Southwest contact

jasonlaus · Apr 19, 2014

macguy said:
Probably any SW delivered today that was ordered like 7 or 8 years ago. Are you saying SW is quoting the same prices today as 8 years ago for the same cues? I got one that was $460.00 when I ordered it and sold it at the BCA show for $2000.00. I am sure it has still gone up in value even more.

My wife had one she played with for about 5 years. She paid like $700.00 for it used. We sold it at the BCA show when she didn't want it any more for $1700.00. And again, this was some years ago and I am sure it would sell for even more today. The after market price has little to do with the actual value of the cue. If someone does not want to wait it is just a willing seller and a willing buyer.

Mine by the way was a one of a kind cue. It had the 6 ebony points but no veneers and the forearm was straight clear maple no BE. It is probably the only one with no BE or figure in the forearm. I never liked BE and had a number of cues made without it over the years.

Let me get this straight. You think it is OK for a cuemaker to take an order, have you wait like 5 years and when the cue is ready, tell you you can't have the cue because he got a better offer for it? You have to get into a bidding war to own your own cue. You don't feel that that order represents a contract they have to adhere to? Are you nuts?

I'm saying in some cases you're not getting the cue you ordered 10yrs ago, you're Getting a much better product through construction technique and equipment, which cost $$$ to develop.
If I built cues FOR PLAYERS, and FLIPPERS were reselling as soon as they showed up I'd probably be a little more selective in who I sold to also

franko · Apr 19, 2014

Understand

sciarco said:
Hi Marc I just think it's a long wait for a cue I mean at my age can't afford to wait that long

I understand the age thing , I am in the same boat but really wanted a SW cue so I went to ga9ball ( Greg Antonakos ) he always has a great selection and is great to work with. I now have two and could not be happier.

macguy · Apr 19, 2014

jasonlaus said:
I'm saying in some cases you're not getting the cue you ordered 10yrs ago, you're Getting a much better product through construction technique and equipment, which cost $$$ to develop.
If I built cues FOR PLAYERS, and FLIPPERS were reselling as soon as they showed up I'd probably be a little more selective in who I sold to also

I would bet like 75% of the cues they have on order are just people who called and placed an order. What do they care. If it ever shows up fine, they may play with it or sell it. No one is waiting 10 years for a cue they want to play with, It is completely unrealistic.

They are buying the SW cue just to have one. I doubt very few players even play with the same cue dimensions all their lives or even a few years at a time. My favorite cue is one I made and I have changed it a number of times. If you order a cue and wait 10 years you probably won't like the cue when you get it as your desires and needs in a cue will have changed.

I used to play with a 57", 13.5 mm and 20 ounce. I loved those dimensions and play real good with cues like that. That is what my first Ginacue was. Today I couldn't play with that cue. I now use a 58"
12.5 mm 19.25 ounce and an even slightly slimmer butt.

Being able to build cues is a real luxury when it comes to your own cue. You can tinker and really find out what you like. I went to the slimmer butt only the last few years and I am surprised I like it so much better. It may be me, I may have changed over the years I have been playing for more then 50 years.

I find it hard to believe you can order a cue that will fill your needs 10 years from now, We all change. Man, I wonder how many times SW gets calls changing the orders. With the number of cues they have on order it may be like everyday. It is not like the player is nuts, they really do want something then what they wanted say 5 years ago.

Tim Scruggs told me that was what he hated most, people who order a cue and then starts with all the changes every month. He told me he dreaded answering the phone after a while and having to talk to these people.

macguy · Apr 19, 2014

franko said:
I understand the age thing , I am in the same boat but really wanted a SW cue so I went to ga9ball ( Greg Antonakos ) he always has a great selection and is great to work with. I now have two and could not be happier.

Used to be a guy named Vince, I think he lived in Vegas who had a deal with SW. He got like 2 or 3 cues a month that he resold at a premium. I don't know what ever happened to him I am long out of the loop. He may still be around.

dom_poppa · Apr 19, 2014

jasonlaus said:
I'm saying in some cases you're not getting the cue you ordered 10yrs ago, you're Getting a much better product through construction technique and equipment, which cost $$$ to develop.
If I built cues FOR PLAYERS, and FLIPPERS were reselling as soon as they showed up I'd probably be a little more selective in who I sold to also

I disagree. A consumer should not wait 10 years till a cue builder finally learned a better technique. This should have been done years ago.

As for equipment, they should reduce the cost of the cue since it is helping them produce the cues at a faster rate than before. I mean better technique and equipment means it is easier. If it is easier then the waiting time should at least reduce -or- price.

Lets face it, there is no justifying the increase in cost unless it is materials, in which we can justify. They should have adjusted the price accordingly to inflation. I mean if there is a decade's wait then one can calculate price so there are no surprises.

We can be honest, the waiting period is ridiculous in any business model, including cues.

jasonlaus · Apr 19, 2014

macguy said:
I would bet like 75% of the cues they have on order are just people who called and placed an order. What do they care. If it ever shows up fine, they may play with it or sell it. No one is waiting 10 years for a cue they want to play with, It is completely unrealistic.

They are buying the SW cue just to have one. I doubt very few players even play with the same cue dimensions all their lives or even a few years at a time. My favorite cue is one I made and I have changed it a number of times. If you order a cue and wait 10 years you probably won't like the cue when you get it as your desires and needs in a cue will have changed.

I used to play with a 57", 13.5 mm and 20 ounce. I loved those dimensions and play real good with cues like that. That is what my first Ginacue was. Today I couldn't play with that cue. I now use a 58"
12.5 mm 19.25 ounce and an even slightly slimmer butt.

Being able to build cues is a real luxury when it comes to your own cue. You can tinker and really find out what you like. I went to the slimmer butt only the last few years and I am surprised I like it so much better. It may be me, I may have changed over the years I have been playing for more then 50 years.

I find it hard to believe you can order a cue that will fill your needs 10 years from now, We all change. Man, I wonder how many times SW gets calls changing the orders. With the number of cues they have on order it may be like everyday. It is not like the player is nuts, they really do want something then what they wanted say 5 years ago.

Tim Scruggs told me that was what he hated most, people who order a cue and then starts with all the changes every month. He told me he dreaded answering the phone after a while and having to talk to these people.

Agree 100pct. I'm changing my cue all the time(same cue btw) went to smaller diameter shafts, then changed back to almost full size, had the taper changed to straight taper about 16-18" long and right now I'm playing with a 10" extension on the butt.
It feels like a jump cue when I take the ext off to play elsewhere where there isn't room lol.
I can't imagine the amount of change requests those guys receive, especially with all the cue porn on here.
Glad to hear your still playin after more than 50yrs
Jason

dom_poppa · Apr 19, 2014

macguy said:
Used to be a guy named Vince, I think he lived in Vegas who had a deal with SW. He got like 2 or 3 cues a month that he resold at a premium. I don't know what ever happened to him I am long out of the loop. He may still be around.

It happens all the time. Cue builders have two outlets. One, is the customer and the other is the dealer, the ones who price gouges the price.

Cue Builder A pumps out 5 cues a month. 3 goes to the dealer. Guarantee money.The 2 other cues? To the customers that are willing to buy, perhaps on his waiting list. While these guys that are waiting in line, the dealer helps them by driving the prices up.When you finally get to the front of the line, the price is now different. Rinse and repeat. There is a supposed 10 year list, that is plenty to keep the cycle and business running.

There is a seller on here that brags about how Sugartree delivers him cues. Not just one but multiples. So if Sugartrees are hard to get than why does this person have so many freshly delivered ones that happen to be for sale?

jasonlaus · Apr 19, 2014

dom_poppa said:
I disagree. A consumer should not wait 10 years till a cue builder finally learned a better technique. This should have been done years ago.

As for equipment, they should reduce the cost of the cue since it is helping them produce the cues at a faster rate than before. I mean better technique and equipment means it is easier. If it is easier then the waiting time should at least reduce -or- price.

Lets face it, there is no justifying the increase in cost unless it is materials, in which we can justify. They should have adjusted the price accordingly to inflation. I mean if there is a decade's wait then one can calculate price so there are no surprises.

We can be honest, the waiting period is ridiculous in any business model, including cues.

Don't get on a list then!

Jason<---------problem solver

PS. I agree, prices shouldn't go up(just trying to see it from their point of view) but you're completely wrong about improving a product, I guess we shoulda stuck with the Model T - that idiot Henry Ford just couldn't get it right. Wow

axejunkie · Apr 19, 2014

dom_poppa said:
We can be honest, the waiting period is ridiculous in any business model, including cues.

The customers will determine this. Many on the waiting list are content to be there, otherwise they would remove their names. If enough remove their names, then South West has much less business and then has to revise their business model if they want to maintain market share and/or grow their business. Pretty simple.

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