Brunswick GC5 Tournament Edition - Subrail extensions + cushions

W

wealmostlostdetroit

Member
Hi guys.

Recently bought a Brunswick GC5 TE from a reputable seller. I like the table but the pockets are too big and would like to get them down to 4 or 4 1/8".

Some of you guys do a wonderful job with these but unfortunately I'm located on the other side of the planet. That being said, I've got a skilled mechanic who does work for WPA, although he mostly does these jobs on Dynamic tables.

Current pocket size is 4.6" - seems on the large side but also true that jaws are a little rounded either from a lot of use or improper transportation. So the plan is to get the pocket size down to 4/4 1/8 by adding subrail extensions. However, since there isn't much of a shelf on these tables I'd also like to get the pockets "Diamondized" to imitate tougher conditions. I'm looking for tips and suggestions on this, especially maybe a drawing/sketch, and happy to pay a smaller fee for this consulting job, hah.

Another thing: the mechanic put on a slightly used Andy cloth that came with the table as it made no sense for put on a new cloth with me knowing that the table will undergo pocket surgery really soon. Andy Cloth plays extremely nice (and fast!) but I really expected more bounciness from the rails. I'll try to post a video of what I mean but basically there's no bounce that you usually get on Brunswick tables. I'm hoping new rubbers from the subrail job will help but I suspect there might be something else going on since my previous table (Dynamic III) also had very little bounce from the rail. Any chance what this could be? Conditions always seem to be around 70 degrees and 40-50% humidity. Is it possible that the cloth is put on too tightly around the rails (look at the number of staples in there), making the contact point slightly higher?


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Nice table! As far as Diamondizing goes, I think you would be better off just getting a Diamond if want the tightest pockets and still keep the desired shelf depth. It would probably be cheaper than replacing the slate and/or a Mark Gregory redesign of the subrails.
 
I thought Diamondizing the table just meant tightening the pockets and making the openings more parallel (they're quite V shaped now). The table plays super nice and prefer it to the Diamond ones but gotta tighten the pockets and figure out why there's so little bounce off the rail.
 
Give Mark Gregory a call and tell him what you want. I think he helped design the GC V so he should have some good ideas on how to tighten the pockets and keep the shelf depth similar to a Diamond.

Mark Gregory
(770) 548-4292
 
Lawnboy77 said:
Give Mark Gregory a call and tell him what you want. I think he helped design the GC V so he should have some good ideas on how to tighten the pockets and keep the shelf depth similar to a Diamond.

Mark Gregory
(770) 548-4292
Click to expand...
To tighten the pockets and keep shelf depth the same or even increase it a little you would need to add material to the pocket cuts in the slate.
 
fastone371 said:
To tighten the pockets and keep shelf depth the same or even increase it a little you would need to add material to the pocket cuts in the slate.
Click to expand...
Yeah it’s what I was eluding to in an earlier post, basically replace the slates with what RKC calls Diamond cut slates. Expensive I know, but reducing the pockets that much on that table will leave no shelf using the stock slates.
 
If you want 4.125" corners, you want the pockets cut to 139° but you will lose a little shelf in the process; can't avoid that. Here's a shot of my GCI. Corners are 4.125" cut to 139° and the sides are cut to 4.875" at 103° (if I recall correctly). Don't forget the down angle which is very important to correct pocket geometry. I can't recall the down angles my mechanic used but I believe the proper angles should be between 12° and 15°.

Side note: I would NOT allow the person who covered your table do the extensions and new rubber. They couldn't even cover the rails correctly. All those staples make my eyes hurt.

Screenshot 2024-07-11 at 6.49.31 AM copy 2.png
 
wealmostlostdetroit said:
What's the downside of putting too many staples in?

Your pockets look great. Do you perhaps any sketches or PDFs how it was done?
Click to expand...

Recent Rail Rebuild, b

Here's a table I recently redid. The table had Artemis k66 and played extremely slow, 3 cushions at break speed. Before and After Picts
forums.azbilliards.com

This thread shows pics of sub-rail extensions. I doubt that you will find a "how to" on making and installing sub-rail extensions. Once you see how it is done its pretty self explanatory, if you cant figure it out by seeing the pics it is probably beyond your capabilities.
 
wealmostlostdetroit said:
Hi guys.

Recently bought a Brunswick GC5 TE from a reputable seller. I like the table but the pockets are too big and would like to get them down to 4 or 4 1/8".

Some of you guys do a wonderful job with these but unfortunately I'm located on the other side of the planet. That being said, I've got a skilled mechanic who does work for WPA, although he mostly does these jobs on Dynamic tables.

Current pocket size is 4.6" - seems on the large side but also true that jaws are a little rounded either from a lot of use or improper transportation. So the plan is to get the pocket size down to 4/4 1/8 by adding subrail extensions. However, since there isn't much of a shelf on these tables I'd also like to get the pockets "Diamondized" to imitate tougher conditions. I'm looking for tips and suggestions on this, especially maybe a drawing/sketch, and happy to pay a smaller fee for this consulting job, hah.

Another thing: the mechanic put on a slightly used Andy cloth that came with the table as it made no sense for put on a new cloth with me knowing that the table will undergo pocket surgery really soon. Andy Cloth plays extremely nice (and fast!) but I really expected more bounciness from the rails. I'll try to post a video of what I mean but basically there's no bounce that you usually get on Brunswick tables. I'm hoping new rubbers from the subrail job will help but I suspect there might be something else going on since my previous table (Dynamic III) also had very little bounce from the rail. Any chance what this could be? Conditions always seem to be around 70 degrees and 40-50% humidity. Is it possible that the cloth is put on too tightly around the rails (look at the number of staples in there), making the contact point slightly higher?


View attachment 783198
View attachment 783199View attachment 783200
Click to expand...
Your skilled mechanic don't have the skills you think he has, that's horrible staple work in the pocket! Post some pictures of the underside of the rail cloth with the rails bolted down, I'd like to see what that cloth looks like. 3 things can slow the speed of the rails down without even knowing it! 1) loose rail bolts, 2) cloth pulled to tight over the nose of the cushions, causing them to be compressed, 3) cushions being stretched when having new cushions installed. Stretched cushions lose their spring with they're made stiff by stretching them, think of a rubber band stretched out, it gets thinner and harder!
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Juat
wealmostlostdetroit said:
I thought Diamondizing the table just meant tightening the pockets and making the openings more parallel (they're quite V shaped now). The table plays super nice and prefer it to the Diamond ones but gotta tighten the pockets and figure out why there's so little bounce off the rail.
Click to expand...
Just so you're aware, Diamondizing was started by me! what ever youve been told is wrong!
 
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