Glue joint test

JoeyInCali

Maker of Joey Bautista Cues
Silver Member
Dare I say strength is not all that critical at all in many aspects of cue work. Take a typical "A" joint for example. It already has a threaded metal stud or threaded tenon providing the joint strength. It also has a tenon & bore. What's required there is an adhesive that can keep the tenon and bore from rubbing(buzzing) while also acting as a thread lock to prevent the joint from unscrewing. A hard curing glue will break and buzz. A non-hardening glue will defeat the purpose. Goldilocks is the ticket.

One can argue, the more flexible one might work better .

We know one great maker used wood glue with his aluminum stud.
And has not shown any problems. It it did, he would have quit doing it .

A late friend of mine used to export a lower line of cues to Indonesia.
I saw his worker press-fit a phenolic collar with super glue.
Minutes later, the shaft went to the taper machine.
It didn't move.
He sold a lot of them. None came back afaik.
 

qbilder

slower than snails
Silver Member
A late friend of mine used to export a lower line of cues to Indonesia.
I saw his worker press-fit a phenolic collar with super glue.
Minutes later, the shaft went to the taper machine.
It didn't move.
He sold a lot of them. None came back afaik.

Which corroborates the findings of the first video. So long as the tolerances were reasonable, it would hold rock solid indefinitely.
 

thoffen

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I doubt glue strength itself has anything to do with cues these days. Choosing the wrong glue/amount/relief for the application on the other hand...
 

Ssonerai

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I have not made many cues, but use about a C unit of WEST every year, and anywhere from a single to a "few" gallons of Titebond extend & type 3 in other millwork projects.

So far i have used Titebond for full splice cues. In cabinet work it gives a finer glue line, fine as the joint you make. Whereas WEST wicks in to some extent, and makes joints look a little thicker than they are. In hardwoods this is not a major factor, but it can be a factor. For other assemblies i love WEST for the long assembly time. And for the fact that with tight, complex assemblies it acts like grease to slide the parts together. While Titebond is apt to grab and seize up if the joint is close, tight, and you wait to long to assemble it.

I have always argued on the wood sites that that test was deeply flawed. The epoxy had no filler and was not used the way an informed used would. But IME titebond often does provide a better joint on "difficult to glue" and very hard woods.

I use anwhere from -none- to a few pounds of hot hide glue for restoration work. Currently using it on re-attaching veneers on an old Brunswick Royal table. It is ideal for use where it was the original glue. I wouldn't use it on a modern cue, though, no matter what Rambow and Brunswick probably used to make quite a few great cues in the old days. I wonder if GB even had anything much better, though they had some PVA's and the weldwood products at least by his later years.

Love cyano-acrylics for joints, ferules, tips, butt caps, all the routine trim and fitting out of a cue. Mostly loctite shock resistant or gel, but also some of the thinner glues

This site is great for information - I've been appreciating that people (even big name cue builders) are willing to share actual experience and observations. Thanks!

smt
 
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qbilder

slower than snails
Silver Member
So far i have used Titebond for full splice cues. In cabinet work it gives a finer glue line, fine as the joint you make. Whereas WEST wicks in to some extent, and makes joints look a little thicker than they are. In hardwoods this is not a major factor, but it can be a factor. For other assemblies i love WEST for the long assembly time. And for the fact that with tight, complex assemblies it acts like grease to slide the parts together. While Titebond is apt to grab and seize up if the joint is close, tight, and you wait to long to assemble it.

You're touching in on many factors more important than strength, and much of what you speak of parallels with the more complex cue designs. Working time, initial tack, weeping, hardness, pliability, etc. are all important things to consider. So long as a glue has the strength to hold one component to another, it has met its strength requirement. That's where the decision then becomes based on all of those other factors and more.

Fit is another factor that doesn't get a lot of attention but is critical no matter the glue you use. Whether threaded or slip, a good friction fit is a must for the glue to do its thing. Too tight and the glue will be pushed away. Too loose and the joint is entirely reliant on the glue's gap filling strength. A little drag in the fit makes all the difference.
 

QMAKER

LIVE FREE OR DIE
Silver Member
Glue

What Eric said regarding joinery is spot on.

"Fit is another factor that doesn't get a lot of attention but is critical no matter the glue you use. Whether threaded or slip, a good friction fit is a must for the glue to do its thing. Too tight and the glue will be pushed away. Too loose and the joint is entirely reliant on the glue's gap filling strength. A little drag in the fit makes all the difference".

With that said: Several years ago I performed a test on wood glue, epoxy
and Gorilla glue in order to satisfy my own curiosity. I published the results, and my methodology here about 6 or 7 years ago.

The results were:
Wood to wood (no gap filling) Titebond
Dis-similar materials-30 minute epoxy for such as collars, ferrules, etc.
Gap filling-Gorilla glue. Cores and such.
 
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