Visuals question for CTE

mohrt said:
I'll try, even though I'm pretty sure this is a CTE FAQ by now :)



There is only one head position where your visual of both lines is the strongest. Move your head a millimeter either way and you lose it. I find it beneficial to first find the CTEL, then move the eyes until the A/B/C line comes into view while still having a strong CTEL visual. That gives you the "outer most edge".



This will depend on the given perception. If you look at Stans video demonstration of the 5 balls that use the same CB/OB visual to make all 5 shots, the center-line you are referring to will be thinner and thinner to the OB as you move across the table. This isn't something you have to adjust for, because how the CB/OB are oriented on the 2x1 surface of the table determine this perception. You *could* force yourself to use the same physical perception for each shot, but it won't look right and it also won't work. See here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1Psy5hOJT0
Click to expand...
Thank you for taking for the explanation but tell me how can those 5 shots have the same visuals yet produce different fixed edges on the cue ball, or a thinner cut. The cueball and objectball are the same distance from each other so if there is only one place in which to see the visuals for the shot how can the same cueball and objectball distance produce more than one head position without changing visuals?

This would help me tremendously. Can you find the visuals for the shot in that video that is closest to the pocket and then without moving your head use a single visual (much like Stan did when lining up center to center) only make your single line go from the edge of cueball to wherever it lines up straight to the objectball. Since the two visuals leave you not directly in line witb edge to a I image A single line visual through the edge will line up somewhere else on the object ball. Let me know if the single visual goes to 1/8,2/8,3/8 etc. A being 6/8th and C being 2/8ths.

I can then reverse the action by finding the single line then without moving my head I can look to see CTE and e/a as you see it.

Thanks
 
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Actually this is a good idea :)

For example, if some shot is CTEL+A and a left sweep, and when you aquire your visuals in the same time the center of the CB is, for example, aimed at some fixed spot on the OB while standing and pre-sweep, for this specific shot, then the visuals would be easy to explain.

Set up this shot, align center of the CB to this spot on the OB, now you are aligned to CTEL+A...Do this for several different shots and visuals are learned and clearly shown and how you're supposed to look at them.

Can some of the more experienced users do this, it would surely be beneficial?


(((Satori))) said:
Thank you for taking for the explanation but tell me how can those 5 shots have the same visuals yet produce different fixed edges on the cue ball, or a thinner cut. The cueball and objectball are the same distance from each other so if there is only one place in which to see the visuals for the shot how can the same cueball and objectball distance produce more than one head position without changing visuals?

This would help me tremendously. Can you find the visuals for the shot in that video that is closest to the pocket and then without moving your head use a single visual (much like Stan did when lining up center to center) only make your single line go from center of cueball to wherever it lines up straight to the objectball. Let me know if the single visual goes to 1/8,2/8,3/8 etc.

I can then reverse the action by finding the single line then without moving my head I can look to see CTE and e/a as you see it.

Thanks
Click to expand...
 
Mirza said:
Actually this is a good idea :)

For example, if some shot is CTEL+A and a left sweep, and when you aquire your visuals in the same time the center of the CB is, for example, aimed at some fixed spot on the OB while standing and pre-sweep, for this specific shot, then the visuals would be easy to explain.

Set up this shot, align center of the CB to this spot on the OB, now you are aligned to CTEL+A...Do this for several different shots and visuals are learned and clearly shown and how you're supposed to look at them.

Can some of the more experienced users do this, it would surely be beneficial?
Click to expand...

I've tried it in the past. Also tried paying attention to where the tip is aimed after performing the sweep.

Both methods work to an extent, but neither will give you consistent results. Trust me, I know from first hand experience.

Truly the best way to learn how to see the visuals is to use the striped balls from an old Centennial set.
 
BeiberLvr said:
I've tried it in the past. Also tried paying attention to where the tip is aimed after performing the sweep.

Both methods work to an extent, but neither will give you consistent results. Trust me, I know from first hand experience.

Truly the best way to learn how to see the visuals is to use the striped balls from an old Centennial set.
Click to expand...

I see no reason that a single shot could not be translated.
 
Mirza said:
Actually this is a good idea :)

For example, if some shot is CTEL+A and a left sweep, and when you aquire your visuals in the same time the center of the CB is, for example, aimed at some fixed spot on the OB while standing and pre-sweep, for this specific shot, then the visuals would be easy to explain.

Set up this shot, align center of the CB to this spot on the OB, now you are aligned to CTEL+A...Do this for several different shots and visuals are learned and clearly shown and how you're supposed to look at them.

Can some of the more experienced users do this, it would surely be beneficial?
Click to expand...

I had to edit my post so that the single line goes through the edge and not the center to ensure that the single line connects to a part of the objectball.

Hopefully Stan or someone can translate two or three shots from that video so that we can use the reverse ranslation to see what they see.
 
(((Satori))) said:
The cueball and object ball are the same distance from each other so if there is only one place in which to see the visuals for the shot how can the same cueball and objectball distance produce more than one head position without changing visuals?
Click to expand...

That is pretty much the heart of the system. I can only repeat what has been said over and over: The specific perception determines the strongest visual. That is, the placement of the CB/OB on the rectangular surface affect how your eyes physically line up when you find the strongest visual (outer most edge). The question isn't really "how?" but "why?". You don't really need to know HOW to get these different physical line-ups, because when you do find the strongest visual alignment, this is just what happens and you can plainly observe how the CCB line aligns with the OB thinner and thinner as the CB/OB positions move across the table. So then the ultimate question is "why?". Why does our perception change our physical alignment shot to shot? The best answer we have is, its all about perception. If you take two specific CB/OB coordinates on the table and then line up a specific A/B/C CTEL (strongest) alignment, this will result in a unique physical offset for that shot. It is repeatable and consistent. Move either ball even slightly, you get a new unique offset. How your eyes perceive the CB/OB on the 2x1 table surface ultimately affect the physical offset. We don't really have discreet math for it, but it is teachable, demonstrable, consistent and repeatable.

I will stress that reverse engineering the technicalities will not help the learning process. It is more about applying the system as described, and observing the results.
 
DTL said:
Set up a simple 3.5 foot straight in shot (CTE / A or C). Try putting your vision center right in the middle of the the two lines. Then do the correct visual sweep and see if you land on the shot line.........with this shot you'll know if you're on the shot line when down on the shot (won't even have to shoot it).

And that's all I have to say about that, lol.
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Is that where you see all of your visuals from... vision center centered between the two lines?
 
I don't think centered between the two lines would be technically correct (although not a horrible way to describe it). When you have your perception of the two points, you then have a perception of looking at the CB as a whole. It is the line this is on that you are looking for. You pivot/sweep from that line. Depending upon the shot, that is not necessarily a line that bisects the triangle created by CTE, Edge to A,B, C or whatever. Depending upon a number of factors (distance between CB/OB, cut angle, etc.) that line will sometimes appear to be closer to the CTE or Edge to whatever line. That's overthinking it. Obtain the correct perception, find the fixed CB, pivot/sweep, straight stroke and shot goes into Center Pocket.
 
nobcitypool said:
I don't think centered between the two lines would be technically correct (although not a horrible way to describe it). When you have your perception of the two points, you then have a perception of looking at the CB as a whole. It is the line this is on that you are looking for. You pivot/sweep from that line. Depending upon the shot, that is not necessarily a line that bisects the triangle created by CTE, Edge to A,B, C or whatever. Depending upon a number of factors (distance between CB/OB, cut angle, etc.) that line will sometimes appear to be closer to the CTE or Edge to whatever line. That's overthinking it. Obtain the correct perception, find the fixed CB, pivot/sweep, straight stroke and shot goes into Center Pocket.
Click to expand...

Excellent post!

Stan Shuffett
 
DTL said:
I suppose if I said yes you'd disprove it mathematically somehow saying it couldn't work that way. I just get where I can perceive both lines the best.....probably close to the center.
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I am not trying to disprove it mathmatically. I am trying to see what you do. I have seen enough credible people swear to me that it works and I am truly seeking to experiment with it.
 
(((Satori))) said:
I am not trying to disprove it mathmatically. I am trying to see what you do. I have seen enough credible people swear to me that it works and I am truly seeking to experiment with it.
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Nice to see that you have come over to the Dark Side.

Next step is to do what the naysayers never do - go to the table and try it.

Here's Gerry's beautifully simple demonstration using a manual pivot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNdq1-kiEZo

If you can shoot those shots consistently then go to the next step - order the DVDs.
 
mista335 said:
Nice to see that you have come over to the Dark Side.

Next step is to do what the naysayers never do - go to the table and try it.

Here's Gerry's beautifully simple demonstration using a manual pivot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNdq1-kiEZo

If you can shoot those shots consistently then go to the next step - order the DVDs.
Click to expand...

I have been playing with it lately. I know that I am not 100% doing it right but here is what I have been doing.

1) Line up center to center then see if the angle of cut is closer to 15, 30, 45.

2) Rotate to my visuals. For me I draw a line from center to edge and edge to abc then in my mind I shade the center. I rotate to where I am lined up in the center of the shaded area.
3) From here I just drop into the shot pretty much relying on my sub to do its thing.

I will say that the balls are going center pocket. I know what I have been doing is not pro one exactly and probrably has a heavy reliance on my previous experience but with the combination of the friends I have been talking to a long with the experience I have had lately experimenting. I will probably buy dvd 2 to add another tool to my arsenal.
 
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(((Satori))) said:
I have been playing with it lately. I am not 100% sure I'm doing it right. Here is what I have been doing.

1) Line up center to center then see if the angle of cut is closer to 15, 30, 45.

2) Rotate to my visuals. For me I draw a line from center to edge and edge to abc then I shade the center. I rotate to where I am lined up in the center of the shaded area.

3) From here I just drop into the shot pretty much relying on my sub to do its thing.

I will say that the balls are going center pocket. I know what I have been doing is not pro one exactly and probrably has a heavy reliance on my previous experience but with the combination of the friends I have been talking to a long with the experience I have had lately experimenting. I will probably buy dvd 2 to add another tool to my arsenal.
Click to expand...

Nice!, I can relate to the steps that you mentioned. I did those steps (1 & 2) prior to having the DVDs and it works well for me.

Now that I have the DVDs... it feels great (not as proficient as gerry or others but it satisfies me).
 
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