My theory on Deflection

[nineballsafety8]

Earlier today someone asked a question about LD and what characteristics lended themselves to makind LD... I responded, and after posting, I felt so passionate about what I said, I wanted to start a new thread to ensure as many people saw it as possible.

Curious as to what you all think of my opinion:

The concept of "avoiding deflection" is one that I find rather funny, and at one point, I bought into all the hype also... But

Yes there is a BUT

no shaft, ON EARTH, regardless of who makes it, or what fantastical mysterious material it is made of will guarantee 100% knowledge of how the cueball will react on any given shot... simply not possible.

The ONLY way to get CLOSE to that 100% confidence in KNOWING how the cueball is going to react when struck of center... is to do it, OVER AND OVER AND OVER

To prove this point, I had a cuemaker put on a 1" brass ferrule on one of my spare shafts... and let me tell you what a 13.2mm BRASS ferrule is freaking HEAVY!!!!
And I played with it, ALOT, for about a week... and guess what, I could run racks with it... with HUGE amounts of deflection... HUGE amounts, like a full ball and a half difference across the length of a table.

And I would challenge people to make a half ball hit cut shot, with inside spin to go 2 rails and get back up table... most everyone who tried, missed the object ball by ATLEAST a full inch.

What does this prove... NOTHING

Other than... buy a cue, and PLAY WITH IT!!!
after 8-10 hours a consistant play (assuming an average speed player), your game will adapt to your shaft and it won't matter AT ALL how much deflection your cue has... as long as you stick with your gear... you will get better, PERIOD

STOP BUYING SHAFTS, and HIT MORE BALLS!!!

 

[poolhustler]

you're not stating anything new here!!

find a cue you are happy with, get intimate with them and stick with it.

same thing I do with girls.....

 

[3andstop]

Thank you. Absolutely, there is no shaft that doesn't deflect. Once you get used to it, its all good.

All the shafts I buy are on ebay. 30 or 40 bucks. Wrong taper, (for me) wrong tip, (for me). So, amazingly, I sand the shaft to the taper I like, and... can ya believe it .... I change the tip to something I like. What a revelation!

Now, some people just have a lot of money and they can afford to piss it away, but for those of us that don't fall into that category, I agree with you! There's no reason on earth to spend even a hundred bucks for a stick of wood unless they were not available for 30.

And, as an added benefit, if they ever warp, break, or get lost, who gives a crap. BTW, I've never had one warp or break on me in all the time I've bought them online.

 

[The Renfro]

Or if you can't play and practice for hours and hours each week to stay sharp on the adjusting for deflection you definitely need to think about going low deflection so you are aiming closer to center ball aiming when using english =)

Same thing I think as far as new players..LD technolgy is for them as well..... Any equation is harder to solve with more variables... And having a variable variable (Standard wooden shaft) means you may get some wrong answers (misses) even tho you solved the equation correctly...

You can play with anything.. That's been documented... The reasoning behind the why would you still needs to be researched.. I think closed minds and hard heads may be the final answer for many...

For those players that have played decades with standard shafts I will issue a pass.. Old Dogs and new tricks is pretty accurate for humans as well as out canine friends... The change over and relearning may not be possible because of hard wiring.....


Chris

 

[3andstop]

If you can't practice enough ... then low deflection shafts will allow you to miss the pocket by a little less on shots that deflect.

Come on ... listen to you guys. If we agree that all shafts deflect until you get used to them, what the hell is the difference how much you miss by. :killingme:

 

[KRJ]

STOP BUYING SHAFTS, and HIT MORE BALLS!!!

Not sure I understand. Don't buy shafts. But you have a photo of you shooting with a cue, that correct me if i'm wrong, has a shaft

You and others do buy maple shafts, and others buy a LD shaft. Why does it matter ? The cost is not that far apart really .

 

[nineballsafety8]

Come on RJ... you know what I meant...

Stop continually buying shafts, in hopes that it will make you a world beater... familiarity with your equipment, confidence in your ability, and PRACTICE, is the only real way to be a champion.

 

[jburkm002]

My theory on deflection. Deflection is an issue because the majority of us don't play pool properly. Myself included. We rather look fancy with lots of side spin then play the game the proper way. Or shall I say the most efficient and consistent way. Like the pro's. They understand tangent angles and setting up proper angles. They are very efficient with cue ball control. Most of use are trying to leave it in an area while top players are trying to leave the cue on a spot. Just saying most of us over play the cue ball. Don't think the pro's could play on the tightest pockets shooting well over .900 and play like most of us do. Sure they have to use english like everyone else. However and I may be wrong but I think they use more center, high and low. Working tangent lines and ball speed. Just my thought.

 

[alstl]

I don't use a low deflection shaft but I understand the concept. Less deflection equals less adjusting for deflection. If I wasn't already used to a regular shaft I'd use a low deflection shaft.

 

[JohnPT]

I guess it wasn't such a good idea wanting a cue that shot straighter in the first place.

 

[nobcitypool]

So what do you think is easier, adjusting your aim by 1/4" or by 3 1/2"? One of the top professionals could beat me with a broom stick but that doesn't mean that's their tool of choice.

I think the lesser skilled players will definitely benefit more by using an LD shaft. Those that mostly play center CB will definitely benefit. Nobody can perfectly hit CCB perfectly or consistently, you're off a little to a lot depending on the skill level. That minor variance is essentially a non factor with an LD shaft while it can be enough to miss the shot with a heavy maple shaft.

I don't see why a high level player would switch to an LD shaft if they've learned the nuances of their maple shaft. However, there's certainly a number of professionals who have switched and like it.

IMHO, if it helps more players enjoy the game, it is a good thing. Is it absolutely necessary, not even close. An LD shaft won't make a B player an A player. But you also cannot dismiss the potential advantages of the LD shaft to numerous people. It's back to personal preference.

 

[nineballsafety8]

I guess it wasn't such a good idea wanting a cue that shot straighter in the first place.

So... why doesn't SVB use an LD shaft?
best player in the world right... he would obviously play better with an LD shaft...

OR how about these
Greenleaf
Mosconi
Crane
Seagal
Buddy Hall
Strickland
Efren
Fats

ALL considered to be THE BEST at one point or another, in one or more games...

NONE of which EVER played with an LD shaft...

they just played... ALOT

 

[nineballsafety8]

If you watch the TAR podcast between Corey Duel and John Scmidt... John talks about how switching to the OB (which he loved), RUINED his game for almost TWO YEARS. While he was able to run a 403 the same day he got the shaft... that was in Straight pool, with minimal cueball moment, and LOTS of natural shape with pattern play.. his game in ANY rotation pool went to ABSOLUTE CRAP (his opinion, not mine), due to switching from the STANDARD Bobby Hunter shaft that he was USED TO

 

[slide13]

I don't think the big advantage is that you have to compensate less directly, I think the big advantage is the margin of error. If you have a shaft where the ball deflects 10" for a table long shot and another that deflects 5" you have to compensate either way, but if you are off in your compensation by 3% then you're missing your contact point by .30" with the standard shaft. If you are using the LD shaft then your contact point is only off by .15". That difference could mean the difference between making and missing the shot.

To me, LD isn't necessarily about reducing the amount one must compensate, it's about minimizing the misses, hopefully to a level that still allows the ball to drop.

Then again...I've only demoed LD shafts and don't actually play with one.

 

[Andrew Manning]

If you watch the TAR podcast between Corey Duel and John Scmidt... John talks about how switching to the OB (which he loved), RUINED his game for almost TWO YEARS. While he was able to run a 403 the same day he got the shaft... that was in Straight pool, with minimal cueball moment, and LOTS of natural shape with pattern play.. his game in ANY rotation pool went to ABSOLUTE CRAP (his opinion, not mine), due to switching from the STANDARD Bobby Hunter shaft that he was USED TO

Yeah, when you've learned to play pro-speed and hit a million balls with a standard shaft, don't switch.

If you're a beginner, though, you might want to choose the one that's going to make it easier to learn and improve. And by "might", I mean "obviously".

-Andrew

 

[3andstop]

Yeah, not much of a price difference is a relative statement. Depends on how mad you are at your money or how deeply you're swimming in it.

I think this is a low deflection shaft. Forgive me if it isn't, I don't buy them because I don't like being robbed.


I think this isn't a low deflection shaft. But who knows maybe it is.

Both 5/16 x 18.


You young upcoming players have to stop listening to all this bullsh!t hype. Knowledge and practice improve your game not sales gimmicks.

You think Mosconi or Crane or even Earl or Efren needed this crap to play better. Work got them better. Hey ... if ya got the money to burn ... why not, they do make good conversation pieces I suppose.

 

[poolguy4u]

My theory on deflection. Deflection is an issue because the majority of us don't play pool properly. Myself included. We rather look fancy with lots of side spin then play the game the proper way. Or shall I say the most efficient and consistent way. Like the pro's. They understand tangent angles and setting up proper angles. They are very efficient with cue ball control. Most of use are trying to leave it in an area while top players are trying to leave the cue on a spot. Just saying most of us over play the cue ball. Don't think the pro's could play on the tightest pockets shooting well over .900 and play like most of us do. Sure they have to use english like everyone else. However and I may be wrong but I think they use more center, high and low. Working tangent lines and ball speed. Just my thought.

:scratchhead:

Pro or amateur...we are all the same. High deflection or low deflection...really doesn't matter.

You play with a shaft long enough, it's all the same.:thumbup:

 

[KRJ]

If you watch the TAR podcast between Corey Duel and John Scmidt... John talks about how switching to the OB (which he loved), RUINED his game for almost TWO YEARS. While he was able to run a 403 the same day he got the shaft... that was in Straight pool, with minimal cueball moment, and LOTS of natural shape with pattern play.. his game in ANY rotation pool went to ABSOLUTE CRAP (his opinion, not mine), due to switching from the STANDARD Bobby Hunter shaft that he was USED TO

so, you just contradicted yourself. you said an avg player can figure out any cue in 8 hours, yet a world class pro, could not figure out an LD in 2 years ???

Can't have it both ways.

Oh, by the way, there are plenty of pro's that play with LD shafts. It's what works for you. Not everyone is the same. Not everyone plays with the same type of baseball bat, glove, hockey stick, bowling ball, etc. But I don't see any other sport other than pool make it such a big deal as if there is only one way to do something.

 

[bdorman]

If we agree that all shafts deflect until you get used to them, what the hell is the difference how much you miss by. :killingme:

Margin of error.

IMHO a low vs. regular shaft margin of error is like the margin of error on a 15-degree cut shot vs. a 70-degree cut shot. The sweet spot on the 70-degree cut shot is much smaller.

You might be able to make the 70-degree cut shot every time, in which case there's no difference between 15- and 70-degrees. For me, there's a difference.

 

[nineballsafety8]

so, you just contradicted yourself. you said an avg player can figure out any cue in 8 hours, yet a world class pro, could not figure out an LD in 2 years ???

Can't have it both ways.

Oh, by the way, there are plenty of pro's that play with LD shafts. It's what works for you. Not everyone is the same. Not everyone plays with the same type of baseball bat, glove, hockey stick, bowling ball, etc. But I don't see any other sport other than pool make it such a big deal as if there is only one way to do something.

I understand where you were trying to go with this... but that is why I said "your average speed player"... John had THOUSANDS of hours of muscle memory to "unlearn"... whereas your average speed player has much less engrained time to overcome