14.1 Rule Clarification, Please

[Chris]

6.12 SUCCESSIVE FOUL PENALTIES
When a player commits a foul, penalization is one point (or more as appropriate) and a notation is made and posted by the scorer that the player is "on a foul." The player remains "on a foul" until the next shot attempt, at which time the foul may be removed by successfully pocketing a called ball, or completing a legal safety. If failing to meet these requirements on the next turn at the table, the player is penalized one point. The notation is changed to "on two fouls." If he fails to meet the requirements of successfully pocketing a called ball or completing a legal safety on the third consecutive turn at the table, penalization is one point and an additional penalty of 15 points is assessed (a total of 18 points for three consecutive fouls equals -18 points). The commission of a third successive foul automatically clears the offender's record of fouls. The incoming player then has choice of (1) accepting the table in position, or (2) having all 15 balls reracked and requiring the offending player to shoot under the requirements of the opening break. Rules for the opening break apply. It should be emphasized that successive fouls must be committed in successive turns (or playing attempts), not merely in successive innings. For example, if a player ends inning six with a foul, steps to the table for inning seven and fouls (he is "on two fouls"), and then starts inning eight with a legally pocketed ball before scratching on his second shot attempt of the inning, he has not committed three successive fouls, even though there were fouls in three successive innings. As soon as he legally pocketed the ball to start inning eight, he cleared the two fouls. He is, of course, "on one foul" when he plays the first stroke attempt of inning nine.

If a player is on one foul, does a missed shot with cue ball or numbered ball hitting a rail after cue ball initially hits an object ball still count as a loss of a point and a second foul?

6.7 RULES OF PLAY
. . .
4. A player may call a safety rather than an object ball (for defensive purposes). Safety play is legal, but must comply with all applicable rules. The player's inning ends when a safety is played, and pocketed balls are not scored. Any object ball pocketed on a called safety is spotted.
. . .

This rule seems to imply a safety must be called, hence the question.

Thanks for any input.

 

[Tom In Cincy]

In 14.1 you can call a safety, but you still have to make a legal hit. Cue ball must contact a ball and either the cue ball or a numbered ball must hit a rail, or a ball is pocketed.

To get 'off a foul' all a player has to do is make a legal hit, which includes missing a 'called shot' or calling a 'safe' and meeting the requirements for a legal hit.

One of the strategies in 14.1 is to call a safe when you are out of position on the 15th ball to have a chance to break open the rack. You call the safe and pocket the 15th ball, and then it is spotted (at the apex of the rack) and incoming player has a shot at a full rack of 15 balls, but will normally play safe.

Trivia note, when a player is on 2 fouls, the 'frozen ball to the rail' rule is expanded to include a ball within a balls width of the rail to be considered FROZEN. The object ball does not have to be frozen to the rail in this special case. You still have to call 'Froze' before your opponent takes a shot.

 

[Bob Jewett]

... Trivia note, when a player is on 2 fouls, the 'frozen ball to the rail' rule is expanded to include a ball within a balls width of the rail to be considered FROZEN. The object ball does not have to be frozen to the rail in this special case. You still have to call 'Froze' before your opponent takes a shot.

I think the only time a non-frozen ball is considered frozen is when both players have played small safeties (two each?) on that ball and the only ball-to-rail contact has been by that object ball. I can't find the rule in the current rule set. ....(searching)... It has been removed from the rules on the BCA website, but is in the older set of WPA rules that I have. I don't know why the rule was removed. I assume it was by confusion or mistake.

 

[Bob Jewett]

... This rule seems to imply a safety must be called, hence the question. ...

You are not required to call safeties. If there is a possibility of confusion, you should call safe as a courtesy to the referee or your opponent. Also, if there is a chance a ball will go in, and you really don't want to have to shoot if the ball goes in, you better call a safe.

 

[Chris]

Thanks Bob, thanks Tom.

 

[shinobi]

It has been removed from the rules on the BCA website, but is in the older set of WPA rules that I have. I don't know why the rule was removed. I assume it was by confusion or mistake.

I thought it was removed in this past years rule updates (intentionally) for BCA?

 

[Tom In Cincy]

14.1 Frozen ball rule deleted as of Jan1st 2006

This rule was probably deleted by JOHN LEWIS because he didn't understand it.

Delete this section of 6.7.2:
When an object ball is not frozen to a cushion, but is within a ball's width of a cushion (referee to determine by measurement if necessary), a player is permitted only two consecutive legal safeties on that ball using only the near rail. If such safety play is employed, that object ball is then considered frozen to the rail on the player's next inning.

The General Rules of Pocket Billiards "Frozen Balls" requirements apply if the player chooses to make the first cue ball contact with that object ball on the third shot. (Note: If a player has committed a foul on the shot immediately before or the shot immediately after playing this ball, then he must immediately meet the requirements of the "Frozen Ball" rule when playing this object ball. Also, if he has committed two consecutive fouls, he must immediately meet the requirements of the Frozen Ball rule when playing this object ball. If such player fails to meet the requirements of the Frozen Ball rule, he is considered to have committed a third successive foul and the appropriate point penalty is assessed as well as one point for each of the previous fouls. All 15 balls are then reracked and the player committing the infraction is required to break, as at the beginning of the game.)

These rule changes are in effect January 1, 2006 and WPA rules will not be open to change until January 1, 2008.

 

[Bob Jewett]

I thought it was removed in this past years rule updates (intentionally) for BCA?

Someone may have done it intentionally, but if they did, their intention was broken. The rule is in there for a reason, and if it is removed, something else needs to be changed to compensate for it.

The rule (small or "nurse" safeties on a ball close to a cushion) can also come up in nine ball and eight ball and any game in which both players might be shooting at the same ball. If the rule is removed, you have to include a provision for stalemates.

 

[Chris]

Stalemates

Someone may have done it intentionally, but if they did, their intention was broken. The rule is in there for a reason, and if it is removed, something else needs to be changed to compensate for it.

The rule (small or "nurse" safeties on a ball close to a cushion) can also come up in nine ball and eight ball and any game in which both players might be shooting at the same ball. If the rule is removed, you have to include a provision for stalemates.

I'm not sure how old this rule is:

6.14 STALEMATE
If the referee decides that neither player is attempting to win from the current position, he will announce his decision, and each player will have three more turns at the table. Then, if the referee still feels that there is no progress towards a conclusion, he will declare a stalemate and the original breaker at the start of the game must execute a new break shot.

 

[shag_fu]

Is there a difference if a ball is frozen to the rail or the ball is just touching a rail?

 

[Bob Jewett]

Is there a difference if a ball is frozen to the rail or the ball is just touching a rail?

Those are synonyms. There is no "amount of touching" so the ball is either touching the rail or it isn't.