Finally getting a table
- Thread starter nataddrho
- Start date
I love your ambition. Please realize that 0.3 to 1.0 is a long journey. If you can improve a decimal point in a season, you've had a sensational year. During practice, keep innings. Spend way, way more time on easy shots than on difficult ones. And please, stay away from systems until you are at least 0.8.
xX-Wizard-Xx
Well-known member
You must have canceled all your engagements for the next 20yrs lmao ... Good luck
Thanks for the advice. I’ve found that 1c has helped develop a lot of awareness to details. I ran 21 last month, and I think this will help a lot with 3c.
Learn how the good players beat kisses.
But making a high % of easy ones is probably the best way to raise an avg.
But making a high % of easy ones is probably the best way to raise an avg.
why do you advise to stay away from systems until the skill level is 0.8?
Good question. Think of it like this: A beginning driver must train his brain to make good estimations, in order to decide whether or not to overtake. An experienced driver takes one look, knows his own speed, the speed of the truck in front of him and the speed of the car coming towards him, and he just KNOWS. This is the type of brain-training 3-cushion players also need, to answer questions like: can I get there if I play maximum corner? If you start to use calculations too early, you will not properly develop your "feel" for the lines. And, if I may add: many systems describe situations that occur once in a blue moon, and memorizing them is a bloody waste of time, given the fact that you will ALWAYS have to make small compensations anyway, because of the character of the table or the age of the cloth. There's no "system" to tell you how much to compensate: you are back at square one: your feel. Work on that.
thank you for your reply Bert
Taking slight exception to not learning some systems.
IMO a true beginner needs to acquire some basic knowledge of basic CB paths.
Understandably, few tables "play by the book" but if there's no knowledge of the math/paths then how does a person learn a table is playing long or short and how much.
The basic paths given by the Corner 5 and Plus 2 for instance, I think should be studied, but agree not relied on as gospel. Few books mention all the adjustments and why systems are unreliable if strictly followed. But if you don't know a thing about how the math works, or basic CB paths, how do you begin to find your Instincts/Feel for a table?
Side bar: When I was a beginner, I was also a beginner at swinging a cue.
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I don’t disagree with you, but think Bert’s advice is good. I agree that the ball paths from those two systems show a beginner something. Like the change in path on the corner 5 if the cue ball moves from the corner down the short rail or up the long rail. Seeing that difference is good. Trying to calculate a natural when you aren’t good is another.
I am speaking as a not very good player who doesn’t get to play billiards now. But I played a couple times against a guy who loved systems. He was older - rest his soul- and played a long time but wasn’t good. He’s mechanics were terrible. What good is a system if your stroke is all over the place and your second ball hits are bad? That player essentially never improved I would guess.
OTOH I played a good, experienced pool player once who didn’t have a ton of 3C experience. Well known pool player. Played with a pool cue and looked more like a pool player than a billiard player naturally. He demolished me. Consistent mechanics and accurate on the object ball hit - that goes a long way. I am sure you have seen this as well.
I would guess the OP has waaay better mechanics than the guy I am talking about, but would still benefit by focusing on other things before working much on systems.
Yes. I have spend the majority of my cue sports career perfecting my stroke, and I also know the difference between a pool stroke and carom stroke. Mazin told me himself that my stroke is very good and that I hit the ball well, so that helped me move on and start studying details.
I have also developed a feel for kiss avoidance, playing position with the second ball, and using speed to touch the third ball softly, and trying to pick the correct shot for natural position. I don’t use any systems at all since I have had enough table time to feel each shot. A few pros have all told me a while ago that systems are a crutch.
Right now I am working on super thin hits which has opened up a lot more options than I thought I had.
I think I just need to peel the next layer of the onion and play everyday for a while.
So what is the difference in stroke. Seriously. I have tried to find the explicit answer. I have both billiards books and pool books and see differences in players but have not found a source that explicitly compares and contrasts. Sounds dumb maybe
( not just bridge length, shorter cue type stuff I am getting at)
Excellent question. The answer is a higher quality follow through.
Why? It is because carom requires a higher accuracy tip placement than pool. Pool allows you to get away with somewhat inaccurate cue tip aim while still pocketing your object ball and still getting the cue ball within the general area you are striving for. Carom has less forgiveness.
A deliberate and controlled follow through allows you to close the gap between your tip set point and contact point in a straight line through space.
A poolish stroke is punchy and ends up giving you slightly more top than you want because your shoulder becomes engaged. You can see the tiny amount of top added in small games like 1c. The straight follow through allows you to hit where you intend. It feels more like a push than a hit.
A shorter bridge helps with tip accuracy as well.
A shorter cue may just be tradition. I have no idea why it is an inch shorter.l than pool.
I hope that helps.
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That is very interesting, thanks. Ties in a lot with Bill Smith’s discussion of it. When you say the shoulder becomes involved do you mean early in the final delivery as opposed to a little elbow drop if the cue is following through level and the tip is not dipping to the cloth after contact?
Yes, I mean a tightening of the shoulder that causes the tip to move upwards right before contact with the cue ball. It can be interpreted as an elbow drop but really any type of tightening or body English.
Pool has a lot more traffic, things in the way, less elastic rails and slower cloth, so the general feeling of the game is crowded and that influences the psychology of how much room you have for a follow through, I think.
i think a higher quality follow thru is an indication of a higher quality stroke
you cant tell me an pool player above 700 fargo doesnt have a controlled stroke and follow thru
if someone is dropping their elbow or raising the cue tip BEFORE contact
thats a stroke flaw and i doubt that player pool or carom is above intermediate
not all pool strokes are "punchy" and its the small amount of distance before at and after contact that determines whether the follow thru is straight or not
pool players with pendulum strokes their tips end up on the cloth(down) yet they followed thru level thru the important time
i think carom players use the different types of strokes more and understand why
i am a pool player but a student of pool and carom
so
jmho
icbw
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Well, the word “stroke” has become a loose definition of a lot of things to different people.
The only thing you can do to a cue ball is hit it where you intend to, at exactly the angle you want with exactly the speed you want. A “stroke” is just a vehicle that gets your tip there.
The solution comes from your brain and years of experience and practice.
The only thing you can do to a cue ball is hit it where you intend to, at exactly the angle you want with exactly the speed you want. A “stroke” is just a vehicle that gets your tip there.
The solution comes from your brain and years of experience and practice.
I would buy Shooter´s Pool and play online vs good players(while wait for table arrive). You learn better shot selection. Also can use replays to learn their shots and spin they use.
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