CTErs vs. Ghostballers
- Thread starter 336Robin
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And so far on this forum aiming system users including you are able to do that more consistently than ghost ball users.
Ghost ball guys like Duckie and Rob are reluctant or scared to do the shot making tests and show their results.
Only Feel player iusedtoberich steps up to plate once in a while which is great.
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Sorry we disagree. I will bet serious money backing the top cte users on azb against any non pro non system user in shot making contests.
If I lose then I won't say another word about it. You find me an amateur player on azb who has stated in the past that he only uses gb and I will bet 1000 dollars that he will lose a shot making competition against a top cte user here.
So far the top performers on the public contests are mostly system users. If gb or feel is equally good then why don't the results show equal performance?
We can agree to disagree on this and when we meet in person we can talk it out on the table. To me there is Zero chance that gb is as good as cte as a method of aiming.
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Now you go from saying participate from time to time for Stevie Moore to players who regularly post for the non-system users..... Also I didn't know Landon participated in the forums. Darren Appleton, Mike Dechaine, Johnny Archer, Oscar Dominguez, Chris Bartram, and John Schmidt come immediately to mind. Now some claim Darren uses See but I am not sure if he actually does or not.
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I am leaving all the pros out of it. Of the non pro amateur players who post here who are "good" players most of them who have CHOSEN to participate in the shot making and ability tests have scored HIGHER than the non-system players.
Now what does that mean? Does it mean that all other things being equal, stroke, speed control, spin control, etc... that the difference in aiming is why they score higher on shot making tests?
I don't know, it could be the reason or it might not be. But the fact is that they have so far scored higher. Now, maybe if more "feel" or GB players would take the test then there would be more higher scores from that group. Maybe it's the fact that more system players are motivated to test themselves and see how well they can do.
But to make a blanket statement that MOST of the good non-pros on AZB don't use a system is just wrong because there is no proof of such.
But here is the thing, I might even agree with it BUT only in the context that A. we define what a good player is - and B. that we agree that MOST players anywhere haven't even tried any of the pivot/alternative systems we discuss here.
The real question would be for me, of the good players, how many HAVE tried alternatives to GB/Feel and use one or more of those methods in whole or in part in their game vs. how many tried and discarded them completely?
Then you get a clearer picture.
I can say with my hand on a Bible that everywhere I go - and I mean everywhere - someone asks me about CTE. They have seen my videos, seen Stan's videos and Gerry's and want to know more. Once I show them how it works on the table they are never unhappy about it and most are eager to learn more. At which point I refer them to Stan.
So while the majority may yet use GB/Feel that doesn't mean that the majority are completely happy with it nor that they are close minded to learning something that may help them improve even more.
We can leave all the pros out of it. Let's just do shaot making contests between us amateurs and compare results. I am pretty sure that the ranks will be very top heavy with system users.
lol, let's ignore the pros, let's ignore the long list of practically every snooker player who, for all intents and purposes, don't use any system but are the best potters in the world, let's limit it to a small group of people on an internet form. Why you think this would prove anything, I don't know.
#1 you don't know how snooker players aim. You Tube reveals that there are many ways to aim taught by snooker coaches.
#2. We are talking about amateurs here on THIS forum.
#3. Why don't YOU take the pocketing/potting tests and show us your snooker superiority?
#4. Why don't you go down to the snooker club and round up some amateurs and have them take the pool pocketing tests on a pool table and PROVE your point.
Should be easy for you to get a video camera (all smart phones have one) take Colin Colenso's test and the Billiard University test and put up the scores that blow us all away.
THEN you can prove the superiority of the snooker approach to pocketing balls.
Also, your statement about being the best potters ONLY applies to snooker. They, as a group, are not necessarily better than top professional pool players ON THE POOL TABLE. On a pool table a top professional may in fact be the better shot maker because the professional pool player plays a wider range of shots simply because more shots are possible. Thus he is not only as accurate as the snooker player for all shots that the snooker player is used to playing but has a wider range of makeable shots for which the snooker player may not be as adept. Shots where the object ball is frozen to the rail come to mind.
I am in awe of snooker players by the way. But they are specialists in their game. As Steve Davis said if a pool champion grew up playing snooker then he would likely have been a snooker champion. When one is faced with a task, learning to pocket on the snooker table one rises to the task or doesn't. Those who do compete at the high levels.
If pool was so easy then Snooker players would have robbed all the pool championships in their spare time. All the low level snooker players would be finding all the pool tournaments and dominating them, picking up an easy 5-20 thousand each time they went to an event.
So get cracking and fire that camera up and blow "us" pool players away by making the highest scores.
http://el.wiktionary.org/wiki/σύστημα
I don't know if you can see this page. It explains the meaning of the greek word "system" (σύστημα). This word in pool doesn't mean cte pro one, see system, 90/90, etc... Every player can create his own system to pocket the balls. This means that he categorizes shots and he learns where to look at and how to position his body in order to make all the shots. This is also a "system" because every shot has a "systematic approach".
You can't say that snooker players don't use systems. It is impossible to play this game at a high level without "systematic approach".
Panagiotis
What is your definition of a pro vs an amateur then. Do you consider Gerry and DTL to be amateurs? What about theUBC?
What does a shot making contest prove?
A shot making contest proves somebody has a more consistent stroke, and focus.
Person #1. The person has the best aim in the world, know exactly how to do what ever system; GB, CTE, 90/90...etc. This same person has a terrible stroke, it is inconsistent.
Person #2. Isn't the best at aiming. Doesn't know any systems, but knows why a ball goes in. His stroke is perfect, an Earl, Shane, or Stevie stroke.
Who makes more balls and why?
The reality is this, people try to improve their games by finding the magic pill. It has to be my aim. They go from system to system. When in reality the most important part is working on your stroke.
I will take a person with a better stroke.
A shot making contest proves somebody has a more consistent stroke, and focus.
Person #1. The person has the best aim in the world, know exactly how to do what ever system; GB, CTE, 90/90...etc. This same person has a terrible stroke, it is inconsistent.
Person #2. Isn't the best at aiming. Doesn't know any systems, but knows why a ball goes in. His stroke is perfect, an Earl, Shane, or Stevie stroke.
Who makes more balls and why?
The reality is this, people try to improve their games by finding the magic pill. It has to be my aim. They go from system to system. When in reality the most important part is working on your stroke.
I will take a person with a better stroke.
Shotmaking Contest
I keep seeing this migrate back to the Cters want a shot making contest. Im just not convinced that a shot making contest is indicative of proving the whole point that I would like to see proven. Im curious about the system to the point I would like to see someone play with it, get position with it and so forth and so on. I could care less about a shot making contest. I would dare say that probably in a shot making contest they might have the advantage because of the systematic approach they have. They already know what shots are going to come up and they practice those so what does that prove? I dont think it proves much on the playability scale, which is what I would be interested in.
I keep seeing this migrate back to the Cters want a shot making contest. Im just not convinced that a shot making contest is indicative of proving the whole point that I would like to see proven. Im curious about the system to the point I would like to see someone play with it, get position with it and so forth and so on. I could care less about a shot making contest. I would dare say that probably in a shot making contest they might have the advantage because of the systematic approach they have. They already know what shots are going to come up and they practice those so what does that prove? I dont think it proves much on the playability scale, which is what I would be interested in.
Your tone
Ive known that for quite some time. Your tone leaves something to be desired. Thats why I would like to see how its played with.
Ive known that for quite some time. Your tone leaves something to be desired. Thats why I would like to see how its played with.
Have you not seen videos of Gerry, or Stan, or Landon, or Stevie playing?
There is plenty of internet access to CTE matches.
Gerry Willimans recently posted a 2nd in a semi-pro league in Canada.
You have the Landon/Earl match.
I put a 100 ball run on VIMEO.
Also on Vimeo, I played the 9 and 10 ball ghost on a ten footer.
I won a GSBT event in Bank. The finals were up.
Phil Burford has numerous matches available as well as Stevie.
DTL, soon after learning CTE PRO ONE posted a 200 plus run on YouTube.
Of course, JB just finished with Lou.
Plus I have about 50 YouTube videos up.
REAL CTE is natural and in no way diminishes position play but actually quite the opposite. THERE IS NO MANUAL PIVOTING In PRO ONE.. ...SIMPLY A SWEEP which is what most every single pro is doing. What they 're NOT doing is moving directly in.
The year I advertised Pro One at the US OPEN, I finished 25th.Without it I doubt very seriously I would have been in the money......
I would be happy for any Pro player to camp out with my game for awhile and see it first-hand and report back to this forum what CTE is all about. I am sure they'd be happy with what they'd take away.
Stan Shuffett
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My guess is they pretty good before CTE. May even as good. They aren't the ones everyone needs to see. It's the low ranked players who made a drastic improvement after CTE. Think that's what everyone is looking for to validate the system. Not saying I am a non believer. Just haven't seen anyone who wasn't good at aiming put up a video showing them running a rack using CTE.
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So, you are looking for the magic pill. Sorry, one doesn't exist.
I would like to see for myself
I have no doubts that cte is what it is and works , Ive just not seen anyone play with it in person. I play quite well enough for me and know how I do what I do but Im open to how other people do what they do and would enjoy a game with a CTer. So if someone cares to lets play.
I have no doubts that cte is what it is and works , Ive just not seen anyone play with it in person. I play quite well enough for me and know how I do what I do but Im open to how other people do what they do and would enjoy a game with a CTer. So if someone cares to lets play.
Yes of Course
I see you have plenty of matches where Pro Level Players are using CTE and I will use your list to watch some of them on You Tube. Thank you. I would just like to see in person how a real ball spinner handles it where I can see what he does. I know just a little about CTE and would like see how it flows within his game.
I see you have plenty of matches where Pro Level Players are using CTE and I will use your list to watch some of them on You Tube. Thank you. I would just like to see in person how a real ball spinner handles it where I can see what he does. I know just a little about CTE and would like see how it flows within his game.