APA Rules Questions

[maxeypad2007]

Three scenarios.

If I break and scratch without touching anything is it then my opponents turn to break? Is this truly a new break or is this my opponent just opening the balls up? Basically if he makes the 8 here is it a loss of game?

If I break and clip between say he 2nd and 3rd balls with 4 balls touch a rail is this a legal break?

Midgame, can I switch to my break cue (full length) for a jump shot because I don't want to screw up my playing cue? Also can I switch to any full length cue that I want for a jump shot midgame in APA or must it be my break cue?

 

[Das928]

4 balls must touch a rail for it to be legal.

You cannot switch sticks in the middle of your game unless there is an equipment problem. But once you switch cause of an equipment problem you may not switch back.


The first question I would have to check the rule book but if I remember it is a foul

 

[Rethunk]

Three scenarios.
...

Off the top of my head...
1. Scratch on the break = opponent may choose to break
2. As long as four balls hit a rail, it doesn't matter which ball you hit first. (That said, if you're not hitting the head ball you're probably not making best use of the break.)
3. Consult the official rules as far as switching cues is concerned.

Look through the current official rules available through this link:
http://www.poolplayers.com/materials.html

 

[poolpro]

Three scenarios.

If I break and scratch without touching anything is it then my opponents turn to break? Is this truly a new break or is this my opponent just opening the balls up? Basically if he makes the 8 here is it a loss of game?

If I break and clip between say he 2nd and 3rd balls with 4 balls touch a rail is this a legal break?

Midgame, can I switch to my break cue (full length) for a jump shot because I don't want to screw up my playing cue? Also can I switch to any full length cue that I want for a jump shot midgame in APA or must it be my break cue?

#1 APA rules specify that "The rack must be struck before a foul can occur" If the break is not a legal break than the balls are re racked and broken by the same player. If the break is not legal and results in a scratch, the balls are reracked and broken by the opposite player. So then an 8 on the break would count as a win in either case.

#2 The rules do actually state that the headball or second ball must be struck first and 4 balls must hit a rail. Also, the rail cannot be hit before the balls.

#3 APA manual states that " A player may use one cue stick for breaking, and a different cue for shooting. During the course of a game a player may not change cuesticks or shafts unless their cue becomes damaged. A player can change shafts or cue sticks between games, but once he has made a shot in a game he must continue playing with that cue stick untill that game is over.



Jw

 

[sk8ordie]

#1 APA rules specify that "The rack must be struck before a foul can occur" If the break is not a legal break than the balls are re racked and broken by the same player. If the break is not legal and results in a scratch, the balls are reracked and broken by the opposite player. So then an 8 on the break would count as a win in either case.

#2 The rules do actually state that the headball or second ball must be struck first and 4 balls must hit a rail. Also, the rail cannot be hit before the balls.

#3 APA manual states that " A player may use one cue stick for breaking, and a different cue for shooting. During the course of a game a player may not change cuesticks or shafts unless their cue becomes damaged. A player can change shafts or cue sticks between games, but once he has made a shot in a game he must continue playing with that cue stick untill that game is over.



Jw

Poolpro is correct on 1,2 and 3, but check your by-laws for your league area for #3. These are the by-laws here and you can use your break cue that you use to break with during your match to preform legal jump shots. Anyway this is copy/pasted from this areas Apa by-laws.

13. JUMP SHOTS
Jump Shots are legal in APA if executed correctly (player must strike the cue ball above the equator of the
ball in a downward motion). Scooping the cue ball to jump it is NOT legal. You must use the stick with which
you are shooting the match (or your breaking cue that is being used for the match) when attempting to
execute a jump shot. You cannot break the cue stick down or add anything to the cue for the purpose of the
shot. Short cues designed for jump shots are not allowed during regular league play (except in Masters
Division). All cues used must be standard length

Hope this helps...Ron:thumbup:

 

[s'portplayer]

#1 APA rules specify that "The rack must be struck before a foul can occur" If the break is not a legal break than the balls are re racked and broken by the same player. If the break is not legal and results in a scratch, the balls are reracked and broken by the opposite player. So then an 8 on the break would count as a win in either case.

#2 The rules do actually state that the headball or second ball must be struck first and 4 balls must hit a rail. Also, the rail cannot be hit before the balls.

#3 APA manual states that " A player may use one cue stick for breaking, and a different cue for shooting. During the course of a game a player may not change cuesticks or shafts unless their cue becomes damaged. A player can change shafts or cue sticks between games, but once he has made a shot in a game he must continue playing with that cue stick untill that game is over.



Jw

I second this motion, but each league may have their own variation of the rules, so contact your league operator and they will be able to clarify any questions you may have.

 

[Predator5K4]

#3 APA manual states that " A player may use one cue stick for breaking, and a different cue for shooting. During the course of a game a player may not change cuesticks or shafts unless their cue becomes damaged. A player can change shafts or cue sticks between games, but once he has made a shot in a game he must continue playing with that cue stick untill that game is over.



Jw

Is this a new wording in the team manual? Doesn't sound familiar. I have heard that in Vegas a couple of years ago people were allowed to switch to their break cues to legally full stick jump a ball, but that this may have changed. At a local national singles qualifier last year, the tournament allowed this, as well. I guess I need to read the new "big book," for the current version of ambiguous APA rules. Good info. thanks!

 

[Ponytail]

Three scenarios.

If I break and scratch without touching anything is it then my opponents turn to break? Is this truly a new break or is this my opponent just opening the balls up? Basically if he makes the 8 here is it a loss of game?

According to the APA rules, http://www.poolplayers.com/8-9-ball-Rules.pdf, rule 3, page 2, in all caps "THE RACK MUST BE STRUCK BEFORE A FOUL CAN
OCCUR." Which would lead me to the assumption that your scenario above would NOT be a foul, since the rack was not struck. However, rule 3, page 1, under Breaking: "If the break
does not qualify as legal and results in a scratch, the
balls are reracked and broken by the opposite player." This would lead me to think that the incoming player then attempts a legal break from behind the head string.

If I break and clip between say he 2nd and 3rd balls with 4 balls touch a rail is this a legal break?

Yes, if you hit the 2nd ball first. Same rules as above. "3. Breaking - To be a legal break, players must break
from behind the head string, the head ball or second
ball must be struck first and at least four object balls
must be driven to the rails or a ball must be pocketed."
If you hit the 3rd ball, then this is NOT a legal break, and you break again, as long as you did not scratch on the break. "If the break does not qualify as legal, the balls are
reracked and rebroken by the same player."


Midgame, can I switch to my break cue (full length) for a jump shot because I don't want to screw up my playing cue? Also can I switch to any full length cue that I want for a jump shot midgame in APA or must it be my break cue?

No. 33. EQUIPMENT
In general, any piece of equipment designed specifically for pocket billiards,
with the exception of jump cues and laser devices, is acceptable in APA
League play. Special equipment, such as bridges and cue extenders, are legal.
Jump shots are legal, when executed properly (see JUMP SHOTS described
in Definitions), but such shots must be attempted using your regular game
cue (see REGULAR GAME CUE described in Definitions). Those cues
especially designed for jump shots MAY NOT be used in competition.
Players are not allowed to break their cues down to attempt jump shots.
This is taken from http://www.poolplayers.com/tmanual.pdf

On a side note....
There seems to be a lot of questions about APA rules posted here. I'm wondering why this is. Why not go to the APA and ask for a rules clarification? If they are made aware, that there is some language in their rules that is unclear, they can change the language to make it so it's better understood by more people. If there is a scenario that isn't covered specifically, they may be able to address it directly back to you, and then add it to the next version of rules that get published.
It just seems odd that this, seemingly, is the first resource people turn to for a rules clarification, when it should be the organization who would best be able to answer the questions...

 

[NewStroke]

Based on my experience playing in the APA, here is what I have observed.

1. Scratching on the break and hitting no ball, my opponent takes a shot with beer chaser.
2. I hit the 2nd ball in the rack and 4 balls hit the rail, my opponent takes a shot with beer chaser.
3. I change cues during a game, my opponent takes a shot with beer chaser.
4. I beat the crap out of my opponent and he begins chasing me with his cue.

Is it like that for those not living in Texas?

 

[Ponytail]

Based on my experience playing in the APA, here is what I have observed.

1. Scratching on the break and hitting no ball, my opponent takes a shot with beer chaser.
2. I hit the 2nd ball in the rack and 4 balls hit the rail, my opponent takes a shot with beer chaser.
3. I change cues during a game, my opponent takes a shot with beer chaser.
4. I beat the crap out of my opponent and he begins chasing me with his cue.

Is it like that for those not living in Texas?

I've not played APA, and I live in Texas, but that made me laugh..

Well played.

 

[frankncali]

Is this a new wording in the team manual? Doesn't sound familiar. I have heard that in Vegas a couple of years ago people were allowed to switch to their break cues to legally full stick jump a ball, but that this may have changed. At a local national singles qualifier last year, the tournament allowed this, as well. I guess I need to read the new "big book," for the current version of ambiguous APA rules. Good info. thanks!

This is what I understand as well. We actually play this way during sessions. You can change as many times as you would like.

I even remember cuemakers (a couple on here as well) starting to make full length light cues due to this.

 

[maxeypad2007]

The issue is these situations are not clearly spelled out in the APA manual which is why I am asking.

I would prefer to get something more official than "its the discretion of the league operator"

Thanks for the replies guys

 

[pooltchr]

I would prefer to get something more official than "its the discretion of the league operator"

While you may not like it, your league operator is the one who will ultimately make the decision that determines how the rules work in your area. What anyone says here doesn't carry any weight if your LO sees things differently.
Steve

 

[poolpro]

Is this a new wording in the team manual? Doesn't sound familiar. I have heard that in Vegas a couple of years ago people were allowed to switch to their break cues to legally full stick jump a ball, but that this may have changed. At a local national singles qualifier last year, the tournament allowed this, as well. I guess I need to read the new "big book," for the current version of ambiguous APA rules. Good info. thanks!

For the record I got my wording from the APA official Team manual. This is the complete team manual and goes a bit more in depth than the little rule books. The one I used is from 2003/2004. So it is a tad bit out dated. I did not feel that anything had changed in the areas mentioned, and it was the book I had handy. I do currently play in the APA and it seemed accurate to me.

If anyone knows that they have made changes to the application or wording in these situations, please speak up.

Thanks,

Jw

 

[pooltchr]

If anyone knows that they have made changes to the application or wording in these situations, please speak up.

Thanks,

Jw

The team manual is written by the St Louis office and applies to all league play at the national level. Most leagues also use the same manual, but also have local by-laws. If the manual and by-laws differ, the by-laws over-rule the manual for local play. Your league operator might allow changing cues in mid game, mine might not. Until we meet in Vegas, we are playing by different rules. That is why I posted that questions like this are best addressed directly with an individual's league operator. What is true here, may not be true where you are playing.
Steve