Are Corey and Melling the 2 best at dissecting an 8 ball rack ever?

[skor]

I see, so its only professional pool if it conforms to your reality.

Not my reality
Pro pool is govern by the WPA.
Open events are just open events and you can have them play any game and if the money is good enough then sharks smell blood.
But it's not pro pool, opens means anybody can sign up.
If SVB and the rest of the pool pros go and play bowling, is it a pro bowling tournament?
I don't remember such a discussion in the past. Did the pros played on bar boxes at the Camel tour back in the 90s? or any other pro tour that they try to promote since?
why being so defensive? you know I'm right...

 

[nicksaint26]

LOL, and when SVB won his only World 9-ball, the world's best player at the time, Fedor Gorst, didn't play because WPA was boycotting Russian players, but nobody puts an asterisk there. Yes, the field was weaker than usual at last year's World 8-ball, too, but it was still tough, and there are no asterisks in pool .... accept among the Filler haters on the Internet, who will wake up one day and wonder why they were not more attentive watching the greatest 9ball player our game has ever seen.

To be a champion, one need not beat those that choose not to join the fight, only those that do.

And, of course, Filler seems to beat the most elite international fields all over the world on a much more regular basis than Shane or any other player ever did. At 27, Josh has won two WPA sanctioned world championships, the same as Shane. He has also won the US Open 9ball. He has also won the China Open, the UK Open, the European Open, the Qatar Open, and the World Games gold medal, and Shane has not won any of them.

If you want soft, try the just completed UK Open, where none of SVB, Gorst, FSR, Chua, Ko Pin Yi, Ko Ping Chung, Raga and Ouschan were in the field. Did you remember to put an asterisk next to Yapp's title and will you be regularly pointing out how soft that field was going forward?

I think comparing SVB winning a world title without Gorst in the field to Filler winning the world 8 ball title with hardly ANY top players in the field is not the same. Just my opinion.

 

[Nick8400]

Well, like it or not, Ultimate Pool and Ultimate Pool USA are a thing, and are definitely growing. Fun events, and a popular local league scene that is expanding.

Man, the levels of elitism and gatekeeping around here are kinda ridiculous sometimes.

Barbox serves its purpose and is clearly a thing. But so is high pitch softball. No one is sitting around debating which of the world’s greatest baseball players are the best at it.

It’s a total joke of a game for any pro.

I’ve never been accused of elitism before. I kind of like the ring to it.

 

[Fore Rail]

I guess every single one of the pros that have ever came to Saratoga for the Wyoming Open shouldn't have based upon the event being played on "amateur tables."

I remember the likes of Corey Deuel, Mike Massey, Rodney Morris coming to the Larry Martin invitational in Laramie, Wy. 8 ball tournament played on the "amateur tables."

They didn't win.

 

[sjm]

Not sure what the tone of your message was here, but I'll try to clarify my stance a bit for you since you took the time to write such a thoughtful response. I don't put asterisks on anything with pool history. I love watching good pool, but honestly don't care about pool stats or history much. I asked if that was the tournament he was referring to since he used it as a way to establish Josh as a dominant 8-ball player (which everyone who isn't hiding under a rock already knows). I love watching Josh anytime he is on a pool table, he's incredible.

I also would agree with you that the UK Open was a softer field. Hard to debate that one. Why would you ask if I'd be pointing that out regularly as some form of discrediting Yapp? He's also one of my favorite players. Do you see me coming on here often doing this type of stuff? You're response seemed like you were somehow offended at my asking which tournament he was referring to.

Thanks for your reply. While I may have felt offended, perhaps I should not have.

I am pretty sensitive when anybody tries, intentionally or unintentionally, to devalue the accomplishments of the pro players. This just in - winning major titles is hard! I have been on the forum for twenty-two years now, and for twenty years, devaluing the efforts of players that win majors was not done, but within the last year, it has become an issue, and Filler has been the primary whipping boy on AZB over and over.

Perhaps my sensitivity here is a personal weakness, but I think we should always delight in the accomplishments of all who win at the majors. If I misinterpreted you, I apologize.

As fans, we are always disappointed when the majors deliver anything less than the best fields, but once the play begins, that is water under the bridge and seeing who has got the quality to win the toughest titles fascinates us.

Greatness is measured in titles, and I'll celebrate the greatness I've seen from Filler, but also from Gorst, SVB, and others in recent years. We are witnessing the finest pool ever played, and we should enjoy it to the max.

Sounds like we both love watching great pool!

 

[JPB2]

Not my reality
Pro pool is govern by the WPA.
Open events are just open events and you can have them play any game and if the money is good enough then sharks smell blood.

Perhaps this is a source of disagreement. The WPA isn’t the governing body of pro pool. It seeks to be the international governing body and IOC connection. I checked the website in the “about” portion. Some of the recent dispute has been WPA sanctioning of pro events. Which I personally think is wrong. Here’s why.

No other sport - to my knowledge- with functioning pro leagues has those leagues beholden to the IOC/ international governing body. Now I don’t know much about- thank goodness- FIFA or how the countless pro leagues interact with them. But I know the NBA, NHL etc… have pro leagues in Olympic sports that aren’t governed by the international governing body. This is healthy - economically and otherwise. It doesn’t take much reading of the sports pages to eventually read about scandals and corruption in these IOC international governing bodies. Monopolies in this type of thing aren’t good.

I hope pro pool is bigger than the WPA events and mindset. There is, for example, pro one pocket. That’s a good thing. Not every pro event is a WPA event. Just as the average PGA or DP World Tour event has nothing to do with the IOC or USGA/R&A governing bodies. That’s a good thing.

 

[sjm]

I think comparing SVB winning a world title without Gorst in the field to Filler winning the world 8 ball title with hardly ANY top players in the field is not the same. Just my opinion.

I agree here, but the point is that history doesn't record who showed up to anything, and that as fans, we should appreciate those that win majors regardless of how they accomplished the feat.

 

[TeddyKGB]

Bergman and SVB have to be in that conversation also. between the 4 of them it would come down to the break which is probably the most luck/bad luck part of pool

 

[skor]

Perhaps this is a source of disagreement. The WPA isn’t the governing body of pro pool. It seeks to be the international governing body and IOC connection. I checked the website in the “about” portion. Some of the recent dispute has been WPA sanctioning of pro events. Which I personally think is wrong. Here’s why.

No other sport - to my knowledge- with functioning pro leagues has those leagues beholden to the IOC/ international governing body. Now I don’t know much about- thank goodness- FIFA or how the countless pro leagues interact with them. But I know the NBA, NHL etc… have pro leagues in Olympic sports that aren’t governed by the international governing body. This is healthy - economically and otherwise. It doesn’t take much reading of the sports pages to eventually read about scandals and corruption in these IOC international governing bodies. Monopolies in this type of thing aren’t good.

I hope pro pool is bigger than the WPA events and mindset. There is, for example, pro one pocket. That’s a good thing. Not every pro event is a WPA event. Just as the average PGA or DP World Tour event has nothing to do with the IOC or USGA/R&A governing bodies. That’s a good thing.

OK
So pro pool in the USA can go 7ft for all I care, while the rest of the world pros will play on 9ft.
Let's see where it'll get the USA in the world of pool.
SVB is the last great American player. All the other "pros" are not on the level of international pool. And he is getting old...

When did the USA last win the Mosconi? They can't even come up with 5 names strong enough....

Have you watched the last European championships? All the top Euro players were not there; they played at the McDermott Open, and still the level of play by the "B players" was very high. I'll bet that any American that could have competed in it would not have made it to the last 8.

You guys try to justify the easy way and are blind to the fact that American pool is getting nowhere. What's next? lower the height of the baskets at the NBA? Maybe play "football" on a half-sized field so the fat guys don't have to run so much... And there is really no need for 9 innings in baseball; let them just play 3. Forget golf; pros should play mini-golf. Do you really need a net in tennis?

Good luck

 

[JPB2]

OK
So pro pool in the USA can go 7ft for all I care, while the rest of the world pros will play on 9ft.
Let's see where it'll get the USA in the world of pool.
SVB is the last great American player. All the other "pros" are not on the level of international pool. And he is getting old...

When did the USA last win the Mosconi? They can't even come up with 5 names strong enough....

Have you watched the last European championships? All the top Euro players were not there; they played at the McDermott Open, and still the level of play by the "B players" was very high. I'll bet that any American that could have competed in it would not have made it to the last 8.

You guys try to justify the easy way and are blind to the fact that American pool is getting nowhere. What's next? lower the height of the baskets at the NBA? Maybe play "football" on a half-sized field so the fat guys don't have to run so much... And there is really no need for 9 innings in baseball; let them just play 3. Forget golf; pros should play mini-golf. Do you really need a net in tennis?

Good luck

Sorry you didn't want to address the WPA. If you want the excellent European players to make money you might want to think about it. It also seems you do care about us Americans playing on 7' tables. Look, I get that the US has a player development problem. It is a significant and complex issue. But your ideas about pro pool and the WPA are subject to disagreement. And I can tell you how much the WPA has done to address the issue in the USA and how successful the BCA - the US WPA body - has been.

 

[fastone371]

OK
So pro pool in the USA can go 7ft for all I care, while the rest of the world pros will play on 9ft.
Let's see where it'll get the USA in the world of pool.
SVB is the last great American player. All the other "pros" are not on the level of international pool. And he is getting old...

When did the USA last win the Mosconi? They can't even come up with 5 names strong enough....

Have you watched the last European championships? All the top Euro players were not there; they played at the McDermott Open, and still the level of play by the "B players" was very high. I'll bet that any American that could have competed in it would not have made it to the last 8.

You guys try to justify the easy way and are blind to the fact that American pool is getting nowhere. What's next? lower the height of the baskets at the NBA? Maybe play "football" on a half-sized field so the fat guys don't have to run so much... And there is really no need for 9 innings in baseball; let them just play 3. Forget golf; pros should play mini-golf. Do you really need a net in tennis?

Good luck

I don't understand why you are complaining about pool in the USA if you are not American. I also do understand why you have a problem with 7' tables, is someone forcing you to own one or play on one?? Let the people who actually play on bar boxes worry about how many feet long a pool table is. I have a 9' table at home, I prefer playing on 9' tables yet I compete completely on bar boxes because that's where the tournaments are and that's what size the tables are. I don't find making shots on my 9' harder than making shots on a 7' table, maybe others struggle with that, I'm sorry that I don't see the difficulty.

 

[markjames]

especially if your name is Pia Filler

 

[skor]

I don't understand why you are complaining about pool in the USA if you are not American. I also do understand why you have a problem with 7' tables, is someone forcing you to own one or play on one?? Let the people who actually play on bar boxes worry about how many feet long a pool table is. I have a 9' table at home, I prefer playing on 9' tables yet I compete completely on bar boxes because that's where the tournaments are and that's what size the tables are. I don't find making shots on my 9' harder than making shots on a 7' table, maybe others struggle with that, I'm sorry that I don't see the difficulty.

I care about pool
The US was the Mecca for pool players who wanted to play with the best and becaome a pro. Not so much anymore and I find it sad.
Why not make America great again in pool as well?

 

[Nick B]

I'm late to debate but Corey & Melling are highlight reel artists. Super capable but not the top rung best of the best. You want someone to hit a 4 rails combo-carom. Well those two are who you want to shoot it. But...But...when it come to top flight 8 ball you only have 2 gentlemen, 1 lets see and a tip of the hat to the "People's Goat".

1-2 SVB. Killer Serve (break) & Volley (patterns) or Appleton (pin point touch and shape)
Let See: Filler - Still work in progress
GOAT = Efren. During IPT and past his prime he still took home the cash

Oh and for the Bar Box kids...stop being so bum hurt. You all know in your hearts it's less than elite.

 

[AtLarge]

... Filler winning the world 8 ball title with hardly ANY top players in the field ...

Here's the list of the players who finished in the money in the 2024 World 8-Ball Championship: https://www.azbilliards.com/tournam...orld-8-ball-championship-2024/?action=results. Here are some of the entrants who finished out of the money: Biado, Grabe, Szewczyk, He, Maciol, Souquet.

My view is that this was a tough field regardless of the absence of a lot of the other top players.

 

[nicksaint26]

Here's the list of the players who finished in the money in the 2024 World 8-Ball Championship: https://www.azbilliards.com/tournam...orld-8-ball-championship-2024/?action=results. Here are some of the entrants who finished out of the money: Biado, Grabe, Szewczyk, He, Maciol, Souquet.

My view is that this was a tough field regardless of the absence of a lot of the other top players.

None of the top 7 Fargo rated players were there except Filler. I think Filler is the best player in the world but that was a weak field in my opinion for a World Championship.

 

[Bob Jewett]

Maybe we should have another Accu-Stats "Make It Happen" 8-ball event. A round robin with races to 21. All we need is a little financial support.

 

[skogstokig]

I'm late to debate but Corey & Melling are highlight reel artists. Super capable but not the top rung best of the best. You want someone to hit a 4 rails combo-carom. Well those two are who you want to shoot it. But...But...when it come to top flight 8 ball you only have 2 gentlemen, 1 lets see and a tip of the hat to the "People's Goat".

1-2 SVB. Killer Serve (break) & Volley (patterns) or Appleton (pin point touch and shape)
Let See: Filler - Still work in progress
GOAT = Efren. During IPT and past his prime he still took home the cash

Oh and for the Bar Box kids...stop being so bum hurt. You all know in your hearts it's less than elite.

you're not wrong. at least one has to admit that melling is an underachiever in games with american pool balls.. won china open 9b and DCC 9b, and i believe runner up in chinese 8-ball. impressive, but looking at his talent and stroke he shouldve won more than he has. breaking and percentage play is sub-par.

not flaming, as i said he's one of my favorite players. goes for corey too, one of the most interesting players, a bit of a circuit breaker, not only with the 9b break but also when he tried that aggressive one pocket break haha. the look on daulton's face when he did it against him

 

[straightline]

Guys like Melling can play way out there. I believe it's a fanatical psychological condition that will only last as long as the synaptic structure holds. Probably why other needtobe supermen use the pills.

 

[pt109]

Thanks for your reply. While I may have felt offended, perhaps I should not have.

I am pretty sensitive when anybody tries, intentionally or unintentionally, to devalue the accomplishments of the pro players. This just in - winning major titles is hard! I have been on the forum for twenty-two years now, and for twenty years, devaluing the efforts of players that win majors was not done, but within the last year, it has become an issue, and Filler has been the primary whipping boy on AZB over and over.

Perhaps my sensitivity here is a personal weakness, but I think we should always delight in the accomplishments of all who win at the majors. If I misinterpreted you, I apologize.

As fans, we are always disappointed when the majors deliver anything less than the best fields, but once the play begins, that is water under the bridge and seeing who has got the quality to win the toughest titles fascinates us.

Greatness is measured in titles, and I'll celebrate the greatness I've seen from Filler, but also from Gorst, SVB, and others in recent years. We are witnessing the finest pool ever played, and we should enjoy it to the max.

Sounds like we both love watching great pool!

I like that statement Stu….”Greatness is measured in titles.”……I was a big frog in a small pond in my area…..I’ve had people tell whoppers to my face about some pool and snooker exploits…..I would tell them it wasn’t so…..but titles you got for life.
A lot of the legend stories are related by people who don’t understand and become exaggerations.