DeeDeeCues
Well-known member
That all depends on a lot of factors. Don't presume that I've fully explained the construction. Or that I ever will.
Sneak-Peek, Half-CaF Shaft
- Thread starter DeeDeeCues
- Start date
That all depends on a lot of factors. Don't presume that I've fully explained the construction. Or that I ever will.
Dude, if you can prove provenance, I certainly would. These things might go south, or take off like gangbusters!!!
Doesn't cost that much to protect your idea.
And if I were you, I wouldn't delve into how these are made in any great detail online. Not until you have protections in place. Then you can post full specs if you so wish.Dude, if you can prove provenance, I certainly would. These things might go south, or take off like gangbusters!!!
Doesn't cost that much to protect your idea.
Just sayin...
While I have no interest in CF anymore than I do in jumping off a cliff, I find your innovation interesting and intriguing, more so because of you utilizing Bubinga on the bottom half. I know you pointed out it was to match the butt of the cue, but I’ve pondered the thought of what a full shaft made of bubinga would hit like?
I posed a question awhile back in the cue makers forum regarding what makers here thought of bubinga. You one of the few that responded, stating it was one of your favorite woods for the same characteristics I find interesting about that wood. Have you ever thought of an experiment of making a shaft of just bubinga?
I posed a question awhile back in the cue makers forum regarding what makers here thought of bubinga. You one of the few that responded, stating it was one of your favorite woods for the same characteristics I find interesting about that wood. Have you ever thought of an experiment of making a shaft of just bubinga?
DeeDeeCues
Well-known member
Thank-you for the kind words. I was firmly in your camp in regards to CF, but as a maker I was kinda forced to start building CF shafts. I couldn't really sell something I hadn't fully experienced, so this is where I find myself. My verdict is...they are fine. They aren't magical, but there is nothing wrong with CF.
I have never considered building a shaft from bubinga, or really any other wood. I believe that maple is pretty perfect and since I attempt to build cues that are as naturally weighted as possible, I feel the weight of bubinga could be a challenge.
But...this experience has changed my stance at least a bit.
Paul_#_
Well-known member
See Muskyed's photo from that post below
Comments from that December 2021 post:
Cool? That's just looks "funny" to say at least...but may be it's just me.
For me if one likes those benefits cf shafts offered ... just take it its simple and natural look with no deco rings what so ever...better think about the butt design to match it the best. Those cf shafts were designed to perform, last ... so on ...in the first place
You the man. Great find, I know I'm getting old and at times memory plays tricks on me, but i was positive I saw this at one time. Thanks, I haven't seen anything on this in years, and probably why Deedee doesn't remember it also. Seems to have come and went, and was sort of pricy for the time.See Muskyed's photo from that post below
Comments from that December 2021 post:
View attachment 864179
I would think this would allow for weighting variation requests which I'm sure DeeDee has thought of.
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Paul_#_
Well-known member
Looks wise, the combo is like a wood butt/CF shaft combo in that the CF portion often doesn't look good with the wood portion. In these two photos, I don't see an aesethetic advantage to it versus a conventional wood butt/CF shaft combo.
How short of a shaft could you go? If the CF is primarily useful in its low-deflection properties, would three inches, two inches, or one inch of CF be enough to confer low-deflection properties to the shaft?
There are advantages besides looks: Muskyed's versatility in adjusting shaft weight, use of a broken carbon-fiber shaft as Dee Dee did; may have hit and sound advantages to CF-only or wood-only; or, if the CF portion was one inch, it may look as good as any other wood-shaft wood-butt cue.
How short of a shaft could you go? If the CF is primarily useful in its low-deflection properties, would three inches, two inches, or one inch of CF be enough to confer low-deflection properties to the shaft?
There are advantages besides looks: Muskyed's versatility in adjusting shaft weight, use of a broken carbon-fiber shaft as Dee Dee did; may have hit and sound advantages to CF-only or wood-only; or, if the CF portion was one inch, it may look as good as any other wood-shaft wood-butt cue.
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I've often thought a shaft that was mostly carbon but switched to wood for the 6" or so nearest the joint would make a lot of sense. All the performance benefits of carbon but with a material that could be easily matched to an existing cue from joint diameter to ring work, just like a wood shaft.
I remember that movie, everybody died at the end
Paul_#_
Well-known member
Cool to see other takes on an idea I and a few others have had for several years. Very cool. My project has been about 4 or 5 years in the development and I've been through probably a dozen different iterations until now. I finally have a product I'll stake my soul on which is rather cool I think. For the record, a very good old friend of mine posted here on AZB with some of my earlier shafts. To no fault of his own he got utterly blasted by naysayers and trolls and ignorant dolts. Honestly, the vitriole and ignorance of a process and the comments pissed me off to no end and to the point that I stopped sharing my progress.
But, that's water under the bridge: At the moment I have probably 50 some-odd shafts out there being played with. All custom. I'm including some photos of my product and the GOAT hitting some balls with one of my prototypes from a year ago when I was HONORED to play him in an exhibition. Rather unabashedly he liked it and asked, "How do you ever miss a ball with this?" which made my millenium. That particular shaft was iteration number 7 or 8 in my products' evolution. Every change I made to my process was tested on that shaft first. It's been chopped up more times than I care to think about. "We have the technology. We can rebuild it."
These past years I found out there are at least two gents making such shafts other than me. The one gent who had this idea is Dominic Iraggi (thank you Anthony Milanese [who builds amAAAAzing cues] for refreshing my recollection of our conversation two years ago). Dominic is in Tennessee (?) and has some very nice shafts that are half hardwood like cocobolo as I recall and CF. There was another gent I ran into at the Super Billiards Expo who was doing exhibitions at a 3 Cushion Billiard table manufacturer's booth. He was playing with a 50/50 shaft although it was more like 80/20. Until then he was only the second person I'd seen using one. I chatted with him at length and he said his shaft was made in Japan by a gentleman named Hama. I searched into oblivion for that cue maker but only found dribs and drabs of information. I'm including a photo of one of Hama's cues which I found on Reddit and that post was probably 3 years old at the time.....now about 4 years old. As you can see it's really nothing more than a "bolt on" of a piece of maple to an existing 3C billiard carbon fiber shaft. Interesting though.
As I briefly mentioned my shafts are completely custom and I'll happily chat with anyone about that. My goal is as close to zero deflection as humanly possible. With that in mind, I recently developed a ferrule material, 3 years in development, hat is lower in end mass than anything else on the market as far as I can calculate. This was yet another rabbit hole to wander down so many years ago. There are several ferrule materials mentioned on AZB that are very good and I will not disparage any of them. I'm simply comparing MY material to everything that I could find that claims to be used as a ferrule these days. The results blew my mind. I included some common materials so people can visualize a control so to speak. Feel free to interpret my results in the .pdf below as you so choose. Like the consensus opinion I fully believe what I think science has proven - that "end mass" (that mass directly behind the tip for whatever distance) is the largest mitigating factor to deflection of a cue ball upon impact from that shaft. IF that is the case.............well...........see for yourself....read the information in the .pdf. For the record I will not share my material with anyone........for now. At least until I figure out how to protect my work, which has been exhaustive, to say the least. I will say it is NOT a standard, off-the-shelf material and it requires a LOT of work to get it to the point it can be used as a ferrule on a shaft. This is assuredly NOT a "throw-it-on-a lathe-and-turn-a-ferrule" kind of development. I want to give a huge shoutout to Thoroughbred tips who I buy from regularly. His are the ONLY tips I'll use. They are in a word........amazing. Just the best playing layered tip I have ever used and honestly, until now I have hated layered tips. And, Kelly at Thoroughbred is fantastic to work with.
If anyone would like to discuss my shafts or my research or what I'm trying to accomplish please message me and I'll give you my personal cell phone number.
But, that's water under the bridge: At the moment I have probably 50 some-odd shafts out there being played with. All custom. I'm including some photos of my product and the GOAT hitting some balls with one of my prototypes from a year ago when I was HONORED to play him in an exhibition. Rather unabashedly he liked it and asked, "How do you ever miss a ball with this?" which made my millenium. That particular shaft was iteration number 7 or 8 in my products' evolution. Every change I made to my process was tested on that shaft first. It's been chopped up more times than I care to think about. "We have the technology. We can rebuild it."
These past years I found out there are at least two gents making such shafts other than me. The one gent who had this idea is Dominic Iraggi (thank you Anthony Milanese [who builds amAAAAzing cues] for refreshing my recollection of our conversation two years ago). Dominic is in Tennessee (?) and has some very nice shafts that are half hardwood like cocobolo as I recall and CF. There was another gent I ran into at the Super Billiards Expo who was doing exhibitions at a 3 Cushion Billiard table manufacturer's booth. He was playing with a 50/50 shaft although it was more like 80/20. Until then he was only the second person I'd seen using one. I chatted with him at length and he said his shaft was made in Japan by a gentleman named Hama. I searched into oblivion for that cue maker but only found dribs and drabs of information. I'm including a photo of one of Hama's cues which I found on Reddit and that post was probably 3 years old at the time.....now about 4 years old. As you can see it's really nothing more than a "bolt on" of a piece of maple to an existing 3C billiard carbon fiber shaft. Interesting though.
As I briefly mentioned my shafts are completely custom and I'll happily chat with anyone about that. My goal is as close to zero deflection as humanly possible. With that in mind, I recently developed a ferrule material, 3 years in development, hat is lower in end mass than anything else on the market as far as I can calculate. This was yet another rabbit hole to wander down so many years ago. There are several ferrule materials mentioned on AZB that are very good and I will not disparage any of them. I'm simply comparing MY material to everything that I could find that claims to be used as a ferrule these days. The results blew my mind. I included some common materials so people can visualize a control so to speak. Feel free to interpret my results in the .pdf below as you so choose. Like the consensus opinion I fully believe what I think science has proven - that "end mass" (that mass directly behind the tip for whatever distance) is the largest mitigating factor to deflection of a cue ball upon impact from that shaft. IF that is the case.............well...........see for yourself....read the information in the .pdf. For the record I will not share my material with anyone........for now. At least until I figure out how to protect my work, which has been exhaustive, to say the least. I will say it is NOT a standard, off-the-shelf material and it requires a LOT of work to get it to the point it can be used as a ferrule on a shaft. This is assuredly NOT a "throw-it-on-a lathe-and-turn-a-ferrule" kind of development. I want to give a huge shoutout to Thoroughbred tips who I buy from regularly. His are the ONLY tips I'll use. They are in a word........amazing. Just the best playing layered tip I have ever used and honestly, until now I have hated layered tips. And, Kelly at Thoroughbred is fantastic to work with.
If anyone would like to discuss my shafts or my research or what I'm trying to accomplish please message me and I'll give you my personal cell phone number.
Attachments
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Paul_#_
Well-known member
Show results of what your products' deflection is compared to others. Dr Dave has a wonderful method that takes into consideration a person's variability to measure cue-shaft deflection accurately. Use his method to prove your products are superior.
See
The product IS here. Shot me a message and I'll send you my phone number. Would love to chat again.
I genuinely have no idea what other shafts deflection is nor do I really need to know. Nor will I spend the time or money to test every version of what's out there. What I have faithfully suggested is that if you believe the science then my ferrule material SHOULD deflect less. I will concede without reservation that ALL of this is dependant upon the player to deliver a smooth, accelerating stroke a la Buddy Hall or Efren or any of the other killer strokes that we all envy. I don't think a jabby kind of stroke would do any low deflection shaft ample justice.