APA screwed our very own sleinen out of a national championship

SBC said:
APA players contribute approximately $54 million per year into the league, and yet only about $1.5 million is given back in prize money at the national level ($1 million for the team tournament, and $500,000 for the individual tournament.

If you want to go to Vegas, just buy yourself a ticket.
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You’re a very bitter person. We’re you ever a part of or player in the APA?
If you had a bad experience you need to let that shit go.

One day you’ll die, and your own personal hell will be to be an eternal S/L 7
and you’ll always be in a match against an S/L 2 that is a sandbagging Efren Reyes.

Let it go, it’ll never do you any good. Just play in your own local league if that’s what you
like. I hope you do well and win all the money they pay back. Be happy :)
 
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SBC said:
APA players contribute approximately $54 million per year into the league, and yet only about $1.5 million is given back in prize money at the national level ($1 million for the team tournament, and $500,000 for the individual tournament.

If you want to go to Vegas, just buy yourself a ticket.
Click to expand...

Some people enjoy winning and earning their way there.
 
APA is a huge money drain on billiards. Pretty obvious except to those who drink the koolaid.
 
the truth as I see it

To be blunt, I hate leagues. My experience, the players are noisy, inconsiderate of nearby players, all light three cigarettes at once so they can grab a puff wherever they are at,(this may only seem to be true) generally not the kind of people I enjoy being around.

Being retired I go to the pool hall early. It is quiet, a handful or so of regulars are there, a few quiet hello's are exchanged, and I settle down to practice or play.

I hate to admit it but the pool hall makes more off of the league players in one evening than they make off of the daytime regulars, including me, in a week. The difference between a lot of places keeping their doors open and closing is a healthy league scene. Those people drink, often to excess, buy food, buy smokes. Smokes alone are probably a huge profit center. If they come in with one pack they might need two more before going out the door!

These same people are big on the "just one thing away from greatness" theory. They buy cue sticks, chalk, gloves, every pool gadget known to man, plus a table now and then. The leagues in general and APA in particular are keeping pool alive.

Sad but true, those loud, stinky, obnoxious league players and home players are pool today. The hardcore life revolves around a pool table guys and gals are the fringes. Pool can't survive on the fringes alone. Next time you are ran out of the pool hall by the league crowd thank goodness they are there. Without them, you wouldn't be there either!

Hu

PS: Yeah, I am sure there are league players somewhere in a town, city, or galaxy far far away that don't fit my description of league players, this is just my viewpoint from the ones I have seen!
 
SBC said:
APA is a huge money drain on billiards. Pretty obvious except to those who drink the koolaid.
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You’re very angry. I don’t see that the APA does anything to hurt pool. They are a business. Just like any other.
 
SBC said:
APA players contribute approximately $54 million per year into the league, and yet only about $1.5 million is given back in prize money at the national level ($1 million for the team tournament, and $500,000 for the individual tournament.

If you want to go to Vegas, just buy yourself a ticket.
Click to expand...

Now do golf.
 
SBC said:
Nah
Just know there's better ways than the brainwashed league mentality.
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I think then that you are absolutely doing the right thing for you.
Try to understand that not everyone agrees with you. That’s no reason to be angry.
Promote your local league, be proud of it, but there is no need to rip something else
just because you don’t agree. Celebrate your diversity.
 
SBC said:
Do you get the I beat a housewife patch?
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Comments like this really bother me. For lower amateur players, beating a 7 is an achievement. Something they can be proud of. Would you be happy if you beat a top tier pro? How is that any different when comparing relative skill?

On the flip side, I am happy that housewives play pool. Maybe it is their night to get out of the house. Nice to know they play pool instead of doing something else.

I am all for anything that gets people out playing pool. Whether it be league or not. The attitude of you are better than APA players is just sad. We were all at that level at one time. Some decided to keep improving while others are fine with where they are and want out of the sport.

Most APA players are recreational and don't care how much money the league makes. It is a cheap night of entertainment and that is what they want. A large number of players have never been to Nationals and they are OK with that.
 
SBC said:
Nah
Just know there's better ways than the brainwashed league mentality.
Click to expand...

Brian,

So how much of that is not having an APA league in your room? Do you have BCAPL? USAPL? TAP? VNEA? Are all your leagues in-house? Do you have league play at all? If none of the above, where are your new players coming from?

Lyn
 
cardiac kid said:
Brian,

So how much of that is not having an APA league in your room? Do you have BCAPL? USAPL? TAP? VNEA? Are all your leagues in-house? Do you have league play at all? If none of the above, where are your new players coming from?

Lyn
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I'd never host APA. It's not what we do.

We get recreational players and new ones... though we aren't trying to lure new SL 2s to feed the machine.

Your room has an outstanding house league run by Bruce Prince. I want to try and emulate it. I have communicated with him several times. You see how successful it is, so you know there's a better way.

The APA leeches off tens of millions of dollars profit from the game. That money could have a huge impact on promoting the game professionally, amateur pool , youth programs and the family run pool halls in the country that have survived.

I entertain the idea of national leagues, but don't see the value of giving up 40 to 50% of players money to a league operator and a corporation. If I ever chose one it would be TAP which I'd run myself to keep player's costs down. We are close to central PA and I'm a huge Super Billiards Expo junky.

I have a stake in the game. With tremendous effort and a large initial investment, I built the room the way I wanted, for the kind of people I'm looking to host. Not for one instance did I expect or want to have APA. I'm not in this to get rich. We had no room in Syracuse at all following the fire. I wanted to have a stake and a say in how pool in my community would be...and I do.
 
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Brian,

Sure do agree with you about APA leeching money from the players. Only thing they offer is a trip to Vegas for very, very few players. Talk about 1%'ers :eek:. IMHO, they screw all the others.

Yes, Bruce does a great job of promoting in-house leagues at East Ridge. Sure fills up tables on the traditional slow days. We also offer our players APA and BCAPL. You would be surprised how many of the "league" players are now participating in our in-house straight pool and soon to start one pocket leagues. Some even play in our Wednesday night 9 ball tournament!!! Cultivating them as "pool players" has sure helped add to our list of "regular" players!

Hope everything is well with you and your business.

Lyn
 
rharm said:
If the APA is so full of sandbagging, is the blame on APA or is it on everyone in your local league. If you know players in your area are sandbagging/adding innings/not marking defensive shots, shouldn't you be reporting that to your LO?
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I played APA two years, the second year I had a different "COACH"... He was "In It To Win It". After 2-3 times of asking me to "pull up", that was it. I quit. I told him that was a competitor, not an accountant.

I then tried BCA for a year, but then business got too busy & there was no reward at the end, to go to a tournament, because I had to work the tournaments. That was my last try. I tied two other guys for the Break N Run Trophy & got some money back, but I was through...
 
cardiac kid said:
Brian,

Sure do agree with you about APA leeching money from the players. Only thing they offer is a trip to Vegas for very, very few players. Talk about 1%'ers :eek:. IMHO, they screw all the others.

Yes, Bruce does a great job of promoting in-house leagues at East Ridge. Sure fills up tables on the traditional slow days. We also offer our players APA and BCAPL. You would be surprised how many of the "league" players are now participating in our in-house straight pool and soon to start one pocket leagues. Some even play in our Wednesday night 9 ball tournament!!! Cultivating them as "pool players" has sure helped add to our list of "regular" players!

Hope everything is well with you and your business.

Lyn
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You guys have a much better market in Rochester than we do in Syracuse. We are getting by for summer and now looking to come out swinging for the next 9 months. If my overhead wasn't so ridiculously low, I would never have tried.
 
SJpilot said:
I think most people play because they enjoy it. Softball is the same way you pay all season and pay to travel, if you win you get a trophy and a weeks worth of drinking money but I don't hear a lot of people *****ing about the payout schedule. Entertainment costs money as does everything in life.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
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Exactly. Our softball team, in 1996, won the USSSA state championship in IL, then when the National Invitational Tournament. Not one dime was paid out. We got some nice championship t-shirts and sweatshirts and some other swag. Got our entry paid into the World Championship in Dallas, but no airfare, no hotels, etc.

Yet, some how, we enjoyed every second of it. Yeah, someone got paid for running the local league we played in, and the state playoffs, I'm sure someone got paid for that too. Not to mention all the umpires got paid. And the facility got paid for letting us use the fields.

Never heard one person mention the money, or why folks got paid to run it all.

My only complaint with APA are the game rules. We can teach 5 year olds that 3 strikes and you're out, but for some reason, we need "special" rules for grown people in pool? That, I don't get.
 
ChicagoRJ said:
Exactly. Our softball team, in 1996, won the USSSA state championship in IL, then when the National Invitational Tournament. Not one dime was paid out. We got some nice championship t-shirts and sweatshirts and some other swag. Got our entry paid into the World Championship in Dallas, but no airfare, no hotels, etc.

Yet, some how, we enjoyed every second of it. Yeah, someone got paid for running the local league we played in, and the state playoffs, I'm sure someone got paid for that too. Not to mention all the umpires got paid. And the facility got paid for letting us use the fields.

Never heard one person mention the money, or why folks got paid to run it all.

My only complaint with APA are the game rules. We can teach 5 year olds that 3 strikes and you're out, but for some reason, we need "special" rules for grown people in pool? That, I don't get.
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I think that just about anywhere 3 strikes is an out, but playing pool rules can vary so
much from table to table that you probably need one set of APA rules to play their
game, so it may require some learning
Many different opinions about the APA. In my case it works for me, it don't work for
Brian. I get that, it's just not for everybody
 
Celophanewrap said:
I think that just about anywhere 3 strikes is an out, but playing pool rules can vary so
much from table to table that you probably need one set of APA rules to play their
game, so it may require some learning
Many different opinions about the APA. In my case it works for me, it don't work for
Brian. I get that, it's just not for everybody
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The point is the rules should not be different in every pool hall in the USA. The APA rules are beyond stupid and there is not one logical reason for them. Not one. Would the APA lose even one league player if they played by normal pool rules? Of course not, why would they. They are adults and able to understand slop should not count, and that you can make a ball while playing safe. Even a SL2 can learn that.
 
ChicagoRJ said:
The point is the rules should not be different in every pool hall in the USA. The APA rules are beyond stupid and there is not one logical reason for them. Not one. Would the APA lose even one league player if they played by normal pool rules? Of course not, why would they. They are adults and able to understand slop should not count, and that you can make a ball while playing safe. Even a SL2 can learn that.
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I can view ve you a logical reason. Most apa rules were in force way before apa was formed and apa adopted those rules and has stuck with them . in my opinion other leagues are the ones that has dumbed down pool and made it easier to run out.

Now i hate slop myself so dont think i am defending it at all but thats the way the game was played way before apa was formed....so was other rules such as closed break and break from the kitchen on a scratch on tbe break.

I think they oughta do away with slop period....including 9 ball. The odd thing is when i brought up slop in 9 ball before people say....but thats the way its always been played.....news flash apa probably feels the same way with their 8 ball rules being thats the way it was always played.

Over the years leagues such as bcapl has changed ....or modified their rules to make it easier to break and run or run out after your opponent breaks and scratches.

And as for your comment concerning rules should be the same in every room .....it is with apa....bcapl gives each franchise the freedomto have whatever rules they want to play by. Hardly conducive to having a standard set if rules nationwide like apa.

Not downing bcapl at all as i think they are a fine organization and i respect what mark griffin does for pool but the first league i joined was bcapl and i thought playing for points in 8 ball.....made a stripe on the break but dont have a shot....oh well take solids then. Bih anywhere on the table after a scratch on the break......scratch on the 8 dont count as a loss. Stupid ass rules to a guy who had played 8 ball in a bar all his life.
 
I think most of the we hate league players and call us scum are the true gambling scum pool players who are the real people who are destroying the game. No one in Apa gives a shit about the money they are spending they are playing pool and having fun and unlike bca and acs you actually have to win your way their . Everything isn’t always but money in this world. If your playing pool for the the money go find something else to do because your going to be very disappointed.


ChicagoRJ said:
Exactly. Our softball team, in 1996, won the USSSA state championship in IL, then when the National Invitational Tournament. Not one dime was paid out. We got some nice championship t-shirts and sweatshirts and some other swag. Got our entry paid into the World Championship in Dallas, but no airfare, no hotels, etc.

Yet, some how, we enjoyed every second of it. Yeah, someone got paid for running the local league we played in, and the state playoffs, I'm sure someone got paid for that too. Not to mention all the umpires got paid. And the facility got paid for letting us use the fields.

Never heard one person mention the money, or why folks got paid to run it all.

My only complaint with APA are the game rules. We can teach 5 year olds that 3 strikes and you're out, but for some reason, we need "special" rules for grown people in pool? That, I don't get.
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trob said:
unlike bca and acs you actually have to win your way their .
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In my view, the main reason for the "win your way there" is shear numbers. If APA is being honest, they have 250,000 member / players. If 10% showed up it might be impossible to run an event of that size. ACS, BCAPL and VNEA have roughly 50,000 members each. 10% of those IS manageable with the right venue.

Having played APA for eight years, I really like the "play what you make rule". Sure makes the game more difficult. Same with the "cue ball behind the head stripe" on an opening break scratch.

JMHO.

Lyn
 
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