A seasoned 14:1 player should just know. You shouldn't have to point at the pocket. I mean, c'mon.
I love 9-ball but...
- Thread starter skor
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billiards_watch
Well-known member
Yea but he wants us to do it. I actually got in it with him about it. Clear and obvious shots shouldn't need to be called. It is what it is and I like the games.
The true showmen, the 'Shotmakers,' the 'Characters,' aren't around anymore. The game has become sterilized and neutered.
All the younger players look like carbon copies, pendulum stroke, hesitation on back swing, all showing signs of mainstream instruction. While this may help you make more balls consistently, and the juries still out on that one, it sure took all the fun out of watching it. 9 ball from the box, alternate breaks?? Blech.
I wouldn't mind old school winner breaks, push out behind the headstring 6 packs by true Shotmakers. Guys you enjoyed watching bcuz you never knew what was coming next. They won't let guys like that thru the door anymore. Bad for viewership, I guess?? I know. I tried.
They'd bed me down w the horses they rode in on.Gimme your address. I'll come play you. Promise you won't have to point at your hole.
That being said, you've gotta give me that 3 rail kiss off 2 balls in the corner I just made bcuz I meant to do that.Dear Skogstogig,
I was just being generous about the recovery of Glasgow.
I was at the time a Fulbright Visiting Professor for the academic year in Essen, Germany. Essen is the heart of the Ruhrgebiet. We’re not talking cuckoo clocks. We’re talking coal mining and rolling steel. And of course there was an economic downturn. Tourists don’t go to Essen.
(I have to say here that I enjoyed my year there immensely and would do it again in a second. There was an active cultural life and a tremendous billiard scene. Great colleagues and others.)
So a professor at Glasgow saw I was on the list of visiting professors in Europe and knew some of things I did touched upon his work. He put in a request with Fulbright that I be given a week in Glasgow, and Fulbright consented. I went in to the chairman of the department at Essen to inform him that I would be away for a week. As we were coming out of the chairman’s office we ran into the English professor. The chairman said to the English professor, “Our Fulbright visitor has been invited to Glasgow for a week.” The English professor without a moment’s hesitation replied, “The Fulbright Committee isn’t a bunch of fools. They figure that anybody who will spend a year in Essen will spend a week in Glasgow.”
I was just being generous about the recovery of Glasgow.
I was at the time a Fulbright Visiting Professor for the academic year in Essen, Germany. Essen is the heart of the Ruhrgebiet. We’re not talking cuckoo clocks. We’re talking coal mining and rolling steel. And of course there was an economic downturn. Tourists don’t go to Essen.
(I have to say here that I enjoyed my year there immensely and would do it again in a second. There was an active cultural life and a tremendous billiard scene. Great colleagues and others.)
So a professor at Glasgow saw I was on the list of visiting professors in Europe and knew some of things I did touched upon his work. He put in a request with Fulbright that I be given a week in Glasgow, and Fulbright consented. I went in to the chairman of the department at Essen to inform him that I would be away for a week. As we were coming out of the chairman’s office we ran into the English professor. The chairman said to the English professor, “Our Fulbright visitor has been invited to Glasgow for a week.” The English professor without a moment’s hesitation replied, “The Fulbright Committee isn’t a bunch of fools. They figure that anybody who will spend a year in Essen will spend a week in Glasgow.”
Moe Szyslak
Active member
Pool is more than 9 ball. I didn't say I wanted MMA. I said if people want 'fast action' they'll go watch MMA and not pool.
9-ball's evolving. Honestly, pool as a whole is going through some changes. Back in the mid-2000s, this forum was full of threads about how '9-ball is dying.' Fast forward 20-25 years, and guess what? 9-ball’s still kicking. How long will it stick around? No idea. But judging by how many threads there are on here, 9 ball tournaments are still one of the hottest topics. Some threads go on for pages and pages just talking about 9 ball. No other pool discipline gets this much attention here — unless we’re talking about big-money matches between the legends.
So yeah, I don’t think there’s a need to change much right now.
As for pro-level disciplines, I gotta say, I really enjoyed those two One Pocket exhibition matches PBS organized. They were quick, exciting, and honestly, I watched both from start to finish without getting bored. I’d love to see them organize a proper tournament for One Pocket.
Oh, and I’m also looking forward to the European Championship in 14.1 coming up in early April. Predator’s running it, so I’m hoping they’ll do a great job with the production. I’m gonna try to make myself watch it — I really want them to nail the coverage for this event.
So yeah, I don’t think there’s a need to change much right now.
As for pro-level disciplines, I gotta say, I really enjoyed those two One Pocket exhibition matches PBS organized. They were quick, exciting, and honestly, I watched both from start to finish without getting bored. I’d love to see them organize a proper tournament for One Pocket.
Oh, and I’m also looking forward to the European Championship in 14.1 coming up in early April. Predator’s running it, so I’m hoping they’ll do a great job with the production. I’m gonna try to make myself watch it — I really want them to nail the coverage for this event.
Ghost of OBC
Well-known member
If you look around the sporting universe, there's a distinct lack of story in pool coverage. Boxing is a very niche sport, but boxers start the show months ahead of time with talking sh*t, negotiating etc. Watch the Masters in a few weeks, there will be lots of packages with player bios, local flavor, history. I used to be involved in professional BBQ cooking, there were a few TV series that did pretty well. They emphasized conflict between participants, regional backgrounds, styles, and superstitions. Trust me, per minute, BBQ cooking is thousands of times more boring that pool.
I think UPL is an idea with promise. Wider fields with stories to tell about regional players is good for tv.
There isn't enough variance in the game to have the same 20 guys play each other on identical equipment at every event. Golf gets away with it because the course changes enough to mix up the leaderboard. Pool events start to look like re-runs pretty quickly. More drama, more sh*t talking, games and formats open to a greater range of possible winners would all help.
Why do we watch March Madness? Not to watch the top four run through the tournament, it is to see the upsets, the Cinderella stories, the conflict and drama. Pool needs more of that. It should be easy, it is a game full of characters, degenerates and longshots. Let's see em!
I think UPL is an idea with promise. Wider fields with stories to tell about regional players is good for tv.
There isn't enough variance in the game to have the same 20 guys play each other on identical equipment at every event. Golf gets away with it because the course changes enough to mix up the leaderboard. Pool events start to look like re-runs pretty quickly. More drama, more sh*t talking, games and formats open to a greater range of possible winners would all help.
Why do we watch March Madness? Not to watch the top four run through the tournament, it is to see the upsets, the Cinderella stories, the conflict and drama. Pool needs more of that. It should be easy, it is a game full of characters, degenerates and longshots. Let's see em!
For the general pooler school, 9 ball is the hot, trophy chick of pool. Noobs and veteran noobs. Been there.
Moe Szyslak
Active member
I don't know. If between every break and run out they cut away for five minutes to talk about the player's rough home life and how he overcame tough odds to blah blah, I think I'd shoot myself. I've seen some of those BBQ shows and the only thing more boring than the BBQ is the "story behind them."
Ghost of OBC
Well-known member
"Why can't we expand the viewership of professional pool?"
Oh, because we are slavishly catering to the preference of the extant viewers.
Do the same thing, get same results. But hey, maybe you are better at this than NBC. It could be that.
Sounds like the Olympics, all the drama. I can’t stand that nonsense
ah, the sob story. yes, i've seen this in phenomenon in about every american competition program. very cringe, but probably a cultural (and maybe played out / peaked) thing? the 9-ball tour is promoted by a british company and the predator tour boss is french, they're not as sentimental
Watching 9-ball, I’ve noticed something about the pros — they’re always trying to find ways to 'break' the game. And honestly, I think it’s just inevitable. Every player wants to take as much luck out of the equation as possible. They wanna win, so they’ll keep finding those little 'cheat codes' to give themselves even the slightest edge in a match.
Whether it’s Deuel back in 2001, Alcano in 2006, or Van Boening in 2014, they’ve all spent hours grinding to figure out loopholes in the break shot that can help them win. That’s what being a pro is all about, right?
It’s kinda like chess. If you’ve studied a new positional idea and you understand its strengths and weaknesses, you’re likely to win—especially in a timed game. Same deal here. Pool isn’t chess, sure, but the mindset is similar. It’s about finding an advantage. Take Alcano in the 2006 final—if I remember right, he was ranked somewhere in the 60s on the WPA list, while Souquet was #2. But Alcano had clearly found something that worked for him.
Speaking of alternative breaks: I think it became clear at some point (probably around the 2000s-2010s) that players could set up that first ball however they wanted to run out the rack. That’s when alternate breaks started making more sense to me. If a player can control the table right from the break shot and position themselves perfectly for the lowest ball, then what’s the point of winner-break rules? Whoever wins the lag would just dominate the entire match. Matchroom seems to be working on balancing this, though—like making it tricky to sink the 1-ball in the side pocket and adding some randomness to positioning for the next shot. I think that’s what’s keeping winner-break formats alive right now.
Anyway, just my two cents.
Whether it’s Deuel back in 2001, Alcano in 2006, or Van Boening in 2014, they’ve all spent hours grinding to figure out loopholes in the break shot that can help them win. That’s what being a pro is all about, right?
It’s kinda like chess. If you’ve studied a new positional idea and you understand its strengths and weaknesses, you’re likely to win—especially in a timed game. Same deal here. Pool isn’t chess, sure, but the mindset is similar. It’s about finding an advantage. Take Alcano in the 2006 final—if I remember right, he was ranked somewhere in the 60s on the WPA list, while Souquet was #2. But Alcano had clearly found something that worked for him.
Speaking of alternative breaks: I think it became clear at some point (probably around the 2000s-2010s) that players could set up that first ball however they wanted to run out the rack. That’s when alternate breaks started making more sense to me. If a player can control the table right from the break shot and position themselves perfectly for the lowest ball, then what’s the point of winner-break rules? Whoever wins the lag would just dominate the entire match. Matchroom seems to be working on balancing this, though—like making it tricky to sink the 1-ball in the side pocket and adding some randomness to positioning for the next shot. I think that’s what’s keeping winner-break formats alive right now.
Anyway, just my two cents.
Holy crap, screw the rest of this thread. This is literally in my +35yrs of speaking the bolded phrase have I ever heard anyone else use it. We must have picked it up from some TV show or the like. Can you remember a time when you first heard someone use that turn of phrase...?
No way we both constructed it from thin air....lol
Oh ya, and 9 ball is fine. Nothing broken, move on
I wholeheartedly agree... ...and the golf comparison has always been a bad one. How about we consider the immense popularity of pro darts instead...? Both tavern born games and that don't require any athletic ability.
Pool should want to be where darts is...
Moe Szyslak
Active member
What you don't want to do is drive away your existing audience, for starters. Ask Bud Light how that went.
I noticed watching the American vs. British versions of the Gordon Ramsey show where he goes to try and save a failing restaurant - the British show focuses on, you know, the failing restaurant and why it's failing. The American show, every time, cooks up some phony ass "family conflict" plotline where "the father can't give up control to his son" or something. I don't know, maybe people eat this stuff up. I can't stand it. If I'm watching the Olympics I can't turn the channel fast enough when they go to, 'Mary Smith grew up in...."
Why You Hate NBC's Olympics Coverage
NBC’s Olympics coverage tries to be all things to all people. For serious sports fans, the Peacock shows every event from Sochi live, either online or...
It’s reality TV masquerading as a sporting event...that the broadcasts are overtaken by contrived sob stories about some skier whose third cousin has leprosy.
Personally, being a lifelong 14.1 player, I was heartbroken when the pro format moved to 9 ball (a game I never really cared for that much anyway)...I would LOVE to see 14.1 returning as the championship game it once was...but...I'm not holding my breath...
That's good because you'd pass out before long.
Great game no doubt but it has a tiny following and zero fan appeal. It would be nice to have more than ONE decent event per year i agree. Be cool if Matchroom would have a big 14.1 deal once a year. Again, not holding breath.