Been using the jab stroke, wish I found about it earlier.

[judochoke]

I was watching a match on you tube, with long time pro SHAWN WILKIE, on bar table 9 ball. He was playing a young Russia pro and
shawn beat her rather quickly. But I was watching Shawns stroke, and most of the time, he had a short bridge, and a very short backswing.
it didn’t look pretty for sure, and it wasn’t elegant lIke some of the other pros. But he never missed, and played very fast.

I started to experiment using this stroke when I had a ball on the long rail, that had to be cut to the corner pocket. It took some time to get this JAB STROKE DIALED IN, but after a while, I fell in love with this stroke.

short bridge, very short backstroke, maybe two inch backstroke, and just popping the cue ball.

I use the jab stroke on all 15-30 degree cut shots, draw shots when I need to float the cue ball to the left or right.

I still use a normal stroke (longer bridge longer backstroke) on my long straight in shots, but everything else is getting jabbed to the pocket.
was wondering if any other older pros used this stroke, and who made this stroke famous.

 

[bbb]

Allen hopkins

 

[measureman]

Allen hopkins

I saw Allen play in person many times in the 80's when he was in his prime.
It was amazing how well he played with that short stroke.

 

[The_JV]

Very common around my parts for the BB 'specialists' to use a very short jabbing stroke. Doesn't translate very well to the full size 9fter where controlled power is way more of a factor.

 

[Imac007]

I was watching a match on you tube, with long time pro SHAWN WILKIE, on bar table 9 ball. He was playing a young Russia pro and
shawn beat her rather quickly. But I was watching Shawns stroke, and most of the time, he had a short bridge, and a very short backswing.
it didn’t look pretty for sure, and it wasn’t elegant lIke some of the other pros. But he never missed, and played very fast.

I started to experiment using this stroke when I had a ball on the long rail, that had to be cut to the corner pocket. It took some time to get this JAB STROKE DIALED IN, but after a while, I fell in love with this stroke.

short bridge, very short backstroke, maybe two inch backstroke, and just popping the cue ball.

I use the jab stroke on all 15-30 degree cut shots, draw shots when I need to float the cue ball to the left or right.

I still use a normal stroke (longer bridge longer backstroke) on my long straight in shots, but everything else is getting jabbed to the pocket.
was wondering if any other older pros used this stroke, and who made this stroke famous.

During commentary, from Jeremy Jones, he talks about situations to use the stroke.
Often his guest experts also mention the technique.
They call it “pinching” the ball.
As to the shorter bridge and backswing, it helps with accuracy and unless the player starts feeling cramped, it will likely benefit them.
At a point in Ronnie O’Sullivan’s career he was mentored by Ray Reardon, who helped hone his cue ball control.
He came out of that mentorship with a noticeably shorter bridge, and dynamite control.
A word of caution.
On long shots it’s like using a pistol to do the job best suited for a rifle, and I see you acknowledge that, but adopters beware.
Aim is more precarious especially if you use a loop bridge.
There is a reason, young Eastern European, Asian players and snooker players use longer, open bridges and a slight bit of downward pressure when extra control is needed, a newer version of the same dynamic, with chest to cue.
As to origins, you would have to go back into billiard history since most short bridge, short stroke techniques were standard then.

 

[judochoke]

I have know for sometime my main problem in missing shots. My big fat fingers just can’t seem to get a good grip on the cue shaft. I know on a normal backstroke, I get wiggling motion between my fingers and the shaft. And if mark wilson says that the thickness of a dime can make you miss, that’s my problem.

with the jab stroke, and a short two inch backstroke, there is no time for any movement, the stroke is too Quick.

 

[The_JV]

I have know for sometime my main problem in missing shots. My big fat fingers just can’t seem to get a good grip on the cue shaft. I know on a normal backstroke, I get wiggling motion between my fingers and the shaft. And if mark wilson says that the thickness of a dime can make you miss, that’s my problem.

with the jab stroke, and a short two inch backstroke, there is no time for any movement, the stroke is too Quick.

Then lose the looped bridge. Really zero gain with that style.

Only circumstance I could see that a looped bridge provides any benefit is when you're playing with an extreme amount of top spin/power and no other means to apply downward pressure on the cue.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Only circumstance I could see that a looped bridge provides any benefit is when you're playing with an extreme amount of top spin/power and no other means to apply downward pressure on the cue.

I doubt that downward pressure has any effect on the shot anyway.

pj
chgo

 

[The_JV]

I doubt that downward pressure has any effect on the shot anyway.

Most likely not, but having the cue firmly planted into the bridge throughout the shot and follow through just feels better. At least to me anyway.

 

[PoolBoy1]

Then lose the looped bridge. Really zero gain with that style.

Only circumstance I could see that a looped bridge provides any benefit is when you're playing with an extreme amount of top spin/power and no other means to apply downward pressure on the cue.

Decades ago cloths were slower and cushions not as reactive as todays. More force was needed for moving around the table. Todays equipment including more choices of tips and cues make moving around easy with feather strokes. I use both in play but short bridge only.

 

[FranCrimi]

The jab-type stroke originated back when 14.1 was the game everyone played. Often times you had no choice because the cb and ob were so close. You had to avoid double-hiting the cb. Besides the close shots, in the early stages of the rack, object balls were close to each other and you needed a compact stroke to avoid fouls. Yes, Allen Hopkins was famous for that stroke but also another player who was one of the best I'd ever seen at jabbing the ball was Danny Barouty. Usually, jabbers hate to play rotation games. They don't like the big shots. If you've ever watched Allen play 9 ball, he gets very close position as often as he could. He'd take a sharp angle close shot over a long, lesser angled shot all day long.

Now for the downside: It's short. The stroke timing is pretty awful. And you're going to hate shooting big shots, because they'll require a faster stroke. My suggestion is to use the jab when a situation comes up but don't make it your game stroke.

 

[Imac007]

Now for the downside: It's short. The stroke timing is pretty awful. And you're going to hate shooting big shots, because they'll require a faster stroke. My suggestion is to use the jab when a situation comes up but don't make it your game stroke.

I echo the need for the stroke to be appropriate to the situation.
As you noted it’s how the cue connects with the ball regardless of bridge or stroke length.

 

[The_JV]

Decades ago cloths were slower and cushions not as reactive as todays. More force was needed for moving around the table. Todays equipment including more choices of tips and cues make moving around easy with feather strokes. I use both in play but short bridge only.

Forgive me for putting it this way, but that's bs... I can hit just as 'purposely' hard with an open bridge as someone can with a closed one. I've seen this dead rail, slow cloth, newer tech argument before and it still doesn't hold water. We're not shooting over the distance of a golf course.

Show me a pool table larger and slower than a snooker table from the same era (for tech's sake) and then point to a single closed bridge snooker player that needed to do so because of the horrifically slow conditions.

 

[Pool Hand Luke]

During commentary, from Jeremy Jones, he talks about situations to use the stroke.
Often his guest experts also mention the technique.
They call it “pinching” the ball.

I think I was watching them too but remember the word as cinching. Jeremy's great.

 

[The_JV]

Too many words to describe things that don't necessarily line up with actual definitions.

Last I heard, 'cinching' was potting a ball without concern of subsequent shape.

 

[Imac007]

I think I was watching them too but remember the word as cinching. Jeremy's great.

Cinching is putting all effort and focus into pocketing the ob.
Pinching is using a stroke designed to limit cue ball movement as much as possible without quitting on the stroke.
Three main techniques are commonly used, draw, check english and/or throw english.
Soft draw kills the pace on the cue ball because of the initial slide involved before back spin engages.
This allows the shooter to use an abbreviated but positive follow through with the cue ball speed slowing slightly on impact.
Throw english, past the 40% of gearing english, allows for a fuller hit on the object ball transferring more momentum to the object ball.
If rail contact is part of the shot, check english can be used to deaden the cb movement.
This is a far different animal than cinching, although Earl might suggest using the full hit, beyond gearing to cinch a ball.

 

[PoolBoy1]

Forgive me for putting it this way, but that's bs... I can hit just as 'purposely' hard with an open bridge as someone can with a closed one. I've seen this dead rail, slow cloth, newer tech argument before and it still doesn't hold water. We're not shooting over the distance of a golf course.

Show me a pool table larger and slower than a snooker table from the same era (for tech's sake) and then point to a single closed bridge snooker player that needed to do so because of the horrifically slow conditions.

You go boy!!!!!!!!

 

[straightline]

Cinching is putting all effort and focus into pocketing the ob.

To a degree yes. It can also be expanded to include the complete shot. Low outside to kill the ball on the first rail or letting the ball run so the corners trap it, to cite a couple examples... etc...

 

[Imac007]

To a degree yes. It can also be expanded to include the complete shot. Low outside to kill the ball on the first rail or letting the ball run so the corners trap it, to cite a couple examples... etc...

Based on the dictionary definition of cinch, it means to make it a certainty, in this case, a shot.
Contextually that sets the top priority in the shot to pocketing the ball.
Any added criteria within the context would be lower on the importance scale.

 

[straightline]

Based on the dictionary definition of cinch, it means to make it a certainty, in this case, a shot.
Contextually that sets the top priority in the shot to pocketing the ball.
Any added criteria within the context would be lower on the importance scale.

Yes but <not missing> is a given - so now among your high priority options are run maintenance ie high percentage pocket and position. I'd go as far as to say every pool shot has to be cinched. (not just Proone lol) What is the antonym of cinch? All pool alternatives in that direction start at estimation - technically guessing and continue through clueless flailing.