APA equipment really puts the "Amature" in APA

[Cornerman]

However, I tried to introduce this to my team and our opponent one night because the tables are open and everyone (except me, of course), wanted to use the bar cue ball instead of the red circle cue ball. This wasn't even the green aramath cue ball, this was a much heavier cue ball, but not an oversized ball.

I was floored that they wanted to use the standard cueball; however that is what they were used to so that is what they wanted to use.

This is obviously a very small sample since it only consisted to two teams; however, I am pretty sure I would get a consistent answer across the entire APA region that I play based on some conversations that I have had.

Just wanted to further back up your comments and say that I've had similar feedback in Massachusetts.

I'm going to start a new thread based on this post.

Fred

 

[KMRUNOUT]

I have a standard answer to people who might suggest that "everyone has to play the same conditions." In a nutshell, I didn't put the effort into this game trying to be the best I can be just to attempt to play the game on crappy equipment. Crappy equipment doesn't hurt bad players since they were going to suck no matter what.

The issue here might be where we draw the line on what crappy equipment is and where do we expect any high level tournament to be in those terms.

From your point of view, the green Aramith balls whether it's their surface hardness, the moment of inertia, or the way they smell is over the crappy line and that you'd expect at this point that since there is a decidely better system (i.e., the Diamond Smart Table system), then that should be what we expect at any National tournament.

I can understand your point. I just wanted to convey that from my point of view, when the last time the green Aramith ball was at the BCA Nationals on Valley tables, I would have consider it as good a bar table condition as I could have asked for. And, my local bars that I go to, they both have the reputation deservedly so to have the best conditions of any bar (in our area). And they use Valleys or Dynamos with the green Aramith cueball.

So, would I rather see all Diamond Smart Tables everywhere? Absolutely? Did the APA go with less than the best? Yes, and you have a very valid point about that. But did they go with crap instead? Not by a long shot.

But, that's my point of view.

Fred

Fred,

Sounds like ultimately we are saying the same thing. I guess I didn't mean to characterize the APA equipment as crappy, just dissappointing.

By the way, you grabbed the exact term I could not recall from my physics classes..."moment of inertia". That is exactly what I was trying to describe. I think it might be different than a standard ball. I really don't know what effect this would have on its behavior, or its smell

Anyway, thanks for the comments!

KMRUNOUT

 

[KMRUNOUT]

kmrunout:

I have one point that I don't remember seeing in this thread.

My biggest issue about the equipment changes at Nationals made by the APA is what seems to be their final arrival at using the bar box cue ball with professional type (fast) cloth.

My first trip was in 1997 and I think I remember bar cloth (thick & slow) with bar cue balls. That is probably what the vast majornity of APA players are used to (as already stated in the thread). Then I seem to remember they moved on to a faster cloth (Champion ?? Championship??) with the red circle - still fine. Next thing they started this bar cue ball with the fast cloth.

That totally left me shaking my head - why use a professional type cloth with an amateur type cue ball??

To me - fast cloth needs a good quality resin cue ball and the bar box cloth can get along with bar box cue balls - but I do also prefer the red circle on bar cloth.

It seems to me that with a tournament of this size they should be able to dictate to the suppliers what they want (red circles). I don't fall one minute for the "people steal them" excuse. I do remember a time (maybe a Southwest Challenge or a Singles event) where you were given your scoresheet and the red circle to start your match and had to return both to the desk when your match was over.

Fran

Fran,

This is a really good point. I personally prefer the faster cloth, which is why I didn't have much to say about it. Personally, I don't really thing the cloth they used is super fast, just faster than bar cloth. Not nearly as fast as Simonis. Good point though!!

KMRUNOUT

 

[KMRUNOUT]

Just wanted to further back up your comments and say that I've had similar feedback in Massachusetts.

I'm going to start a new thread based on this post.

Fred

I play in MA, and also encounter teams that believe the heavy ball gives them a "home field advantage". Personally, I really don't want the equipment to be my "advantage". I would prefer it was my pool playing ability and preparedness for the match.

I find that of the bars that still use the heavy red dot dynamo ball, some agree to use a real cue ball. I typicall carry a Centennial Blue Circle (my personal preference). I actually called up a team captain we are playing in the playoffs this Monday. I know they use the heavy ball. I offered to buy his team a Super Aramith cueball that they can keep if they agree to use it from now on on league nights. He was all for it. Up to a point (cost is an issue) I will make this offer to the teams in my division.

Maybe this is one way I can personally try to improve things.

KMRUNOUT