10-Ball Rule Question

J

Jeff Rosen

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Excuse me if the answer is obvious. This came up in a Mega Bucks league match the other night.
We play call shot, call safety. If someone calls safety but gets the object ball in anyway can the opponent have him/her shoot again? Here's the situation. I had a very easy shot on the seven but the eight was on the middle of the short rail. I had no angle to get up to the eight so I called safety and deliberately shot the seven in. My opponent said "shoot again". I asked why as I called safety. He said once I got the object ball in it was not a safety any more. The league operator agreed with him. Now I do believe they were right but I'm asking here for some confirmation to be sure.
 
By WPA rules, if you call safe and then make a ball, whether intentionally or not, the opponent has the option to shoot or pass it back to you. I'm not a big fan of the rule personally, but that's the way it is. There is no reason to call safe in WPA 10-ball, so you should always call any balls that might have a chance to fall.
 
Jeff Rosen said:
Excuse me if the answer is obvious. This came up in a Mega Bucks league match the other night.
We play call shot, call safety. If someone calls safety but gets the object ball in anyway can the opponent have him/her shoot again? Here's the situation. I had a very easy shot on the seven but the eight was on the middle of the short rail. I had no angle to get up to the eight so I called safety and deliberately shot the seven in. My opponent said "shoot again". I asked why as I called safety. He said once I got the object ball in it was not a safety any more. The league operator agreed with him. Now I do believe they were right but I'm asking here for some confirmation to be sure.
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In most rules I have seen, if you call a safe and accidentally make a ball, the shot can be passed back to you.

I don't really agree with that rule but it does prevent things like just calling a safe and shooting a ball in the pocket and leaving the other guy hooked without much effort.

If you can pass a shot back if you call a shot and miss, the opposite coin of that if you call a safe, you should not be penalized if a ball accidentally goes in.

What I would like to see is that if a guy misses a shot but hooks the incoming player, instead of being forced to do a kick if the shot is passed back, you can do a push out and then the incoming player can have the option of shooting or making you shoot again.
 
Jeff Rosen said:
Excuse me if the answer is obvious. This came up in a Mega Bucks league match the other night.
We play call shot, call safety. If someone calls safety but gets the object ball in anyway can the opponent have him/her shoot again? Here's the situation. I had a very easy shot on the seven but the eight was on the middle of the short rail. I had no angle to get up to the eight so I called safety and deliberately shot the seven in. My opponent said "shoot again". I asked why as I called safety. He said once I got the object ball in it was not a safety any more. The league operator agreed with him. Now I do believe they were right but I'm asking here for some confirmation to be sure.
Click to expand...

That's how I've always seen the call shot/call safe rules implemented. A pocketed ball on a called safety means the incoming player has the option of whether to shoot or give it back.

-Andrew
 
The main reason for the rule (shoot again for a safe that pockets a ball) is to avoid exactly the kind of safe you wanted to play. If you pocket the lowest ball on a safe you can know exactly where the next ball will after the safe. In the particular shot you were playing, in case the 10 is in the middle of the table, it would have been really easy to not only leave very long but also to move the cue ball a little forward or back and get a perfect snooker. Imagine a situation that's similar but right after the break and you get too straight position on the two with the three at the other end of the table.

The rule seems intended to emphasize offensive skill over "cheap" defensive play. Whether that's the right emphasis is opinion.
 
It should be clearly defined ahead of time. You shouldn't be asking about it after the fact. If they didn't define it clearly, you should have asked.

I've played BCA, TAP, and APA and they all made it clear. In BCA you could call a safety and purposely or acidentally make a ball and it was still the other guy's shot. In APA slop counts and you always shoot again if you make a legal shot. In TAP I don't remember the exact rule but I do remember it was clearly defined.
 
victorl said:
By WPA rules, if you call safe and then make a ball, whether intentionally or not, the opponent has the option to shoot or pass it back to you. I'm not a big fan of the rule personally, but that's the way it is. There is no reason to call safe in WPA 10-ball, so you should always call any balls that might have a chance to fall.
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+1 Safe in WPA 10ball makes no sense. Why would you give the chance to your opponent to enter the table and allow him to return the turn to you if he doesn't like the shot? In fact, it's a rule that plays against the player that calls it, because it has no benefits and some damages (imagine you call safe on a ball that could go in, the ball goes in by accident and you have a great shot to the next ball... but is your opponent's turn! If you had not call safe, you would have the next shot, and if you hadn't make the ball there would be no difference that if you called safe )
 
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No "Safety" in BCAPL 10-Ball Rules

purpdrag said:
It should be clearly defined ahead of time. You shouldn't be asking about it after the fact. If they didn't define it clearly, you should have asked.

I've played BCA, TAP, and APA and they all made it clear. In BCA you could call a safety and purposely or acidentally make a ball and it was still the other guy's shot. In APA slop counts and you always shoot again if you make a legal shot. In TAP I don't remember the exact rule but I do remember it was clearly defined.
Click to expand...

The BCAPL removed safeties from their 10-ball rules quite a while ago. Very surprised that the WPA has yet to do so.
 
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