Easy ball or hard one

Willowbrook Wolfy

Willowbrook Wolfy

Going pro
So you are playing 8. Your opponent breaks dry. You scan the table. Now you have a choice. Take a harder shot to open with an easy out on the stripes. In your mind you are pretty much guaranteed to get the out if you make the opener. Or take the solids. Solids are an easy open with a more difficult out.
 
Always solve your problems early. Sounds like in your example shot 1 solves all stripes problems right off the bat. Barring specifics I go stripes.
 
If I can't play a two-way on the stripes as my first or second shot I'm then looking at a safe when playing solids or evaluating how to get a good break out later and get safe (two-way shot), if neither option is available then duck and run. 8 ball is is not a game to leave an out for your opponent when late in the game.

EDIT: That's all relevant on my opponent - APA 7 (9B) - I'm going for the runout - a formidable opponent - I'm taking the highest percentage shot on every shot depending on how I'm hitting them.
 
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You are going to take whichever gives you the best chance of winning the game. Not the best chance to run out, but the best chance to win the game. Seriously, the decision is that easy. Being able to best determine which color group from above will give you the best chance for winning the game will only come with lots of experience in learning the game and the percentages, and just as importantly, learning your strengths and weaknesses and being able to assess them honestly. You will never be able to live up to your potential at any given moment if you don't have the ability to be honest with yourself.
 
Poolplaya9 said:
You are going to take whichever gives you the best chance of winning the game. Not the best chance to run out, but the best chance to win the game. Seriously, the decision is that easy. Being able to best determine which color group from above will give you the best chance for winning the game will only come with lots of experience in learning the game and the percentages, and just as importantly, learning your strengths and weaknesses and being able to assess them honestly. You will never be able to live up to your potential at any given moment if you don't have the ability to be honest with yourself.
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I was writting a reply disagreeing with you, but in the end you're right.

To be a strong player you need to acknowledge what you can/cannot do and play within it. That said, if you are the type of player that shys away from more difficult shots in fear of handing over control of the table. Even when those more difficult shots will provide you an easier win. Then you need to resolve that issue or get ready to plateau. Eventually you'll find yourself in the situation that you don't have a choice anymore, and zero experience taking on the tough ball.

I always go for the hard shot in the OP's situation.
 
The_JV said:
...if you are the type of player that shys away from more difficult shots in fear of handing over control of the table. Even when those more difficult shots will provide you an easier win. Then you need to resolve that issue or get ready to plateau. Eventually you'll find yourself in the situation that you don't have a choice anymore, and zero experience taking on the tough ball.

I always go for the hard shot in the OP's situation.
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It is also just as true that if you are the type of player that always shies away from the patterns that require a little more positional skill because that isn't your area of competence/confidence then you are going to plateau at a certain point and also in games when you are left with no choice but to have to play them you aren't going to be near as good at that either so it definitely goes both ways.

It seems to me that the proper way to address this dichotomy is that when practicing you should regularly force yourself to take the shots and patterns that you are not as proficient and comfortable with so as to help develop said proficiency and comfort, and in games that matter you should always force yourself to take the shot or pattern that will result in the best odds for winning the game given your skills at that moment--and key to this is being able to be very honest and realistic with yourself about the odds and your skills.
 
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Poolplaya9 said:
You are going to take whichever gives you the best chance of winning the game. Not the best chance to run out, but the best chance to win the game. Seriously, the decision is that easy. Being able to best determine which color group from above will give you the best chance for winning the game will only come with lots of experience in learning the game and the percentages, and just as importantly, learning your strengths and weaknesses and being able to assess them honestly. You will never be able to live up to your potential at any given moment if you don't have the ability to be honest with yourself.
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Totally agree…in chess, the right move is the winning move…same as all forms of billiards.
……aesthetics be damned
….also agree with “make the four ball purple”
 
Poolplaya9 said:
You are going to take whichever gives you the best chance of winning the game. Not the best chance to run out, but the best chance to win the game.
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Correct. The right shot is always the shot that gives you the best chance of winning the game.
 
You won't run the rack if you miss the first shot. By making the first shot you lay claim, forcing you opponent to shoot the others. Miss the first shot and you've given away all options. So shoot the tough shot first but be damned sure you make it.
 
Willowbrook Wolfy said:
So you are playing 8. Your opponent breaks dry. You scan the table. Now you have a choice. Take a harder shot to open with an easy out on the stripes. In your mind you are pretty much guaranteed to get the out if you make the opener. Or take the solids. Solids are an easy open with a more difficult out.
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In a one table bar, it's a toss up. See the issue is how prepped/warm I am. If I just walked in or had to wait an hour for my turn, nada on the Sigel outs. If I've been on the table for a while, different story.
In a pool room, more 'n likely I'll have a table to myself and be doing the routine. If I then get involved I might try to open hot rather than anal my way through it.
 
MajorMiscue said:
You won't run the rack if you miss the first shot. By making the first shot you lay claim, forcing you opponent to shoot the others. Miss the first shot and you've given away all options. So shoot the tough shot first but be damned sure you make it.
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That is obviously a silly statement if you think about it for a second. If shooting the color set with the tough starting shot and easier layout will result in you winning the game 60 out of 100 times, and shooting the color set with the tougher layout and easier start would result in your winning the game 65 out of 100 times, then shooting the color set with the tough starting shot like you said to do is the wrong choice, period. The right choice is the one that is ultimately going to win you the game the most often, simple as that, no exception.
 
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Poolplaya9 said:
You are going to take whichever gives you the best chance of winning the game. Not the best chance to run out, but the best chance to win the game. Seriously, the decision is that easy. Being able to best determine which color group from above will give you the best chance for winning the game will only come with lots of experience in learning the game and the percentages, and just as importantly, learning your strengths and weaknesses and being able to assess them honestly. You will never be able to live up to your potential at any given moment if you don't have the ability to be honest with yourself.
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Another player's goals might say otherwise.

Each of us has his reason(s) for playing. Winning isn't always at the top of that list. I know that might sound strange, but it's true.


Jeff Livingston
 
Poolplaya9 said:
That is obviously a silly statement if you think about it for a second. If shooting the color set with the tough starting shot and easier layout will result in you winning the game 60 out of 100 times, and shooting the color set with the tougher layout and easier start would result in your winning the game 65 out of 100 times, then shooting the color set with the tough starting shot like you said to do is the wrong choice, period. The right choice is the one that is ultimately going to win you the game the most often, simple as that, no exception.
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You're changing the proposition. It was:
Now you have a choice. Take a harder shot to open with an easy out on the stripes. In your mind you are pretty much guaranteed to get the out if you make the opener. Or take the solids. Solids are an easy open with a more difficult out.
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MajorMiscue said:
You're changing the proposition. It was:
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I think you may have misread something because i didn't change anything. One is an easier runout with a harder starting shot. One is a tougher runout with an easier starting shot. And the only correct answer without exception is to take the color group/shot that is going to result in your winning the game the most often. Reread my post and if you still feel I changed something let me know what you think I changed.
 
Poolplaya9 said:
It seems to me that the proper way to address this dichotomy is that when practicing you should regularly force yourself to take the shots and patterns that you are not as proficient and comfortable with so as to help develop said proficiency and comfort, and in games that matter you should always force yourself to take the shot or pattern that will result in the best odds for winning the game given your skills at that moment--and key to this is being able to be very honest and realistic with yourself about the odds and your skills.
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...and there is what separates players. I see every opprotunity as one for practicing. You can't practice performance under pressure until you're in it.

If and when I'm playing the final of the world championship. I may reconsider that approach...lol
 
PoolBum said:
Correct. The right shot is always the shot that gives you the best chance of winning the game.
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agreed... but the best chance boils down to whether or not you need and can count on another opprotunity at the table.

Your choices should be driven by the skill of your opponent. If your goal is to win that is.
 
Poolplaya9 said:
I think you may have misread something because i didn't change anything. One is an easier runout with a harder starting shot. One is a tougher runout with an easier starting shot. And the only correct answer without exception is to take the color group/shot that is going to result in your winning the game the most often. Reread my post and if you still feel I changed something let me know what you think I changed.
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You added: "If shooting the color set with the tough starting shot and easier layout will result in you winning the game 60 out of 100 times, and shooting the color set with the tougher layout and easier start would result in your winning the game 65 out of 100 times, then shooting the color set with the tough starting shot like you said to do is the wrong choice, period."
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The original proposition was:
Take a harder shot to open with an easy out on the stripes. In your mind you are pretty much guaranteed to get the out if you make the opener. Or take the solids. Solids are an easy open with a more difficult out.
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You added a non-existent advantage to shooting the easier first.
 
Usually playing better players so, I'm looking for points (easiest way), higher the point run to deny a full skin, especially when playing rouge county ball - the honest break format - plays a lot like 8 ball, same goals/discipline. During an inning the higher the ball run the more points you get.
 
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