 'gimmie' with a jump cue regardless, honestly the only reason to use a full cue MAYBE would be a minor jump at great length since it's hard to generate a ton of CB speed with a jumper.

Inquisitive...

Why do you believe these 'missed' jump shots would be executed any better by these same players with a full cue? Would it not make sense that they are shooting the shot in a way that offers the highest probability for them to make based on thier previous experience? What if they jump worse with a full cue at any distance?

:)
Click to expand...

For ME, some jump shots are just easier with a full cue, both in pocketing the ball and controlling the cue ball, and I am only wondering why it is seemingly so different for others. That is all. In other words, I find that I shoot certain jump shots better with a full cue than the short cue, but it seems everyone else will jump ONLY with a short cue... and often miss a hanger. Being cramped up trying to short stroke with a 40" cue takes away from my accuracy, especially being 6'3, 250 with a long arm span...

This was a pretty dumb thread to be honest, I was drunk when I posted it and it didn't come out quite right...

I would expect to see jumps with both the full cue and short cue at the professional level, as both have their advantages in certain situations. But it seems like only the old timers will jump full cue... and since the jump cues came out, no one remembers how easy some jumps are with the full cue...

Maybe it's just cause I'm a bigger and strong guy; maybe it's just not feasible for the average person to jump as accurately full cue as with the short one... I just don't know... but I'll keep firing em in full cue, as it always seems to keep my opponents intimidated ;)
 
It's just so much easier to jump with a jump cue , IMO on any shot.

Todays LDs shafts and soft layered tips make jumping with a full cue considerably harder than years ago. Before short cues, all you had to jump with was a full cue and myself , I did it pretty regularly. With a hard one piece tip and a 13mm shaft.... you know... a 58" jump cue. :) But even then, a full ball was a heck of a jump and you had to really let it fly. There's not much control there. Now if your just skipping by a partial ball , thats a whole different story. Arguably maybe not even a real 'jump'.

Being 6' 3" on a 7' foot table, your playing cue is pretty dang close to a jump cue for you anyway. :grin-square:

Like everything else, what ever works for 'you' is all the matters. I'll let others deceide what they think works best for themselves. ;)
 
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