Help with rails

Hustler84

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Hello all,

I recently purchased some new K55 rubber rails for my table and they are plenty long enough, but not as wide. I test fit one before moving on to gluing and there is about 3mm worth of space below the rail. Will this affect how it plays? Should I purchase new rails and send these back? Thanks for any help!
 
Hello all,

I recently purchased some new K55 rubber rails for my table and they are plenty long enough, but not as wide. I test fit one before moving on to gluing and there is about 3mm worth of space below the rail. Will this affect how it plays? Should I purchase new rails and send these back? Thanks for any help!
What's the table and what brand rails?
 
I'd measure from the table to the contact area of the ball
this page says it should be 62 1/2 to 64 1/2 percent of the ball size.


maybe a pro mechanic can comment on the type of rail and how that may relate to this proportion, but I think this is basically what you are shooting for. my suggestion is to find other references before you glue them on. I've seen some variation in that number quoted. you might want to mount one rail and try bounce tests at different speeds to note the differences in the reaction. If you still have rubber on the old rails you can try some shims to raise the nose height and perceive differences, not easy to lower the height. It's important to get this right the first time.

on the old brunswick 7' I restored it had no reference because the cushions I used were completely different and the originals not available... so I fooled around a bit. found I could place a strip of rubber covered wire under the rail to raise it, or move it towards the outer side of the rail to lower it slightly.. that was just a way to fool around and do tests and see the difference .. after you have them glued on and felt on it wont be fun to change that so I'd experiment a bit to satisfy myself that this will not be a problem later. If you havent covered many rails you cna watch some youtube videos, there are some good ones. one thank Id mention is that if you get your cloth and staples all bunched up it may interfere with how the rail sits, and any "rocking" you want to avoid. your rails may have a hollow to prevent staples and bunched up cloth from interfering with the fit.

different tables have different means of securing and steadying the rails but basically you want a very solid mounting. some rails on older and well made tables have super heavy iron bars in them or bolt into the edge of the slate itself.
If the rail can move upon impact it won't help things. If the rail can rock or move that's bad. the rails may be hardwood or crappy particleboard or pine or whatever, better ones will use decent hardwood but some use particleboard or a softwood such as pine to reduce the price. some tables have no more than bolts to captivate them, others have better means to lock things down in a more solid way. you will notice a reduction in noise from a "bonk" to very silent reaction on better quality tables. other than performance, it makes a good table more pleasurable to play on than a cheapo. You aren't choosing a table now, but mounting the rails, so my comment was basically to make you aware that how they are locked into position is important, as well as the height between ball and contact area. You might need a skirt below the cushion, to fill any gap between the cushion and table surface if there is a gap, or a different style but I'll stay out of that.. Someone that sells the cushions might be a good person to make sure you have the correct profile for the table. If you don't take the time to do this correctly and then want to change it later, you will wish you got it right first. a kludge to make it higher might be to shim the rail higher but that's not preferable. If you are at all unsure of the ball size, I'd check that first too..
 
With the rubber flush to the top of the rail, the nose height should be right around 1-7/16". If it's not, you probably got the wrong profile rubber.
 
Hello all,

I recently purchased some new K55 rubber rails for my table and they are plenty long enough, but not as wide. I test fit one before moving on to gluing and there is about 3mm worth of space below the rail. Will this affect how it plays? Should I purchase new rails and send these back? Thanks for any help!
Can't tell you anything unless I know what kind of table you're talking about.
 
Can't tell you anything unless I know what kind of table you're talking about.
I just purchased it from someone on Facebook marketplace. I believe it was purchased at Watson's. The only label I can find is on the head rail. It says Grand marquis. I can't find a maker's mark. It is a three piece slate table.
 
It looks like this
Screenshot_2023-08-08-22-41-29-452.jpg
 

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I'd measure from the table to the contact area of the ball
this page says it should be 62 1/2 to 64 1/2 percent of the ball size.


maybe a pro mechanic can comment on the type of rail and how that may relate to this proportion, but I think this is basically what you are shooting for. my suggestion is to find other references before you glue them on. I've seen some variation in that number quoted. you might want to mount one rail and try bounce tests at different speeds to note the differences in the reaction. If you still have rubber on the old rails you can try some shims to raise the nose height and perceive differences, not easy to lower the height. It's important to get this right the first time.

on the old brunswick 7' I restored it had no reference because the cushions I used were completely different and the originals not available... so I fooled around a bit. found I could place a strip of rubber covered wire under the rail to raise it, or move it towards the outer side of the rail to lower it slightly.. that was just a way to fool around and do tests and see the difference .. after you have them glued on and felt on it wont be fun to change that so I'd experiment a bit to satisfy myself that this will not be a problem later. If you havent covered many rails you cna watch some youtube videos, there are some good ones. one thank Id mention is that if you get your cloth and staples all bunched up it may interfere with how the rail sits, and any "rocking" you want to avoid. your rails may have a hollow to prevent staples and bunched up cloth from interfering with the fit.

different tables have different means of securing and steadying the rails but basically you want a very solid mounting. some rails on older and well made tables have super heavy iron bars in them or bolt into the edge of the slate itself.
If the rail can move upon impact it won't help things. If the rail can rock or move that's bad. the rails may be hardwood or crappy particleboard or pine or whatever, better ones will use decent hardwood but some use particleboard or a softwood such as pine to reduce the price. some tables have no more than bolts to captivate them, others have better means to lock things down in a more solid way. you will notice a reduction in noise from a "bonk" to very silent reaction on better quality tables. other than performance, it makes a good table more pleasurable to play on than a cheapo. You aren't choosing a table now, but mounting the rails, so my comment was basically to make you aware that how they are locked into position is important, as well as the height between ball and contact area. You might need a skirt below the cushion, to fill any gap between the cushion and table surface if there is a gap, or a different style but I'll stay out of that.. Someone that sells the cushions might be a good person to make sure you have the correct profile for the table. If you don't take the time to do this correctly and then want to change it later, you will wish you got it right first. a kludge to make it higher might be to shim the rail higher but that's not preferable. If you are at all unsure of the ball size, I'd check that first too..
63.5% +/- 1% of the ball height only applies to rails having a thickness of 1 11/16" and K55 cushions. You can throw out that measurement with rails thinner than that, it don't work.
 
Yes, here's a table with a bit more specific dimensions showing the K55 ANd K66 profiles.

when I did my little 1964 brunswick practice table, the ( obsolete) rubber was only about 1/2" so I had to trim the rails and used one with a dimension of 3/4. It worked out very well. It transformed the thing from a piece of junk into a fun usable table, helped us practice within the space we had. Now Im moving up to a Brunswick Balke Collender with the L shaped cushions, Im curious how to check the rail height on that since it's basically flat where the contact area is. I will just try it and see , but I'm curious how that is measured.

the U56 is used on the century tables. I used that dimension for mine.
here's one similar:
 
Yes, here's a table with a bit more specific dimensions showing the K55 ANd K66 profiles.

when I did my little 1964 brunswick practice table, the ( obsolete) rubber was only about 1/2" so I had to trim the rails and used one with a dimension of 3/4. It worked out very well. It transformed the thing from a piece of junk into a fun usable table, helped us practice within the space we had. Now Im moving up to a Brunswick Balke Collender with the L shaped cushions, Im curious how to check the rail height on that since it's basically flat where the contact area is. I will just try it and see , but I'm curious how that is measured.

the U56 is used on the century tables. I used that dimension for mine.
here's one similar:
Brunswick never made a table using L shaped cushions.
 
Yes, here's a table with a bit more specific dimensions showing the K55 ANd K66 profiles.

when I did my little 1964 brunswick practice table, the ( obsolete) rubber was only about 1/2" so I had to trim the rails and used one with a dimension of 3/4. It worked out very well. It transformed the thing from a piece of junk into a fun usable table, helped us practice within the space we had. Now Im moving up to a Brunswick Balke Collender with the L shaped cushions, Im curious how to check the rail height on that since it's basically flat where the contact area is. I will just try it and see , but I'm curious how that is measured.

the U56 is used on the century tables. I used that dimension for mine.
here's one similar:
L shaped cushions are used on snooker tables.
 
well this is off topic of the thread,
My "new" table is a Brunswick-Balke-Collender not a Brunswick and yes I would call it a snooker table with L shaped cushions. it's from 1908 or close to that age and was available with or without pockets.
calling it a "snooker table" could be technically incorrect as snooker wasn't popular yet at that time, although may have been invented? i'd be interested in learning more about what games were played then , to relate how it would have been used originally. My plan is to use it for snooker and billiards.. I'd like to know more about the differentiation between carom billiards, english billiards, pocket billiards or any other related games. in the original ads it says Carom , in reference to no pockets and "pool" in relation to tables with pockets.. I hear some of the terminology used a bit differently depending where I read. is "pool" any game using the pockets? another member mentioned that "straight pool" was popular before snooker and that's basically what it's intention was..
a friend mentioned "chinese snooker tables" - he wasnt referring to where they were made, but the style of the cushions. I have a 4x8 slate Brunswick table that's from the 70's that has triangular shaped cushions that are rounded near the pockets. perhaps it was sort of a hybrid, intended for both snooker and/or 8 or 9 ball?

I need to read a bit more since Im starting to get a little better and more interested. Id like to differentiate the games with more clarity and also learn more about snooker strategy. playing billiards ( with two cue balls and one red ball, and using the pockets ) helped me a bit in snooker so I'd like to practice that a bit more .
any book recommendations would be helful, I think since im interested in this time period, there may be books available to download free that are out of their copyright and now in the public domain, some of those older books might be helpful and interesting to read. Ive seen a few 3 ball sets with two yellow and one red that had the Brunswick-Balke-Collender name on the little wooden box.
for straight pool , basically sinking as many balls as you can in a row, would it be customary to use numbered balls like a set for 8 ball ?
 
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1875

A lot has changed since snooker was first invented back in 1875 by members of the British Army and you can now chart the development of snooker down the years via our unique timeline
 
63.5% +/- 1% of the ball height only applies to rails having a thickness of 1 11/16" and K55 cushions. You can throw out that measurement with rails thinner than that, it don't work.
I believe I've asked you this before but still not getting it.
"Thickness"
How is that measured?

Are you talking about the 1-3/16" measurement or the 1-3/4" measurement in this drawing.
Note: I have no idea if this drawing has any validity what so ever. It helps explain my question.

Maybe I figured it out based on your 1-11/16 " comment for

Now I gotta figure out why that measurement matters. If I'm correct.

It's just a journey seeking stuff. I'll never be a mechanic. I'm nearly 70years old.
Still enjoy learning. Why I'm still talking to ME's in the MINK States. I teach them and they teach me. = Fun @ work!
 

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The rail in your drawing has a thickness of 1-3/4"
Thank you,
Why is that measurement so important regarding selecting rubber.
Seems to me if the angle is correct for a certain profile, and of course nose height is correct, all should be good.
You all are saying its a no go. Bad scenario?

What if the angle is correct and nose height is correct, but the thickness isn't?

What happens, and Why?

Is it that with a too thin of a rail height, I can't get the surface area on the angle cut to totally support the rubber?... I'll call it overhang.
If so, what if my rail was 2" and the angle and nose height are correct. What happens? Anything? Why?

Note: I know the issues with playing on such a table.
Again, just trying to work my brain.

Why wouldn't this scenario work? Correct angle, correct nose height, grossly oversized rail.
 
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