Chalk... Hate vs Love.....

The Renfro

Outsville.com
Silver Member
Here is the deal... Outsville has been working on chalk for 2 years+ and we are getting close... Lots of players can't tell a difference but many players can... We get comments like Kamui is too greasy and sticks to everything to Predator just feels too abrasive which is why Balabushka got so few followers... If you have tried several brands please take some time to chime in on your thought as to what makes the existing brands good or bad....

I will start with Kamui 98... Love the chalk but it sticks to everything... Have given 3 cubes away because I use the measles ball and that ball picks up everything......
 
I actually use the original Kamui .98 as a basecoat on my tip prior to each set. Then I chalk up with Masters that I've baked in the oven. I can't really describe what that feels like. But, I LOVE it. And miscues are virtually non-existent.

With that said, after the success and quality of your Ki-Tech tips, I'll try anything you put out there, Chris.
 
I am still in the process of deciding which chalk I like the best. So far I have tried Silver Cup, Kamui .98, Kamui 1.21, Masters Blue, Blue Diamond, and Predator. Out of all these so far I did like the Kamui 1.21 the best, but I quit using it since it just got everywhere and stuck to everything. I liked the Silver Cup the least. Masters has probably been the one that I have actually liked the most overall. The Blue Diamond just didnt feel like it was sticking to my tip very well and the Predator felt about the same way, nearly abrasive. The Kamui .98 was also good, but like the 1.21 it just got everywhere.

So after I get a little further into my test with the Blue Diamond I am going to try some Lava Chalk. A friend of mine has some and recommended that I try it. I guess we will wait and see.
 
If you can make a chalk that out performs the Kamui 98 you will be a winner.
With my testing, The Kamui 98 is the best performing chalk by quite a margin.
It sticks very well to leather as well as non leather tips like Phenolic jump tips.
Did you get my PM to buy some of your tips?
Neil
 
If you can make a chalk that out performs the Kamui 98 you will be a winner.
With my testing, The Kamui 98 is the best performing chalk by quite a margin.
It sticks very well to leather as well as non leather tips like Phenolic jump tips.
Did you get my PM to buy some of your tips?
Neil

Neil I pulled a stupid and deleted all my PMs... I have tried going thru the html copies I saved and answering people but I may have missed yours... I normally don't do New Zealand but I think I am going to have to change my M.O. as more and more requests are coming in from other parts of the world.... I will check shipping and customs today.....
 
I use Blue Diamond and really love it.

I know we talked about this topic before and you explained the cons with it but I still prefer it over everything else right now.

I use my chalk til there's none left.

I've only went through 2 cubes of this stuff in 2 years playing every day for at least 2 hours, sometimes 10+.
 
Here is a list of the chalk I've used and if I loved or hated it:

Master's Chalk - The standard that leaves me wanting better.
Triangle Chalk - Absolute garbage.
Silver Cup Chalk - Absolute garbage.
Blue Diamond - Slightly grittier than Master's and holds well.
Kamui Chalk 0.98 & 1.21 - Too expensive, not dry enough.
Predator Chalk - Really gritty, better than Master's and holds well.
 
No mention of the Balabushka or Magic chalk.... I have a cube of the latter RHATTEN gave me for testing and so far have just had it under the microscope and not actually tried it...... Think there was one more... NIR Tournament chalk?

Chris
 
In order, I prefer the Kamui (either one, I can't tell a huge deal of difference), Predator, Blue Diamond and then whatever. I believe the consistency of the grit size for the Kamui is better than any other chalk. I like how easily it goes on the tip. It will go on the tip and stay when other chalks won't. So you don't have to dress your tip as often. I like how it stays on. In particular, I really like how it easily coats the break tip (ceramic or hard leather). Even though I lightly chalk for prior to most shots, I like how it lasts for a long time if you don't want to, forget or whatever. I don't chalk as much when I'm practicing. I also think, since the Kamui goes on with such a light touch, it will extend the tip life. Chalk is an abrasive. So if you're rubbing chalk on with more strokes and/or more pressure, you're slowly wearing your tip down.

The downside of the Kamui, as most say, is the marks it leaves on the CB. I just make sure to wipe the CB between racks. I don't see price as an issue as it last at least 3 to 6 months depending on use. The math says it costs a quarter or less per day.

Assuming you get an even, complete coat of chalk, I don't believe any chalk makes any difference in "gripping" the CB. The uniform grit might make a miniscule difference but I can't imagine that would be perceptible or make any difference to the vast majority of players.

What would I look for in evaluating a chalk choice? Goes on easy with few strokes and light pressure, provides an even, smooth coat of the tip and lasts longer - in that order of priority. If you could achieve that near what Kamui does, diminish the CB marking, I'd replace Kamui with that chalk. Obviously, it would be nice if the price were lower but again, looking at the cost on a per day usage basis, I don't find the price of the Kamui to be a factor in my decision.
 
What is selling real good for me is the Lava chalk. Players that have never spent a dime in my shop had to have some after I passed out a few samples. I thought I was stuck with the orangey tan stuff when they came out with the new blue, but the players like it better because it doesn't dirty up the shaft like the blue.
 
I've tried Masters, Silver Cup, and Blue Diamond. Masters and SC seem about the same, meh. Blue Diamond I love. Goes on nice, stays in place well, and just really works for me. I'd have no problem spending more on Kamui if it was really better, but I like BD so much I haven't felt the need to try it yet. It is pretty crazy expensive for chalk, but considering how long chalk lasts it's still a pretty minor expense in the grand scheme of being a pool player. But Blue Diamond is currently everything I want in chalk so I'll keep using it for now.

Maybe one of these days I'll run into someone using Kamui so I can give it a try to see if I'm missing out on something without even knowing it.
 
I love my predator chalk. Ive tried blue diamond and kamui and both work just fine. But for regular use i have my predator

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I've tried the Balabushka chalk since I got some for Christmas. I don't think it out performs Masters in any measurable way, and it doesn't last nearly as long. Keep in mind I'm a guy who swipes rather than grinds the chalk. When I use Masters a cube will last a really long time and the chalk remains relatively flat. The Balabushka goes quickly and develops a deep hole in the center. Also it gets my hands way more dirty than Masters.

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Really appreciate the feedback from all of you... I have already been making formula changes based on feedback from people trying the chalk here locally but it's nice to hear AZers echoing the same types of things I am hearing around here..... :thumbup::thumbup:

Chris
 
I actually use the original Kamui .98 as a basecoat on my tip prior to each set. Then I chalk up with Masters that I've baked in the oven. I can't really describe what that feels like. But, I LOVE it. And miscues are virtually non-existent.

With that said, after the success and quality of your Ki-Tech tips, I'll try anything you put out there, Chris.


I always use masters... But what's this about baking it in an oven!?


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I always use masters... But what's this about baking it in an oven!?


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Physical water burns out of clay and binders at 212F degrees... SO if the chalk is damp an oven will remove any water in a cube...

Chemical water also exists inside many clays and binders and can also be driven off but this is usually only done to reduce weight and requires 660 to 1500F degrees..

In a humid climate it may have a benefit but I am not so sure as it would be almost impossible for the chalk to soak in water deeper than just the outer surface unless a desiccant was used in it's production and I am unaware of any manufacturer using a chemical that functions as such.....

As a lark I will heat a cube up and compare it to an uncooked cube of masters under the microscope and see if I can see any changes... IF the heating does anything I should see a changes in physical characteristics as chalk functions based on it's physical properties.......

Chris
 
I've been going back and forth from the cubes of kamui .98 that i bought a few years ago and some Magic chalk that i also got a while ago.

Before that i used grey pre-flag masters, i liked the grey because it didn't dirty my ferrule or blue my shaft, but it did leave streaks on the tables at the pool room...lol
 
I always use masters... But what's this about baking it in an oven!?


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It's called overkill & a waste of time. Name 1 pro who has ever talked about baking their Masters chalk? And no it's not some secret the pros will not share. As to the original question, Masters is just fine by me, no "pre-flag", no baked & none made with ground Unicorn bone. It does what it needs to do & does it well just the way it is made.
 
I have a ton of chalk, I've used pretty much everything that is available today. I have, in order of preference:

Sportcraft, Pioneer, Brunswick
Triangle
Silver Cup
Elephant Balls
Balabushka
Master
NIR Tournament
Russian Magic Chalk
Predator
Kamui 1.21
Blue Diamond
Kamui 0.98

I love how the Kamui stays on the tip but also dislike how it stays on the cue ball. I usually keep both .98 Kamui and Blue Diamond on my table and go with a base of Kamui and preshot routine with the Blue Diamond.

If you could make a chalk somewhere between BD and Kamui .98 but keep the price reasonable, I would probably just use that all the time.
 
It's called overkill & a waste of time. Name 1 pro who has ever talked about baking their Masters chalk? And no it's not some secret the pros will not share. As to the original question, Masters is just fine by me, no "pre-flag", no baked & none made with ground Unicorn bone. It does what it needs to do & does it well just the way it is made.

There will always be a place for masters out for free in the pool rooms... For decades it has done the job... but doing the job and doing it well can be debated.... I played for about 3 years with a phenolic tip.. Granted this is not a common thing but it did teach me not all chalks are made equal... You actually can feel the ball slip some using some brands once you have been accustomed to the performance of the Kamui... It won't be a misscue and you likely will never notice it if you have not used a high performance chalk but it does happen.... I usually noticed it on draw shots where I didn't misscue but could feel that I didn't have a solid grip at contact between the tip and the ball...

Now fast forward to today and I can tell you that even tho the phenolic tip is gone and I am using one of our soft Ki-Techs when I use masters or some of the other brands I can still feel that slip from time to time.. It's not every shot but there will be several over the course of an evening....

At the level I play currently bad strokes happen from lack of time on the table... Bad enough to misscue way more than I should.. It's nice having enough grip on the end of the cue to keep them to an almost 0 occurrence level.....

Chris
 
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