2 rail kick shot practice!

[bill190]

Ok I'm a glutton for punishment...

I've added 2 rail kick shot 9-ball (with ball-in-hand for each shot) to my practice routine. I practice this once a week. (I practice this only once a week because there is too much other stuff to practice on other days. Long shots, cut shots, etc.)

I added this because I'm so bad at two rail kick shots.

So I break, then and try and try and try to just hit the one ball. Each time I'm taking ball-in hand, shooting the cue ball so it hits two rails and then the one ball. Most times I miss the one ball entirely. But I'm getting to where I can hit the one ball after about 5 attempts from the same cue ball starting spot.

Anyway by the time I finally get the one ball into a pocket, all the other balls have already been pocketed by accident!

With everything else difficult I have practiced, the shots are extremely difficult and frustrating at first, but after a few months of practice, I start to make one or two shots every now and then. I don't know about this one though?

Any suggestions for getting better at two rail kick shots? (I've been practicing one rail kick shots for quite some time and can sometimes make the ball on the first try - other days it may take ten shots before I make the ball. Anyway I have improved quite a bit by just practicing one rail kick shots once a week. At first I seldom could even hit the ball. Now I almost always hit the ball.)

 

[Pelican]

Howdy Bill, I do a lot of kick drills but not with so many balls on the table if I am trying to pocket a ball. If it is a full rack i just want contact to prevent giving ball in hand. Otherwise I set up a ball in or near the jaws but never over one diamond out. Then I will set two other balls so I have to do a two railer.

Give it a try, Pel

 

[Zims Rack]

Find the center spot between your CB and your OB, place your cue tip on that center spot, use the tip (while placed on table) as a pivot and rotate your cue and body so that the cue tip is pointing towards any corner pocket. Visualize a parallel line from your CB to the rail near the same corner pocket, parallel to your cue pointing into the corner. Fire away with center ball, 2 speed (comfortable speed) This should get you to contact the OB. If another OB is in the path of the cue ball, then point to another corner pocket and repeat alignment.

Works 90% of time for me! I learned this recently and implement this into my practice routine.

Zim

 

[Snoozy]

Fire away with center ball, 2 speed (comfortable speed) This should get you to contact the OB.
Zim

How much english do you use? None? Running? One tip? . . . and do you vary the english as an adjustment?

Snoozy

 

[ceebee]

How much english do you use? None? Running? One tip? . . . and do you vary the english as an adjustment?

Snoozy

Using the parallel system to hit an object ball off the 2nd rail isn't that difficult to learn. One precise element is aiming the center line of the shot at precisely the corner (the imaginary intersection of the two rails). Once you have established the centerline (the first parallel), you move parallel (left or right) to the Cue Ball to establish the shot line (the second parallel). The angle of the shot line to the first rail will determine if rail induced english will modify the last leg of the shot. When you start approaching 30-40 degrees, the last leg will open up (depending on the distance to the object ball from the 2nd rail) anywhere from 2-15 degrees. That's the trick part of the 2 rail kick. When your experience allows you to estimate the widening of the third leg of the shot, that angle will represent the modification of the first parallel so that the CB will strike the OB.

I like the 2 plus system for kicking two rails too.

I like using the Diamond System to kick 3 rails or more

Good Luck

 

[highsea]

Find the center spot between your CB and your OB....

Thanks, Zim! Usually in that situation I always try to spin the CB off the rail and change the angle on a one rail kick, or resort to a masse shot. I've never really figured out how to aim the 2 rail kick shot. I can do one and three (using the 50 system), but two was always difficult for me.

Can't wait to try it out!

-CM

 

[crawdaddio]

Playing some three cushion billiards extensively will help your understanding of 2+ rail kicking ( and banking ) tracks immensely. Of course, practice, practice, and then practice some more. For the past few months, I quit carrying my jump cue period. This has forced me to concentrate on kicking, whether for the hole or safe. I recommend it, as it has helped my kicks ALOT.
Hope it helps,
DC

 

[Zims Rack]

Using the parallel system to hit an object ball off the 2nd rail isn't that difficult to learn. One precise element is aiming the center line of the shot at precisely the corner (the imaginary intersection of the two rails). Once you have established the centerline (the first parallel), you move parallel (left or right) to the Cue Ball to establish the shot line (the second parallel). The angle of the shot line to the first rail will determine if rail induced english will modify the last leg of the shot. When you start approaching 30-40 degrees, the last leg will open up (depending on the distance to the object ball from the 2nd rail) anywhere from 2-15 degrees. That's the trick part of the 2 rail kick. When your experience allows you to estimate the widening of the third leg of the shot, that angle will represent the modification of the first parallel so that the CB will strike the OB.

I like the 2 plus system for kicking two rails too.

I like using the Diamond System to kick 3 rails or more

Good Luck

TAP! TAP! TAP! Well said! (Thanks for explaining it a little better)!
Zim

 

[Zims Rack]

How much english do you use? None? Running? One tip? . . . and do you vary the english as an adjustment?

Snoozy

No english required! However, you could use english, depending on ball placement on the table! Just like CeeBee stated!

Good Luck!
Zim

 

[Rickw]

Great thread and great posts Zim and Ceebee and everyone else on this thread! Thanks for sharing! Threads and posts like these are what makes this board one of the best on the net!!

 

[bill190]

Find the center spot between your CB and your OB, place your cue tip on that center spot, use the tip (while placed on table) as a pivot and rotate your cue and body so that the cue tip is pointing towards any corner pocket. Visualize a parallel line from your CB to the rail near the same corner pocket, parallel to your cue pointing into the corner. Fire away with center ball, 2 speed (comfortable speed) This should get you to contact the OB. If another OB is in the path of the cue ball, then point to another corner pocket and repeat alignment.

Works 90% of time for me! I learned this recently and implement this into my practice routine.
Zim

JUMPIN' JEHOSAFATS!

The first time I tried this, I hit the ball.
The second time, I not only hit the ball, but pocketed it as well!

Then tried a few more times, and rarely missed the ball, say 1 in 4 or 1 in 5 was a miss.

Thanks. Now I have something to practice instead of just hitting blindly. (I have the best instructors you can get - You guys and gals!).

 

[piglit]

Ok I'm a glutton for punishment...So I break, then and try and try and try to just hit the one ball.

...by the time I finally get the one ball into a pocket, all the other balls have already been pocketed by accident!

That is HILARIOUS! Thanks for the early AM smile . Since you've put me in a happy, I'll share the following- laid on to me by a current top American pooler:

When kicking 2 rails (has to be one side and one end rail, not side to side, btw), visualize the path the ball will take from the OB. Keep that line in mind and shoot along a parallel line into the first rail. See:

http://endeavor.med.nyu.edu/~wei/pool/pooltable2.html

START(
%AO3^4%DO8\3%EO3]5%GO4_1%Lm3Z8%NJ4^9%P[9[0%WC6G1%X[2Z5%YM2C8
%Zk5[1%]r5W3%^k5[4
)END

Of course, NOT FOOL PROOF! You have to adjust for speed, spin, conditions, etc... But a good place to start!

-pigo

 

[Steve Ellis]

How much english do you use? None? Running? One tip? . . . and do you vary the english as an adjustment?

Snoozy

I was shown the same method described by Zim just 2 nights ago. This is what it would look like using the Wei table.

START(
%AQ0I0%BR4W1%CI0U8%DM6I4%EU0T2%FN0W9%GO7T6%HY2K5%II1L8%PG9P0
%QB0A9%RJ8K9%WD4D7%XW5X9%eB6a0
)END

As he said in a follow-up post no English or very slight inside and a firm hit. Stroke the cue ball pararell to the red line.
Works great.
Steve.

 

[Bob Jewett]

...
Any suggestions for getting better at two rail kick shots? (I've been practicing one rail kick shots for quite some time...

There is a system that is the two-cushion version of the mirror system for banking. I think one way to plan with that system has already been mentioned -- take a point half way between the cue ball and object ball and draw a line to the corner pocket at the two cushions involved, and then shoot parallel to that line. Another way is to create the actual mirror target for the object ball. If you do this, you can practice the shot without any calculations or parallels and for any cue ball position as long as the object ball remains in the same place (or you find the new mirror target. This system is shown with a diagram in the July 2004 Billiards Digest, but briefly:

Put a paper reinforcement under the object ball so you can repeat the shot. Place a ball in the jaws of the corner pocket of the shot (the pocket that is where the two cushions of the shot meet). On a bar stool place a third object ball that is in a straight line from the object ball to the pocket ball and as far from the pocket ball as the object ball is. Now, no matter where the cue ball is, the ball on the bar stool is the target for the two-cushion kick to the object ball.

You can easily compare this system to the "parallel to the line through the pocket" system, and it should give you the same aiming line. You can quickly determine what kind of english makes the system work well for various cue ball locations. You might find that the system does not work well for some object ball locations.

You may also want to look at the "plus two" system which comes from carom billiards and is intended for end-cushion/side-cushion shots. The regular "corner five" system is also useful for two-cushion shots when the object ball is near a side cushion. Both of these systems are explained in Byrne's Standard Book of Pool and Billiards.

 

[highsea]

No english required! However, you could use english, depending on ball placement on the table! Just like CeeBee stated!

Good Luck!
Zim

I tried this out Sat. nite. First try made the ball, second try rattled the pocket! Not bad. The third try I put a little spin on the CB and missed the OB. Lol. No english needed! My opponent was a little shocked, because I followed up with a game winning three-rail kick.

So I was hooked a total of 4 times and got out of it 3 times, making 2 OB's out of the 3 good hits. This is definitely going into my practice routine.

Thanks again, Zim.

-CM

 

[Zims Rack]

Glad to see that everyone understood what CeeBee and I were talking about and was able to apply it! Something simple can be so deadly!
Great job to those that tried it and for those that said "they don't know what they're talking about", give it a try, IT WORKS!

Thanks to all,
Zim

 

[BAZARUS]

Practicing kick shots is as important as anything else. Try the way I do it. You can still do it one day a week, but be prepare, that it will take you several hours to finish this drill. Break a rack of nine ball and start with one rail kick shot. Make all the balls this way. If you pocket other balls by accident spot them up. When you finish this one, break another rack and pocket all the balls using 2 rail kick shot. After that you may break another rack and pocket all the balls using 3 rail kick shots. This drill takes a lots of time, but it will improve your kicking quickly.