9 & 10-ball strategy.

[Big C]

Scenario #1: You are breaking and you make a ball but don't have a clear shot. The table is favorable to run, if only you had a clear shot after the break. Let's say you do push out and leave a tough shot, or a risky safety option for your opponent. He/she doesn't like it and gives the shot back to you? I don't mind taking a foul if I know my opponent would have a hard time playing a safe on the first shot. I have experimented with this during matches and I would like to know what your experiences are.

 

[Black-Balled]

Take a break for 2 weeks and

FIRST

Scenario #1: You are breaking and you make a ball but don't have a clear shot. The table is favorable to run, if only you had a clear shot after the break. Do you push out, or do you take an intentional foul and try to tie up a key ball? Let's say you do push out and leave a tough shot, or a risky safety option for your opponent. He/she doesn't like it and gives the shot back to you? I don't mind taking a foul if I know my opponent would have a hard time playing a safe on the first shot. I have experimented with this during matches and I would like to know what your experiences are.

 

[Jude Rosenstock]

Scenario #1: You are breaking and you make a ball but don't have a clear shot. The table is favorable to run, if only you had a clear shot after the break. Do you push out, or do you take an intentional foul and try to tie up a key ball? Let's say you do push out and leave a tough shot, or a risky safety option for your opponent. He/she doesn't like it and gives the shot back to you? I don't mind taking a foul if I know my opponent would have a hard time playing a safe on the first shot. I have experimented with this during matches and I would like to know what your experiences are.

You should NEVER deliberately foul after the break. That's what the push option is for. You can still tie-up balls on a push.

 

[junior718]

Scenario #1: You are breaking and you make a ball but don't have a clear shot. The table is favorable to run, if only you had a clear shot after the break. Do you push out, or do you take an intentional foul and try to tie up a key ball? Let's say you do push out and leave a tough shot, or a risky safety option for your opponent. He/she doesn't like it and gives the shot back to you? I don't mind taking a foul if I know my opponent would have a hard time playing a safe on the first shot. I have experimented with this during matches and I would like to know what your experiences are.

wanna play some?

 

[Aaron_S]

Scenario #1: You are breaking and you make a ball but don't have a clear shot. The table is favorable to run, if only you had a clear shot after the break. Do you push out, or do you take an intentional foul and try to tie up a key ball? Let's say you do push out and leave a tough shot, or a risky safety option for your opponent. He/she doesn't like it and gives the shot back to you? I don't mind taking a foul if I know my opponent would have a hard time playing a safe on the first shot. I have experimented with this during matches and I would like to know what your experiences are.

If you have a push option, you wouldn't need to take an intentional foul to tie up balls. The only way I would tie up balls, though, is if the on-ball was very close to the pocket, thus eliminating the possibility of rolling out to a tough shot. If the on-ball was not very near a pocket, then I would probably just roll out to a situation that lends itself to one of my specific strengths, like perhaps a jump shot or a kick-safe that I am comfortable with. Obviously, this is a case where you have to consider the strengths and weaknesses of your opponent as well in order to avoid playing into one of his/her specific strengths.

Aaron

 

[Big C]

You should NEVER deliberately foul after the break. That's what the push option is for. You can still tie-up balls on a push.

I guess I didn't quite word it right in my first post, so I'll have to go edit it. Of course you wouldn't take a foul on the first shot when you have the option to push. But after you do push and have to shoot again, you don't have a good offensive or defensive shot. Wouldn't it be better to take a foul then and tie something up?

 

[Jude Rosenstock]

I guess I didn't quite word it right in my first post, so I'll have to go edit it. Of course you wouldn't take a foul on the first shot when you have the option to push. But after you do push and have to shoot again, you don't have a good offensive or defensive shot. Wouldn't it be better to take a foul then and tie something up?

No. The bottom line is, you should never be fouling after you push. Giving up BIH in 9ball is suicide on almost every level. Deliberately fouling to tie up balls should be a last resort in a difficult situation. A push should not create this situation for you.

 

[GMAC]

do yourself a favor

I guess I didn't quite word it right in my first post, so I'll have to go edit it. Of course you wouldn't take a foul on the first shot when you have the option to push. But after you do push and have to shoot again, you don't have a good offensive or defensive shot. Wouldn't it be better to take a foul then and tie something up?

Never push to a spot without a purpose. You should have a game plan if the incoming player elects to let you shoot. However if you dog the push and say hook yourself, yes in some instances your best option may be to lock something up and take a foul.

 

[Dead Money]

Can you pocket a ball on the push out? Say a nine ball that is hanging in the pocket after a break when you can't see the one ball?

 

[Jude Rosenstock]

Can you pocket a ball on the push out? Say a nine ball that is hanging in the pocket after a break when you can't see the one ball?

Absolutely and yes, you push that 9-ball right in.

 

[Jude Rosenstock]

The bottom line is, pushing is a bit of an art. When both players are about the same level, you want to create a coin-flip situation. Sometimes it's best to create a cluster so that you're guaranteed another trip to the table but you have to weigh this out accordingly.

When there is a difference in ability, pushing can be a bit tricky. When you're the better player, you want to leave a shot you can handle but your opponent can't. When you're the weaker player, you'll want to create a scenario where you'll likely get back to the table. That's it.

There's no winning strategy to pushing unless you're just better than your opponent. If you try to make a winning strategical move with your push, you're going to find yourself racking more often than not.

 

[Big C]

CueTable Help

So this is your incoming shot after the break.

CueTable Help

You push out and your opponent gives the shot back.

CueTable Help

In a situation like this, you may want to foul to get the 9 on the spot and keep your opponent from making the combo. The run out with BIH is not easy given the distance between the 1 & 2. How would you play this differently?

 

[Jude Rosenstock]

CueTable Help

So this is your incoming shot after the break.

CueTable Help

You push out and your opponent gives the shot back.

CueTable Help

In a situation like this, you may want to foul to get the 9 on the spot and keep your opponent from making the combo. The run out with BIH is not easy given the distance between the 1 & 2. How would you play this differently?

This is a desperation scenario. They do come up but thankfully, not terribly often.

In this scenario against a good player, I'm probably not pushing. I'm going to kick, hope I contact the 1-ball first and make the 9. There's just so many things that can happen, it's probably best to just take a stab at winning or at least rearranging everything.

 

[Dead Money]

Thanks Jude, that is most helpful

 

[Cuebacca]

IMO, if you don't like kicking at the 1-9, you may want to push to make the 6-9 combo. At least then the 9-ball is spotted up.

 

[Jude Rosenstock]

IMO, if you don't like kicking at the 1-9, you may want to push to make the 6-9 combo. At least then the 9-ball is spotted up.

I think it has less to do with you and more to do with your opponent. If I'm playing Archer, I'm kicking to win. If I'm playing my mom and I can't pocket the 9 on the push, I'll push to a place where I'll pocket it on the foul. Nothing tricky. I'd just nudge it a little.

This all goes back to what I was saying before - you want to push so you get back to the table. If you feel getting back to the table after your push is unlikely, don't push.

 

[Big C]

IMO, if you don't like kicking at the 1-9, you may want to push to make the 6-9 combo. At least then the 9-ball is spotted up.

That's also another option I would try before taking a flier at the 1-9 combo. With all the balls left on the table, you are giving yourself a coin-flips chance at getting back to the table.

 

[Aaron_S]

CueTable Help

So this is your incoming shot after the break.

CueTable Help

You push out and your opponent gives the shot back.

CueTable Help

In a situation like this, you may want to foul to get the 9 on the spot and keep your opponent from making the combo. The run out with BIH is not easy given the distance between the 1 & 2. How would you play this differently?

From either of those cueball positions, I'm kicking to make the 9 off of the 1, which is only fractionally more difficult than kicking the 9 straight in. I would go ahead and fire at it right after the break rather than rolling out, though, because the initial placement of the cueball offers a great angle (by hitting just above the side pocket with a bit of running english) to kick at the 1 and have a great chance of making the 9 legally - you can hit short and kick the 1 into the 9, you can hit dead into the 1 and make the combo, or you can hit it long and have a chance at the carom; the one-ball is so big from there that you're probably even money or better to win the game from there if you can kick fairly well.

Cueball position A, on the other hand does not offer any easier kicks, and I actually think the best shot from there would be a two-rail (head-rail, long-rail) kick into the 1-ball, which would give you that same nice approach angle that makes the 1-ball so big and gives the best chance of pocketing the 9. It's a tougher kick for me, though, so I personally wouldn't see advantage to rolling out to that spot.

Aaron