A long comment on "aiming systems" ...

Like I said earlier, I happen to find aiming systems useful as a teaching tool, an approximation, but on an already high level of play, the almost negligible mishits on the cue ball that usually result in near-misses are almost never due to an inability to find the correct shot-line.

More importantly, however, after 25 years of teaching (= watching!), I would state it as fact (call it an educated guess if you prefer) that anyone who is able to stand behind the shot-line in a comfortably erect position, shoulders up and head straight like a ballet dancer, step into it (if possible with a perfect lunge or side-step, again, like a dancer) with what Jerry Briesath calls "chin lock" (= chin locked to shot-line), stands a way greater chance of being or becoming a consistent player than anyone who performs a lateral movement in particular moving their head, spine, shoulders, pelvis, legs.

It's really simple: what the advocates of pivoting ask for is to "replace" (which, due to the need for compensation of CIT etc. isn't ultimately even true) something comparatively intuitive to learn (get a feel for one's aim) with something so complex and difficult to master as a pivot resulting in a torsion-free stance (= note the paradox: it's akin to performing a false start on purpose, as well as "discipline" one's body to do do what one's mind says it should).

Needless to emphasize, torsion leads to rotation. Although it's always possible to "keep still" in any position, however comfortable, watch natural players like Mosconi who've learnt to see the shot-line from above (or indeed, anywhere). The fact that they're physically relaxed plus don't fuss with doing anything "extra" (= interfering with their subconscious) contributes a great deal towards running hundreds.

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________

„J'ai gâché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ – Roger Conti
 
Last edited:
And the reason that the other person claimed STAN not "Dan" was doing it is 100% wrong.

Going down on the shot is placing the bridge hand and settling into shooting position. You ARE NOT in shooting position UNTIL you are addressing the cue ball.

Unbelievable.

Dave posted several videos where Jimmy Moore pivots his cue into shooting position. Are you going to be like Lou and tell dead champions that they are wrong as well?

Like I said, "...some may think going "down" on the shot is something other than moving from the stance to actually placing the bridge hand on the table...but "going down on the shot" means exactly that!"
You are already "down" when you "settle into shooting position" (your words, not mine). John you can make up your own definitions, but for everyone else going down is going down!
 
Well John, I have come to the conclusion that you, (a) enjoy controversy (b) will not tolerate being told you are wrong. (even if you are wrong) (c) You have a very high threshhold, for pain. (d) Would rather fight, than switch. (e) You will never be truely happy, until you can beat Efren or SVB (which ain't ever gonna happen)...and finally, (f) You may be the only intelligent person on the planet, who has chosen to air his views, and to argue his various points, endlessly...on any given subject...on a stinking pool forum,...where NOBODY else cares whose right or wrong..(and besides, most of them don't even know what color the three ball is)

You may have noticed, (or not) that you are a 'moving target', and quite frankly, you do not move too fast..(think snail)...Only JoeyA may be a little slower than you..:embarrassed2:

I offer this, as a bit of friendly advice..Take care of your successful business, go home to your lovely wife, and child, and stop trying to change the pool world to your way of thinking...You are wasting a valuable time, in your life, which could be much better spent smelling the flowers...Because, in case you haven't figured it out yet..nobodt gives a shit about what you think...and its doubtful, they ever will...:cool:

PS..That could be why you enjoy jumping into these conflicts...Does that make you "smarter" than your dozens of detractors ?

Actually people do give a shit about what I think. As hard as it is to believe I get asked for my opinion and for help on may subjects I talk about.

Also you can tell me I am wrong to which I say prove it and when you do I say that I was wrong. Has happened many times on these forums.

I guess I do enjoy the fight especially when I am right. I do agree that in the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter and it's a waste of time. But the difference is that I do go to the table with this stuff. I don't argue it from a philosophical standpoint only but also from a point of practical experience. I gamble and I use these techniques when I play so in my eyes that gives me the right to defend them if I want to.

Regarding Efren I'd be happy just to spend a week with him. That is something I am going to make happen in the next five years if he is still able and willing to do it.

Alright screw it, peace out.

Naysayers, the floor is yours. Unsubscribing.
 
Maybe. If it works. Guaranteed some of us would buy it and try it before we criticize it. We certainly aren't going to dismiss this man out of hand. He might very well have discovered something worthwhile that helps people play better.

If it holds up then we will say so. If not then we can say WHY NOT because we tried it fairly and honestly with no bias.

Some people will remember IMMSHARMA or something like that. He/she was a person who came on RSB claiming to invented the mother of all aiming systems and it would be on sale soon........and then he disappeared. So either the Aiming System Mafia put him with Jimmy Hoffa or he figured out that whatever he had wasn't marketable.

(there is an Aiming System Mafia by the way and we are really happy with all the free publicity you all are providing, on our own the threads about aiming would die quickly but with the naysayer tribe they live forever, it's appreciated)

I cannot claim it is my system, i have read it 20 years ago somewhere, could not find it anywhere on the WWW. If anyone have it, please forward, or PM with it. I have tried it myself, it certainly works, once you get the table cloth figured out; for sure you have to have perfect smooth stroke, follow through, and very light grip to let that english take.
 
I cannot claim it is my system, i have read it 20 years ago somewhere, could not find it anywhere on the WWW. If anyone have it, please forward, or PM with it. I have tried it myself, it certainly works, once you get the table cloth figured out; for sure you have to have perfect smooth stroke, follow through, and very light grip to let that english take.

There's nothing new in that system, and, besides, the difficulties outweigh the advantages. I've just gone from playing with a slow cloth and old balls to a brand new 860 with unbelievably shiny balls, and the difference is vast - it is not possible to play your swerve/throw technique, as the balls skid too much to take. They neither swerve or throw enough. Of course you'll adjust over time, but it's really just adding another layer of uncertainty, and who wants to do that?

It does make you feel very cool playing with it, however. I think it does illustrate there are a hundred ways of putting balls in holes, and you're best off figuring it out for yourself.
 
Actually people do give a shit about what I think. As hard as it is to believe I get asked for my opinion and for help on may subjects I talk about.

Also you can tell me I am wrong to which I say prove it and when you do I say that I was wrong. Has happened many times on these forums.

I guess I do enjoy the fight especially when I am right. I do agree that in the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter and it's a waste of time. But the difference is that I do go to the table with this stuff. I don't argue it from a philosophical standpoint only but also from a point of practical experience. I gamble and I use these techniques when I play so in my eyes that gives me the right to defend them if I want to.

Regarding Efren I'd be happy just to spend a week with him. That is something I am going to make happen in the next five years if he is still able and willing to do it.

Alright screw it, peace out.

Naysayers, the floor is yours. Unsubscribing.

I just felt a breath of fresh air in this thread!
 
There's nothing new in that system, and, besides, the difficulties outweigh the advantages. I've just gone from playing with a slow cloth and old balls to a brand new 860 with unbelievably shiny balls, and the difference is vast - it is not possible to play your swerve/throw technique, as the balls skid too much to take. They neither swerve or throw enough. Of course you'll adjust over time, but it's really just adding another layer of uncertainty, and who wants to do that?

It does make you feel very cool playing with it, however. I think it does illustrate there are a hundred ways of putting balls in holes, and you're best off figuring it out for yourself.

Thanks Thaiger, i for sure not claiming it is great system, but one thing for sure, it takes one variable out of the picture, and adds couple more. Which variable easier to deal with it is all to the shooter's ability. Again, pool is learned through practice, having to aim straight all the time, might be beneficial when we are tired and cannot focus anymore, just a thought. Plus we all missed shots because CB swerve, or skids, why not intentionally do that so we control how much swerve, or skid.

Again, for hard more than 2/3 ball cut i would consider this aim over ghost ball. So maybe a combination of few aim systems
 
Let's see, Stan's DVD was made because of the discussions on here. To once and for all get the right info out there. Right from the start he figured it would be a money losing deal, but wanted the right info taught. He doesn't get on here constantly and try and sell it. There isn't a single person that advocates Stan's DVD on here other than Stan that is getting paid for saying anything about it. We say good things about it because we are satisfied customers and are willing to share good info when we get it. As you said, it's called "helping others". What you also want to call "amateur marketing". Why not "get down" on all the other advertising done on here without a banner add? Like everytime someone mentions a brand name cue, or tip, or cloth? 99% of the items mentioned on here don't have banner adds. Why so much displeasure from you with one in particular?

As far as the trolls, I couldn't disagree more. If no one does anything about them, then pretty soon, which this place is fast approaching, you have nothing left but the trolls. This used to be a great place to go to for info on pool. Nowdays, you mention AZB in the pool rooms and you get laughed at. It's great for selling a cue, otherwise, not much here anymore. If the people don't control the trolls, you lose valued membership, and thus viewers. Most of the good posters have already been run off, and more are leaving. Have fun with what's left.

Be a man , name names and be sure to include yours.
 
Actually people do give a shit about what I think. As hard as it is to believe I get asked for my opinion and for help on may subjects I talk about.

Also you can tell me I am wrong to which I say prove it and when you do I say that I was wrong. Has happened many times on these forums.

I guess I do enjoy the fight especially when I am right. I do agree that in the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter and it's a waste of time. But the difference is that I do go to the table with this stuff. I don't argue it from a philosophical standpoint only but also from a point of practical experience. I gamble and I use these techniques when I play so in my eyes that gives me the right to defend them if I want to.

Regarding Efren I'd be happy just to spend a week with him. That is something I am going to make happen in the next five years if he is still able and willing to do it.

Alright screw it, peace out.

Naysayers, the floor is yours. Unsubscribing.

I watched Efren at the Swanee and he swipes to get his english on the CB after he is down on the shot stroking center CB ball. He sets up often at the bottom of the CB to start to get proper alignment then lift the tip of the cue to get drew and then swipes down on impact. He drops his elbow on some shots. He holds his cue lightly betweeen his thumb an index finger and drops all ov his fingers a bit leaving his thumb steady to drop the butt of the cue while staying on line - to prevent the tip of his cue from dipping down to the cloth.

He lost to Manny Cho (sp) on the winner's side and is moving up on the loser's side.
 
I own the cte pro1 dvd by stan shuffet. If you watch it, it talks all about the lateral movement and the pivoting in the first part of dvd.

It is not as clear as you think.


This was one of the major issues I had with the system. All that pivoting is throwing your stroke offline -- a recipe for failure.

Lou Figueroa
 
The Buffet of Learning.

Imagine you go to a party and there is a grand buffet. So many interesting food choices that you have never seen much less tried...


A buffet is a great way to get sick. Watch out for the smoked CTE :-)

Lou Figueroa
 
P.S. I am not worried at all. Like I said last year.

We Won.

Top instructors teach these systems. Pros use them. People are discussing and learning them. Instructional materials are being created which cover them.

We Won.


lol, am I the only one getting the Charlie Sheen visual right about now?

Lou Figueroa
 
I love being a naysayer,its in my soul. I enjoy taking peoples high and mighty ideas/ways, and explaining to them the real truth about each and then watch them try it still defend it when they know there is no way.

It seems to acknowledge that a idea is flawed is a weakness when in fact it is a strength. One that leads to growth not stagnation.

I bet no one even even tried that 3 rail bank. Why, no balls. Not surprised caused this is the kind of shot that shows the limitations of everything but the ghost ball.

Use what ever system you want, get down , line up, then have someone put a ball in between the CB and the OB you want to hit. Now what? Basically rail first shot, kick.

Can't use back of the ball, fractional, don't think so, CTE, nope but ghost ball still works. Especially with the way I describe how to use it.

Even the BAT can't help you. But the arrow can.

All cue placement methods are based on ghost ball, there is no way around this. If you can imigine lines and spots on the balls that aren't there then you can "see" a spot on the table 1/2 CB from the the OB to roll the CB over.

So simple and I think this is the problem. That something so simple can be the best thing to use.

I bet no one has ever tried the arrow.

Too bad 9 ball seems to be the standard now for pool performance. Running 45 balls in 14.1 is way harder then 5 racks of 9 ball.

But hey, 9 ball is king.
 
A buffet is a great way to get sick. Watch out for the smoked CTE :-)

Lou Figueroa

I think John was getting a little hungry by that stage. He looks like a man of prodigious appetites, for many things. Frankly, we can say what we like about him now he's unsubscribed.

Anyone else think he looks like John Belushi?
 
Let's see, Stan's DVD was made because of the discussions on here. To once and for all get the right info out there. Right from the start he figured it would be a money losing deal, but wanted the right info taught. He doesn't get on here constantly and try and sell it. There isn't a single person that advocates Stan's DVD on here other than Stan that is getting paid for saying anything about it. We say good things about it because we are satisfied customers and are willing to share good info when we get it. As you said, it's called "helping others". What you also want to call "amateur marketing". Why not "get down" on all the other advertising done on here without a banner add? Like everytime someone mentions a brand name cue, or tip, or cloth? 99% of the items mentioned on here don't have banner adds. Why so much displeasure from you with one in particular?

As far as the trolls, I couldn't disagree more. If no one does anything about them, then pretty soon, which this place is fast approaching, you have nothing left but the trolls. This used to be a great place to go to for info on pool. Nowdays, you mention AZB in the pool rooms and you get laughed at. It's great for selling a cue, otherwise, not much here anymore. If the people don't control the trolls, you lose valued membership, and thus viewers. Most of the good posters have already been run off, and more are leaving. Have fun with what's left.


I doubt Stan lost money selling a 1,000 copies (as claimed), at $39 a copy.

As to the group -- forums are always changing, evolving and transient when it comes to membership. (The only thing that stays constant are the same topics that come up over and over for another run through the mill.) And the computer savvy have always been in the minority in pool halls. So, who are the good posters that have been run off or are leaving? If you're going to make the claim that "most of the good posters have already been run off, and more are leaving" how about some names?

Lou Figueroa
Neil must be
talking about PJ :-)
 
I doubt Stan lost money selling a 1,000 copies (as claimed), at $39 a copy.

As to the group -- forums are always changing, evolving and transient when it comes to membership. (The only thing that stays constant are the same topics that come up over and over for another run through the mill.) And the computer savvy have always been in the minority in pool halls. So, who are the good posters that have been run off or are leaving? If you're going to make the claim that "most of the good posters have already been run off, and more are leaving" how about some names?

Lou Figueroa
Neil must be
talking about PJ :-)

I think Neil has issues with people having opinions other than his own.
 
Back
Top