Ring material or A joint ring

S

slim123

Active member
I'm looking fo opinions here from a few of you wise cue makers. I would have said old and wise, however i think we are all old here.

Does ring material make a difference at the A joint or any other joint or is epoxy the heroine that makes it all hold togteher
Nor plastic nor wood rings could change the impact on that area of the cue?
Say for instance a segemented cue

I know the ring material on the shaft collar does make a difference in the hit and the stability of the shaft


Opinions are good,
theories, are ok,
however experience surpasses all
 
I read somewhere that two woods should not be joined together in the A-joint, the A-joint should have a harder material than wood in between the forearm and handle for stability.
 
Assuming solid construction methods, the ring material probably wont affect the way the cue plays.
The mechanical connection is as important as the glue, in my opinion.
Some will say you need something there to avoid putting end grain to end grain.
 
JoeyInCali said:
His A-joint was weak.
Necessitated by his lathes with small bores.
Click to expand...

Even for his cues that used Spain's longer blanks with the joint under the wrap? (Not trying to hijack the thread, just legitimately curious about the limitations of his lathe)
 
kling&allen said:
Even for his cues that used Spain's longer blanks with the joint under the wrap? (Not trying to hijack the thread, just legitimately curious about the limitations of his lathe)
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Yes. Double tenon plus a phenolic cylinder sandwiched between the two rods is a weak assembly.
 
Michael Webb said:
Its always helpful if you have a steady rest.
What's worse,
The limitations of the machine?
Or
The limitations of the mind?
Click to expand...

Do any detailed pictures of his original lathe setup exist? I've only seen the common photo with him standing in front of the lathe.
 
Michael Webb said:
Its always helpful if you have a steady rest.
What's worse,
The limitations of the machine?
Or
The limitations of the mind?
Click to expand...
Old school logic.
A thru spindle is nice but not necessary if you have a good steady rest.
Taper bars are awesome but can be by past by changing the handle on the cross slide to a pully with something so simple as a rope and a weight so as the carriage moves the cross slide moves.
The trick is figuring out your pully size.
I've seen it done by someone who has World recognition in building great cues!
Have we, maybe got a little spoiled by what's offered in machinery today?
Maybe...
But you'll appreciate what's offered today more if you (we) remember where it came from!
 
slim123 said:
I'm looking fo opinions here from a few of you wise cue makers. I would have said old and wise, however i think we are all old here.

Does ring material make a difference at the A joint or any other joint or is epoxy the heroine that makes it all hold togteher
Nor plastic nor wood rings could change the impact on that area of the cue?
Say for instance a segemented cue

I know the ring material on the shaft collar does make a difference in the hit and the stability of the shaft


Opinions are good,
theories, are ok,
however experience surpasses all
Click to expand...
Epoxy holds it all together but the rings at the A joint can make a difference in how the cue plays and how it glues together also.
Some don't like the look of a ring there and will hide it under the wrap. Others soak the ends of the wood with epoxy, let it dry then lightly face it and glue it together to stop the end grain gluing problems. Others just glue it without any prep or rings and those are the ones that most often develop a buzz. Now move on down the cue and all of it make less difference as you glue up sleeves and stuff on down the cue.
 
cueman said:
Others just glue it without any prep or rings and those are the ones that most often develop a buzz.
Click to expand...

What is a buzz?

Can you hide a ring inside the wood?
 

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This conversation is why I ultimately decided on full cores. Were I building recut points and such the challenges would exponentiate with the full core but still surmountable in my estimation.
 
fish2 said:
What is a buzz?

Can you hide a ring inside the wood?
Click to expand...
A buzzing sound coming from inside the cue when playing or lightly tapping the cue on the side. Hiding a ring inside wood leaves a weak wood line around the outside of the ring. Have not done it, but it looks like a bad idea to me.
 
Deruki said:
This conversation is why I ultimately decided on full cores. Were I building recut points and such the challenges would exponentiate with the full core but still surmountable in my estimation.
Click to expand...
It's so misleading, I just shake my head.
Wood to wood is not any more prone to buzzing that having "buzz" rings in there. A ring that floats inside the tenon.
Sorry, a full core is not a solution to a non-existing problem. And in itself causes another or two issues.
 
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JoeyInCali said:
It's so misleading, I just shake my head.
Wood to wood is not any more prone to buzzing that having "buzz" rings in there. A ring that floats inside the tenon.
Sorry, a full core is not a solution to a non-existing problem. And in itself causes another or two issues.
Click to expand...
I can't find it right now but I posted a wood to wood glue test video here a few years back that was an eye opener.

In your experience what problems does a full core cause?

Not that I do it but I believe it's more forgiving of crappy workmanship and loose tolerances than an A joint.
 
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