Aiming System revisted
- Thread starter TheConArtist
- Start date
Hey Koop, i have been chatting with Ron V. going over his system and i must say i can see some good things from it. Just thought i would let you know Bro.
My aiming system is just visualizing the ghost ball and the lines between the cue ball to object ball and from the object ball to the center of the pocket.
Someone sent me in a pm the S.A.M system , but I don't agree with the fact that 90% of the shots are in a 30 degrees angle. Do you really believe this?
Someone sent me in a pm the S.A.M system , but I don't agree with the fact that 90% of the shots are in a 30 degrees angle. Do you really believe this?
Last edited:
I know in the literature it says that. I use to use the ghostball method, using the cue tip behind the shot then holding it there then moving back behind the cueball use to work like a charm but i couldn't find myself doing it this way all the time and i couldn't see the ghost ball down over the cueball without doing the cue thing so i threw that one away.
if the ghostball works for you then don't change it, if it ain't broken don't fix it right. For me Hals systems have really changed my pocketing percentages. So you just see the ghostball? Or do you like replace the cueball for the ghostball? What i mean is where the ghostball edge would be on the objectball do you aim the cueballs edge to that spot.
The word feel has many conotations.
When people talk about the FEEL aspect in pool, I believe they are mostly refering to what I call Intuitive Judgement (IJ).
When you aim such that you are not necessarily pointing the cue at a particular point or line, but instead Intuitively Judging the aim required to make the shot, then it seems reasonable to call this aiming by IJ, or at least with the assistance of IJ.
I have tried several aiming / sighting systems and they can work quite well. But the more hours I play, the more I tend to rely on IJ. Still, the eyes are playing a very big role in seeing the angles, points and OB travel direction, but it's hard to systamitize the entire process on all shots.
Colin
When people talk about the FEEL aspect in pool, I believe they are mostly refering to what I call Intuitive Judgement (IJ).
When you aim such that you are not necessarily pointing the cue at a particular point or line, but instead Intuitively Judging the aim required to make the shot, then it seems reasonable to call this aiming by IJ, or at least with the assistance of IJ.
I have tried several aiming / sighting systems and they can work quite well. But the more hours I play, the more I tend to rely on IJ. Still, the eyes are playing a very big role in seeing the angles, points and OB travel direction, but it's hard to systamitize the entire process on all shots.
Colin
randyg said:
Hi Randy,
You know, I was thinking about this and especially in conjunction with something Johnny Archer always said. He would talk about sitting at home and stroking into the opening of a coke bottle. Now, while almost of the pro's use some type of system, I strongly believe it is useless unless you can deliver the cueball in a straight line. So yes, I absolutely agree that you need solid fundamentals in order to get the most out of any system. For this reason I am going to take some lessons from Scott Lee when he comes to Boston to fine tune everything and to figure out where I go wrong on certain shots.
Kind regards,
Koop
Nobody shoots by feel. That is just what they call it for lack of a better term. I'm sitting her trying to figure out what it should be called and I can't.
I have called it feel, but it is more like by memory. But memory isn't right term either. Sort of though. sheesh. I don't know what to call it. Aiming isn't the right term either for it.
It seems like you are playing by feel a little bit because you seem to be able to feel the tip hit the cue ball where you want it to go. And that place is the same place it went the last time you pocketed this particular shot.
I now even have myself confused. Feel isn't the correct word, but neither is aiming.
Since feel is what a lot of people call it we are stuck using it. In any case 'feel' is not how a new shooter should learn. You need an aiming system to begin with. Then at sometime you graduate to 'feel' or what ever you want to call it.
I have called it feel, but it is more like by memory. But memory isn't right term either. Sort of though. sheesh. I don't know what to call it. Aiming isn't the right term either for it.
It seems like you are playing by feel a little bit because you seem to be able to feel the tip hit the cue ball where you want it to go. And that place is the same place it went the last time you pocketed this particular shot.
I now even have myself confused. Feel isn't the correct word, but neither is aiming.
Since feel is what a lot of people call it we are stuck using it. In any case 'feel' is not how a new shooter should learn. You need an aiming system to begin with. Then at sometime you graduate to 'feel' or what ever you want to call it.
Koop said:
Well bugger me. I never knew the term feel could have emotional connotations, like feeling sad and stuff. I always thought I was feeling the angle intuitively through my fingers like DM says. He must have missed that bit when he wrote it. How embarrassing.
If I didn’t know better I’d suspect DM doesn’t believe it’s possible to assess and play the angle purely by feel, even though that’s exactly what all the best potters do, because it’s the most precise way. If it looks right, it is. Everything else is down to execution.
Boro Nut
Boro Nut said:
No it's not. How do you AIM by FEEL. I know you are extremely intelligent and a funny bastard at that but not you or anyone is going to convince me that you AIM by FEEL. Sorry, just doesn't make sense no matter how you try to slice it. The very best potters get excellent POSITION based on FEEL but they don't pocket balls with it.
You are sighting the shot(AIM) and applying FEEL to the shot for position.
Koop said:
Yes and I believe Colin said it with the "Delivery" being IJ. A system deals with accuracy, no maybes here or otherwise it's not a good system, SYSTEM= aiming and is fixed. FEEL = Delivery of the CB. It is feel that allows us to stroke the cue ball to make the system work, to gain position,.. the movement part. The system is the stationary part, or the tool.
And what are you doing here, shouldn't you be on your way to Turning Stone?
Koop said:
yeah we have been emailing each other for some time now and his system is something
I'am trying to work this with some of Hals maybe i can make the ultimate aiming system 
Thanks 4 everything bro.I think this is semantics.Koop said:
I aim by feel, memory, judgement...whatever you want to call it. That is, my eyes tell me where I am aiming, but experience (aka feel/memory/judgement) tells me if I'm aiming in the right direction. This is as opposed to using a ghostball or some other explicit geometry. The same with position.
When people use the term "feel", they mean, generally speaking, that they are not employing any conscious system. As with any skill, these things get assigned to the subconscious with repetition. This process can even be seen with PET scans.
Jim
Last edited:
Koop said:
The point was that the term 'feel' is used in its emotive sense, not its tactile sense, as anyone should know. Pretending that anyone means 'feel' in its tactile sense is being deliberately obtuse. Colin's term 'intuitive judgement' sums it up. You look with your eyes. You train your cue to follow your eyes without thinking. I don't try to hit a point on the object ball or aim toward a specific point. I just know when I'm aligned correctly to make the ball go in, including any allowances for side, nap etc (by aiming to miss). I am never wrong. The difficulty is delivering the cue along that line.
Boro Nut
Let us take a look at it this way. What if I propose that everyone plays by feel. Aim all you want, but when you pull the trigger it is feel. The only way this would not be true is if a person could look at the object ball, the cue ball, their front hand and the back hand all at the same time.
On every shot I pocket, I feel the cue stick hit the cue ball to the spot I want it to go to.
What I'm saying here is that I'm wondering if people believing in playing by feel and people not believing in playing by feel are really talking about the same thing. Are we talking before the shot, during the stroke, at impact or some particular combination of these.
I personally before the shot know where I want the cue ball to hit the object ball. I think I'm trying to promote that hit during practice swings and the actual hitting back and forward swing. Then at impact with the cue ball, I feel the hit moving the cue ball toward the spot that will make it hit the object ball at the contact point.
Is this playing by feel? During impact it is for sure.
If you are talking about before impact, during the swinging motion, you are feeling the swing of your back hand. You must be because nobody looks at their back hand much.
If you are talking about before the swinging, during the aiming process you are not feeling anything. You are thinking where you want the cue ball to go. If you are thinking where you want the cue ball to go, that is aiming. Other wise you could hit the cue ball 90 degrees in the wrong direction and miss the object ball by as much as 9 feet.
Now what do you think?
On every shot I pocket, I feel the cue stick hit the cue ball to the spot I want it to go to.
What I'm saying here is that I'm wondering if people believing in playing by feel and people not believing in playing by feel are really talking about the same thing. Are we talking before the shot, during the stroke, at impact or some particular combination of these.
I personally before the shot know where I want the cue ball to hit the object ball. I think I'm trying to promote that hit during practice swings and the actual hitting back and forward swing. Then at impact with the cue ball, I feel the hit moving the cue ball toward the spot that will make it hit the object ball at the contact point.
Is this playing by feel? During impact it is for sure.
If you are talking about before impact, during the swinging motion, you are feeling the swing of your back hand. You must be because nobody looks at their back hand much.
If you are talking about before the swinging, during the aiming process you are not feeling anything. You are thinking where you want the cue ball to go. If you are thinking where you want the cue ball to go, that is aiming. Other wise you could hit the cue ball 90 degrees in the wrong direction and miss the object ball by as much as 9 feet.
Now what do you think?