Advice for unexperienced players

H

Hernan7

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Hi everybody, I'm 21 yrs old and started playing 3-Cushion 2 months ago (never liked pool that much) and I love it, I'm not that good yet but I really love the game. Since I only have 2 months of experience I would like to hear some advice from the more experienced players.
 
Hernan7 said:
Hi everybody, I'm 21 yrs old and started playing 3-Cushion 2 months ago (never liked pool that much) and I love it, I'm not that good yet but I really love the game. Since I only have 2 months of experience I would like to hear some advice from the more experienced players.
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One basic exercise is just using 2 balls on the table. Try to do 3 or more rail kicks on any table layout. See how many times you can do in a roll.

Here is something for you as a reference
http://pl.cuetable.com/showthread.php?t=125
 
Hernan7 said:
Hi everybody, I'm 21 yrs old and started playing 3-Cushion 2 months ago (never liked pool that much) and I love it, I'm not that good yet but I really love the game. Since I only have 2 months of experience I would like to hear some advice from the more experienced players.
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Learn to make simple caroms. Caroms is the name of the game.
Learn some basic systems
5 Sytem
Plus 2
Clock
Learn Short angle shots and
Rail First Tickies.

The best way to learn these at the table is to set them up and shoot them over and over, rather than getting on a table and start hitting the balls around.

I also practice 1 rail. My rule is: All shots must have exactly one rail, no more or less. The idea is, if I can hit the second ball after 1 rail then I can hit the second rail in 3C. If the second rail is hit in the right spot in 4C the shot is over and made. Miss the 2nd rail you miss the shot. 1 rail teaches you to aim to the second rail. Some advise this and some don't. It helps me when out of stroke and and or low concentration.
 
Thanks a lot guys !!!

I'm sure your suggestions will help, those diagrams will help a lot and the 1 rail exercise will help too. Unfortunately, I wont be able to practice those shots until friday because I just got back to school and I wont have that much time to play. Again thanks a lot guys and I will keep you informed of my progress. :D
 
Hernan7 said:
I'm sure your suggestions will help, those diagrams will help a lot and the 1 rail exercise will help too. Unfortunately, I wont be able to practice those shots until friday because I just got back to school and I wont have that much time to play. Again thanks a lot guys and I will keep you informed of my progress. :D
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The diagrams are just starting points. It will vary as the english and speed change. You will have to learn this on careful observation.

Please feel free to download some templates and print them out http://cuetable.com/extras.html. Bring them with you to practice. Record any question you have and output them to http://CueTable.com/C/ . There are plenty of kind 3C players will help.
 
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Hernan7 said:
Hi everybody, I'm 21 yrs old and started playing 3-Cushion 2 months ago (never liked pool that much) and I love it, I'm not that good yet but I really love the game. Since I only have 2 months of experience I would like to hear some advice from the more experienced players.
Click to expand...

It's quite hard to stress this enough but try to start small first... then progress further. By progression I mean start off with Straight-Rail Billiards first. Then when you have averaged around > 25pts, then create the discipline even harder and play any metric/inch balkline. When this game is in dull, then cushion caroms (or One Cushion Billiards) would do the trick. When the full understanding is complete, collect some diamond systems, plus-2 systems or what-have-you, and start enjoying some three-cushion billiards.
 
SlickRick_PCS said:
It's quite hard to stress this enough but try to start small first... then progress further. By progression I mean start off with Straight-Rail Billiards first. Then when you have averaged around > 25pts, then create the discipline even harder and play any metric/inch balkline. When this game is in dull, then cushion caroms (or One Cushion Billiards) would do the trick. When the full understanding is complete, collect some diamond systems, plus-2 systems or what-have-you, and start enjoying some three-cushion billiards.
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot slickrick, I think you are right. As 3kushn and you said, I have to start small. The owner of the place where I go practice told me that I should play like this, do 9 straight rail caroms and the 10th a 3 cushion carom. And if I can't think of a way of doing it (the 3 cushion) he will help me out. What do you guys think about it?
 
Hernan7 said:
Thanks a lot slickrick, I think you are right. As 3kushn and you said, I have to start small. The owner of the place where I go practice told me that I should play like this, do 9 straight rail caroms and the 10th a 3 cushion carom. And if I can't think of a way of doing it (the 3 cushion) he will help me out. What do you guys think about it?
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I've played this game before. I don't recommend it.

I would strictly stick with straight rail till your average (that is balls made divided by the innings in total) is above around 25 or so. The reason is because when playing straight rail, your focus is on trying to maintain both object balls in control within speed and English.

Balkline is the more restricted verson of the latter and only to make certain amount of point(s) on certain "zones" and anchors for practicing future games such as 1 & 3 cushion billiards.

BTW: The game you described is either called sencillas, o rosarillo (don't quite know the proper Spanish term)
 
The old school and probably the right way is to learn carom first. There have been exceptions as in any other sport
but if you're really interested in learning this game learn how to make caroms first. That's the key to all the games.
You have to make caroms to a rail or a ball no matter what. Find an instructor either BCA or a credentialed billiard
player to check your fundamentals. The BCA guy can teach stance bridge stroke... the billiards guy will teach caroms
and systems if not what the BCA guy will teach. Most books don't tell the whole story on system play. They usually
leave out the adjustments as Cuetable indicated. The game your buddy suggested kinda mixes it up and allows you to
cut loose once in a while and may or may not fit your personality but sticking with caroms will also help with discipline.
Caroms are in many cases tougher to play than 3C. Welker Cochran believed caroms to be the hardest game of all.
Running 100's or 1000's of caroms requires so much concentration for such long periods of time is why he thought it so
tough. In some rooms in Europe you're not allowed to play 3C until you've mastered caroms. Ceulemans was a staunch
supporter of learning the "Small Games" (caroms) first but in later life, in light of some of the exceptions he's seen, has
backed off a bit, at least publicly. Probably not privately. Throughout the history of the game the Worlds greatest ever,
players, started off learning caroms FIRST. Americans usually don't have the dicipline to take the long, sure route. We
need instant gratification and it's hurt the USA in World competition for the last 60 years.
 
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I realle appreciate your help

3kushn said:
The old school and probably the right way is to learn carom first. There have been exceptions as in any other sport
but if you're really interested in learning this game learn how to make caroms first. That's the key to all the games.
You have to make caroms to a rail or a ball no matter what. Find an instructor either BCA or a credentialed billiard
player to check your fundamentals. The BCA guy can teach stance bridge stroke... the billiards guy will teach caroms
and systems if not what the BCA guy will teach. Most books don't tell the whole story on system play. They usually
leave out the adjustments as Cuetable indicated. The game your buddy suggested kinda mixes it up and allows you to
cut loose once in a while and may or may not fit your personality but sticking with caroms will also help with discipline.
Caroms are in many cases tougher to play than 3C. Welker Cochran believed caroms to be the hardest game of all.
Running 100's or 1000's of caroms requires so much concentration for such long periods of time is why he thought it so
tough. In some rooms in Europe you're not allowed to play 3C until you've mastered caroms. Ceulemans was a staunch
supporter of learning the "Small Games" (caroms) first but in later life, in light of some of the exceptions he's seen, has
backed off a bit, at least publicly. Probably not privately. Throughout the history of the game the Worlds greatest ever,
players, started off learning caroms FIRST. Americans usually don't have the dicipline to take the long, sure route. We
need instant gratification and it's hurt the USA in World competition for the last 60 years.
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot guys, your comments have helped me a lot. Since this friday I'm going to focus strictly on simple caroms. That will be until I can average 25 points, I dont know how long it's going to take but I'm sure it will be worth it. I will keep you guys informed of my progress.
 
Hernan7, here a link with some information, but in Spanish or Argentina

http://www.billarjuvenil.com.ar/index_.html

http://www.billarjuvenil.com.ar/billar/tecnicas_sistemas/busquet/teorico_practicas.pdf

Just click Bajar to download these:
http://www.billarjuvenil.com.ar/billar/tecnicas_sistemas/ricardo_duarte/ricardo_duarte.html

http://www.billarjuvenil.com.ar/billar/tecnicas_sistemas/jean_sancho/jean_sancho.html

Another section with all system info:

http://www.billarjuvenil.com.ar/billar/tecnicas_sistemas/tecnicas_sistemas.html

There close to two hundreds pages, if you print these technicas/systems

FFB site have a complete course on carom, that you can view or download, except its in French. Search my posts for information on other sites you can view.
Bob Watson
 
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billiardshot said:
Hernan7, here a link with some information, but in Spanish or Argentina

http://www.billarjuvenil.com.ar/index_.html

http://www.billarjuvenil.com.ar/billar/tecnicas_sistemas/busquet/teorico_practicas.pdf

Just click Bajar to download these:
http://www.billarjuvenil.com.ar/billar/tecnicas_sistemas/ricardo_duarte/ricardo_duarte.html

http://www.billarjuvenil.com.ar/billar/tecnicas_sistemas/jean_sancho/jean_sancho.html

Another section with all system info:

http://www.billarjuvenil.com.ar/billar/tecnicas_sistemas/tecnicas_sistemas.html

There close to two hundreds pages, if you print these technicas/systems

FFB site have a complete course on carom, that you can view or download, except its in French. Search my posts for information on other sites you can view.
Bob Watson
Click to expand...

http://translate.google.com/transla...prev=/search?q=billiard+tbc+tv&hl=en&lr=&sa=G

While looking at the link that billiardshot posted up, you would want to look at this link that is posted here so that you might have an idea of how straight-rail is played in the far-east. Just click on the "four-nine" link and just pick whichever link is on the next browser. I hope this link will definately give you some ideas. :cool:
 
Thanks a lot guys !!!

You guys are really helping me. And the languages are not a problem because I'm trilingual, I speak spanish (my first language), english (2nd language) and french (my 3rd language). I will have a great time taking a look at those systems. And again thanks a lot guys, I really appreciate your help. I'm going to persuade my cousins and nephews to start playing this wonderful game so it stays alive :D .
 
 
SlickRick_PCS said:
...
I would strictly stick with straight rail till your average (that is balls made divided by the innings in total) is above around 25 or so. The reason is because when playing straight rail, your focus is on trying to maintain both object balls in control within speed and English. ...
Click to expand...
I think that average is too high a goal. An average that high is probably due to mastery of the rail nurse rather than control of gather shots. If he can average 5 at straight rail it is time to try some 3 cushion as well. I'd be willing to bet that if we got 10 US 3-C players who averaged about 0.700, only one or two of them would be able to average 25 at straight rail, or even 10.
 
?

I have a question. I've heard the "start with billiards" theory before, but I've never heard a good explanation of what exactly, specifically it's supposed to do for your 3C game. Generally a vague answer about 'learning control' or 'fundamentals'. One or two cushion I can see, just a scaled down version of the big game, but straight rail?
To me it seems like saying, "If you want to be a great one-pocket player, play nothing but straight pool for three years." The games are so different. The ideal position in straight rail is all three balls in a tight group, which is hardly a good 3C position. Ideally, in straight, you would just keep hitting the cueball a few inches into the two balls and not move them much. You only drive to a rail if you have to gather or regain control of the balls, but 3C is nothing but playing cushions. If you're playing straight right, most of the time you're moving the cueball no more than a few inches, whereas in 3C most of the time you're sending it 20+ feet around the table. To be a really good straight player, you need to master the nurses, which are absolutely useless in 3C.
In Europe they use different cues for straight rail, and I believe they use a less smooth cloth for it as well, because the two games are essentially different. The whole 'feel' of hitting a ball a inch and drawing it at the same time is so different than calculating and shooting a 6 rail around the table shot.
In Europe most billiards players start playing billiards, so maybe they learn straight because it's relatively easier to start with? Whereas in the US, I think most players come to the game via pool, so by that time they already know the fundamentals of draw, english, etc.
Maybe I'm missing something? Anybody know specifically what straight rail is supposed to impart to your 3C game? Blomdahl skipped the small games and it didn't hurt him any.
 
eze123 said:
I have a question. I've heard the "start with billiards" theory before, but I've never heard a good explanation of what exactly, specifically it's supposed to do for your 3C game. Generally a vague answer about 'learning control' or 'fundamentals'. One or two cushion I can see, just a scaled down version of the big game, but straight rail?
To me it seems like saying, "If you want to be a great one-pocket player, play nothing but straight pool for three years." The games are so different. The ideal position in straight rail is all three balls in a tight group, which is hardly a good 3C position. Ideally, in straight, you would just keep hitting the cueball a few inches into the two balls and not move them much. You only drive to a rail if you have to gather or regain control of the balls, but 3C is nothing but playing cushions. If you're playing straight right, most of the time you're moving the cueball no more than a few inches, whereas in 3C most of the time you're sending it 20+ feet around the table. To be a really good straight player, you need to master the nurses, which are absolutely useless in 3C.
In Europe they use different cues for straight rail, and I believe they use a less smooth cloth for it as well, because the two games are essentially different. The whole 'feel' of hitting a ball a inch and drawing it at the same time is so different than calculating and shooting a 6 rail around the table shot.
In Europe most billiards players start playing billiards, so maybe they learn straight because it's relatively easier to start with? Whereas in the US, I think most players come to the game via pool, so by that time they already know the fundamentals of draw, english, etc.
Maybe I'm missing something? Anybody know specifically what straight rail is supposed to impart to your 3C game? Blomdahl skipped the small games and it didn't hurt him any.
Click to expand...

Yes, you are missing one piece of the puzzle (or, in a certain degree, puzzles) Balkline.
You are right, Straight Rail is nothing more than just speed control gathering three balls. But since the greats back in the early 20th century (late 19th) such as Hoppe and Mignaux would go on to make like 10,000 or so in one inning due to bordem nurses (might be over-exagerating), they would create lines that would make this game a little bit more interesting; balkline. The lines would be either 14 inches, 18 inches, or 72cm away from the cushion. The purpose of balkline (like straight-rail) is to make caroms only when entering these zones you are required to make either one or two hits in this zone but one must get an object ball out of this zone otherwise your inning is done. The key to this game is to control both your cueball and the first object ball you hit and maintain position (if you're quite intellect, you focus on where all three balls will go). If you look at the table from above, it sort of looks like a pound (#) sign. The only catch to this game is that if all three balls are in the center zone (which is called a free zone), you can make as many caroms without limit. And if 14inches.2hits (14.2) is easy, then move it to just 1 hit (14.1). If that's easy, then go to 18.2 then 1. If that's getting you into the bordem, then try the monstrous 72cm.2 or 1. The latter discipline does not have a free zone, looks like a plus (+) sign or like a plus sign with another parallel vertical stick ajacent, and you really need to put your cushion skills to work.

I know my wording is sort of messy. Just ask if you want more info.
 
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Bob Jewett said:
I think that average is too high a goal. An average that high is probably due to mastery of the rail nurse rather than control of gather shots. If he can average 5 at straight rail it is time to try some 3 cushion as well. I'd be willing to bet that if we got 10 US 3-C players who averaged about 0.700, only one or two of them would be able to average 25 at straight rail, or even 10.
Click to expand...

yea, I agree! I certainly set my standards so high! :( It's like trying to hit 100 in four innings... yikes!

So Hernan, try not to kill yourself too much into playing too much caroms. I believe that Bob's word is much more purer than mine. :)
I'm just a young buck trying to get some advantage over myself :p . But yes, play around 5 average and go with balk if possible (and if they let you put lines in their tables with chalk).
 
 
Yes, but how feasible really is learning Balkline is in the US? I assumed the guy who started the thread lives in the US - if he was in Europe he'd have access to alot more guidance than a forum, but I could be wrong.

Is there literally anyone in the US that plays balkline? There aren't many billiard players in the US, fewer straight rail players, and balkline, forget about it. Outside of that accu-stats exhibition video with Caudron, how many Americans have ever even seen balkline played? I doubt there's anything in English on instruction. If you have your own table I guess you could do it, if not, what room is going to let you come in with tailor's chalk and start drawing on their table? The whole straight-balkline-3C progression idea sounds good, but I don't think it's really workable in this country.

SlickRick_PCS said:
Yes, you are missing one piece of the puzzle (or, in a certain degree, puzzles) Balkline.
You are right, Straight Rail is nothing more than just speed control gathering three balls. But since the greats back in the early 20th century (late 19th) such as Hoppe and Mignaux would go on to make like 10,000 or so in one inning due to bordem nurses (might be over-exagerating), they would create lines that would make this game a little bit more interesting; balkline. The lines would be either 14 inches, 18 inches, or 72cm away from the cushion. The purpose of balkline (like straight-rail) is to make caroms only when entering these zones you are required to make either one or two hits in this zone but one must get an object ball out of this zone otherwise your inning is done. The key to this game is to control both your cueball and the first object ball you hit and maintain position (if you're quite intellect, you focus on where all three balls will go). If you look at the table from above, it sort of looks like a pound (#) sign. The only catch to this game is that if all three balls are in the center zone (which is called a free zone), you can make as many caroms without limit. And if 14inches.2hits (14.2) is easy, then move it to just 1 hit (14.1). If that's easy, then go to 18.2 then 1. If that's getting you into the bordem, then try the monstrous 72cm.2 or 1. The latter discipline does not have a free zone, looks like a plus (+) sign or like a plus sign with another parallel vertical stick ajacent, and you really need to put your cushion skills to work.

I know my wording is sort of messy. Just ask if you want more info.
Click to expand...
 
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