Gabriels Pool Tables

realkingcobra said:
When facings wear through the rail cloth at the points of all the pockets before the cloth is even close to wearing out, you'd sing a different song all together...if that happened on your table with 3/8" thick facings, not to mention a ball coming to a dead stop when hitting directly into the points of any of the pockets:rolleyes:
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You didn't answer my question Glen. How many years did Diamond market their tables (that you say you designed) that bank short? Thanks so much for answering.
 
What all of you fail to see, is the real Gabriel's pool table, the 90% MDF wood, 10% Poplar. The paint peels off the skirts, and when the MDF expands from humidity, look at the finish on the rail skirts, it looks like a paint job done over another paint that didn't mix well, and starts cracking in the finish real bad. Steel frame equals a level slate?????....if that was the case, why the need for leveling bolts? Second, when it comes to using the leveling system, the bolts used at the seams on both sides to correct the slates for the frame being swayback, don't help much when after the slates have been leveled, you bolt the rails down...and the pressure from bolting the rails down...pull the slate down as well, in all the places there are no leveling bolts. The cushion nose height is to high for the rails being 1 5/8" thick, which is why the play so slow....but, what would I know;)...I just work on them...once in a while, so I see them for how they really are....not just the way they look;)
 
Idaho said:
You didn't answer my question Glen. How many years did Diamond market their tables (that you say you designed) that bank short? Thanks so much for answering.
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For your information, I have never designed rails that bank short, so don't start some shit you know nothing about;)
 
realkingcobra said:
4 5/8" corners I believe, and I think 5 1/8" sides, I may be off just a touch, and that's with 3/8" facings, but I know they're not ProCut 4 1/2" corners and 5" sides.
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That's too big in my opinion, so if you extend the rails, the facing issue is fixed correct?
 
realkingcobra said:
For your information, I have never designed rails that bank short, so don't start some shit you know nothing about;)
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You're right, I don't know anything about it. Just going off of what you told me. How many years were they out before they fixed it? Seems weird you would set up all those tables that banked wrong.
 
UPlayLucky said:
That's too big in my opinion, so if you extend the rails, the facing issue is fixed correct?
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Yes, in order to drop the facing thickness, the cushions would have to be replace, "they'll be to short" and the sub-rails extened so that a normal facing can be used to finish the pocket opening to size. Any table can be made to play at its best....provided there's a solid foundation to start with. Gabriel's have their flaws, but nothing that can't be fixed if the mechanic knows what he's doing, but even still, that don't make up for the MDF and bad finish work on the table itself. Metric bolts can be a pain in the butt to find if any are missing, and the rail & skirt hardware are a real pain in the ass, which make them hard to assemble correctly, but...that can be overcome as well.

Glen
 
I have a Gabriel nine footer at my house that I bought in Las Vegas in 2002 at the nine ball championships. Absolutely the best table ever, nothing but compliments on it, plays great, when I had it recovered the technician couldn't believe how well it was built. Thumbs up for Gabriel tables!
 
Idaho said:
You're right, I don't know anything about it. Just going off of what you told me. How many years were they out before they fixed it? Seems weird you would set up all those tables that banked wrong.
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AM I DIAMOND?...call the sales department and ask someone who works there your questions! Does YOUR GC bank short????...because that's one I DID work on...and I know...you're going to tell me back....ZACH worked on your table not me....I don't really give a shit...who in the hell do you think taught ZACH how to do this kind of work?
 
realkingcobra said:
AM I DIAMOND?...call the sales department and ask someone who works there your questions! Does YOUR GC bank short????...because that's one I DID work on...and I know...you're going to tell me back....ZACH worked on your table not me....I don't really give a shit...who in the hell do you think taught ZACH how to do this kind of work?
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Fair enough, thanks. You're very critical of other table manufacturers that have flaws in their tables, so I was wondering why you set up so many diamond tables with a flaw in the rails? BTW, you told me you designed the diamond pro-am, along with the fact you pioneered the marketing of McDermott cues. I can use smilies too:););););););););)
 
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realkingcobra said:
..if that happened on your table with 3/8" thick facings, not to mention a ball coming to a dead stop when hitting directly into the points of any of the pockets:rolleyes:
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Not that I have any credibility to add to RKCs statements, buts speaking from my own trial and error process of dealing with facings here is what I found. I was told not to use a thick facing and extend the subrail correctly.

I was to stubborn to listen and went with a 1/4' neoprene 60 durometer facing. While the cushion replacement project I did went way beyond my expectations and turned out great, I did discover the "thick" facing issues RKC is hinting at. Not so much the cloth wearing through (yet, and I don't think it will, but I could be wrong here as well. Time will tell), but using that thick of a facing, will certainly affect a ball rebound when striking the the outer facing rail nose side. It doesn't stop dead for me, but it's bounce is I'd guess 60% less than had it struck the cushion nose. See the picture below of 1/4" facings how they extend the cushion nose play side.

As well as the ball striking outside of the pocket, if a super slow roller (and I do mean incredibly slow), ball hits the thick facing inside of the pocket (imagine a slow down the rail roller), the ball duds and at times just stops if the roll is slow enough (I'm not talking about pocket speed, I'm talking about a roll where you question it will even get there). Now that ball may not have fallen on a thin facing as well, but some of them occasionally do fall, whereas they won't for sure with the thicker facing.

This is all with my 1/4" facings, I can't imagine what 3/8" would play like. I was going to redo my cushions and extend the rails correctly. I'm just going to wait until it's re-cloth time. The rest of the table plays great by my anal standards and all my other friends who have played on it ranging from AAmaster league players to C level players. As mentioned, I WILL be redoing the rubber and extending the rails here in about 6 or so months. My cloth is already wearing from 3-10 hours a day of use and abuse. My table gets more play time than most of my local poolhalls.

Dopc.

Here are the 1/4" facings. Notice how the outer edge of the facing extends the nose of the rubber cushion, when struck that is what gives a different rebound over the rubber cushion itself.
3Lx0Ton.jpg
 
Idaho said:
Fair enough, thanks. You're very critical of other table manufacturers that have flaws in their tables, so I was wondering why you set up so many diamond tables with a flaw in the rails? BTW, you told me you designed the diamond pro-am, along with the fact you pioneered the marketing of McDermott cues. I can use smilies too:););););););););)
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I'm critical of all table manuctures, that includes Diamond as well, but is not limited fust to Diamond....that's right Idaha. Furtermore, since you persist in trying your best to be a TROLL, I did create the market for McDermott AND Joss West cues in Europe way back in 1980 while living in Germany for 6 years, I was the only pereon selling 2 piece cues over there at that time. AND for your information, the Diamond smart table came before the ProAm, I spent 7 months at the Diamond factory working with them incorporating my coin-op design of my King Cobra tables with Diamond's design to come up with the Diamond coin operated pool table. So, if you think your going to try and catch me here on AZ telling you something that didn't take place, you're wrong, as it's all common knowledge here on AZ.

BUT, when I pass through Idaho again on my way to WA, AK. the headlines might read, "Senior citizen beats down local punk for being so damn stupid and disrespectful";)
 
realkingcobra said:
I'm critical of all table manuctures, that includes Diamond as well, but is not limited fust to Diamond....that's right Idaha. Furtermore, since you persist in trying your best to be a TROLL, I did create the market for McDermott AND Joss West cues in Europe way back in 1980 while living in Germany for 6 years, I was the only pereon selling 2 piece cues over there at that time. AND for your information, the Diamond smart table came before the ProAm, I spent 7 months at the Diamond factory working with them incorporating my coin-op design of my King Cobra tables with Diamond's design to come up with the Diamond coin operated pool table. So, if you think your going to try and catch me here on AZ telling you something that didn't take place, you're wrong, as it's all common knowledge here on AZ.

BUT, when I pass through Idaho again on my way to WA, AK. the headlines might read, "Senior citizen beats down local punk for being so damn stupid and disrespectful";)
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Hey Cobra, it seems you know the European market quite well, is there any importers of Diamond tables in Europe?

Thanks :)
 
Kim Bye said:
Hey Cobra, it seems you know the European market quite well, is there any importers of Diamond tables in Europe?

Thanks :)
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Yes, Diamond has a distributorship in Finland, I think their contact is Diamondeurope.com or something like that:D
 
A friend has one and it is awesome. Earth magnets attach the rails and they come with interchangable rails to allow you to put snooker, billiards, or regular pool rails on. Have played hundreds of games on it and love it. Having said that, if i was buying a new table it would be a Diamond.
 
Dopc said:
As mentioned, I WILL be redoing the rubber and extending the rails here in about 6 or so months. My cloth is already wearing from 3-10 hours a day of use and abuse. My table gets more play time than most of my local poolhalls.

Dopc.
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If you had it all to do over again. Would you still choose Gabriels or something else?
 
infest said:
If you had it all to do over again. Would you still choose Gabriels or something else?
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Unfortunately I do not own a Gabriels table. I own a Connelly Kayenta, a very well constructed table with good quality slate, aside from the rail issues which are addressable and I have done so as best I can, until the next time I have the table tore down.
Either my rails had shrunk in height, or the nose height was to low from the factory causing some pretty sever ball hop and irregular bank angle issues. I had to elevate the rails and maintain the subrail bevel angle to keep within the k-66 cushion spec( [URL="http://www.pooltablefeltcloth.com/Cushions-Supplies/Championship/Cushions-Mounting-Guide/K66-mounting-guide-1-58.shtm" ]link here for some general information regarding k-66 general specs according to Championship [/URL] ).
Had I extended the subrails properly and used an 1/8th" facing, the table would play as close to perfect as "it" is capable of in my opinion. When my cloth is due to be replaced, I will address and execute these minor details at that time. You can see more pictures by following the link in my signature of why I went through all of this to begin with.

Dopc.

EDIT: My apologies for, pardon the pun, derailing the OPs original threads topic.
 
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Table

realkingcobra said:
Wrong on many levels;)
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Snooker tables can be found in all sizes in euorpe,6-7-8-9-10-12'

I know the differences your talking about, your referring to the build/structure of the table. But if the average consumer looks at the rails,pockets/corner miter he/she would agree that a diamond looks similar and shares characteristics. The europeans would take hole saws to carrom/3c rails to make a pocket billiard table" hence the look with no pocket irons" is the euro look.
The euro drop pockets could hold 15 balls before the American tables could.
Some Euro rails and frames have a "iron clad" design with thick-heavy slates in which most cases the table needs a millwright to set the table up because most installers freeze when if they see " iron clad" euro tables < for that reason' pool table installers are no bridge builders....

You build your bridge out of wood and I'm going to build mine of steel and see who's hits the river first'


Rob.M
 
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