Before Simonis/Now IPT

[Island Drive]

Do you agree? My opinion is that players of the past had a much more powerful swing, than most today that have learned on the faster cloths. Therefore, I feel with slow cloth players have more potential to:
1. Have a second gear
2. Have a greater shot arsenal, and ability. (Earl)
3. Greater ability to adjust to different cloth speeds.
4. Better understanding of adjustments that must be made when going to
different playing conditions.

A couple comparative thoughts.
When Andre Agassie was learning tennis he was concerned he might be hitting the ball too hard, he was told, keep at it they will eventually start going in. He was told you can always hit less hard, but if you have never hit a ball real hard its extremely difficult too when needed.
And when was the last time you saw a player from today, that was brought up playing on fast cloth that developed a great slip stroke?
Great powerful swings I think, evolved "because" of slow cloth, therefore creating an exceptional throwing motion.
Cowboy Jimmy Moore/Cornbread Red

 

[Black Cat 5791]

And when was the last time you saw a player from today, that was brought up playing on fast cloth that developed a great slip stroke?
Great powerful swings I think, evolved "because" of slow cloth, therefore creating an exceptional throwing motion.
Cowboy Jimmy Moore/Cornbread Red

Explain Slip Stroke I've heard the term before. Thanks

 

[Colin Colenso]

I've put a slow nap cloth on my table. I believe it's considerably slower than the cloth used in Orlando, but I believe they're trying an even slower cloth in the Marietta qualifier.

I often have to use power shots near my limits of control eg. For long draw shots. This rarely occurs on the fast cloth tables. However, it makes certain creative plays unplayable. It's a cost benefit mix, but it is good to know only the strongest cuists can perform some shots with control.

 

[renard]

Do you agree? My opinion is that players of the past had a much more powerful swing, than most today that have learned on the faster cloths. Therefore, I feel with slow cloth players have more potential to:
1. Have a second gear
2. Have a greater shot arsenal, and ability. (Earl)
3. Greater ability to adjust to different cloth speeds.
4. Better understanding of adjustments that must be made when going to
different playing conditions.

A couple comparative thoughts.
When Andre Agassie was learning tennis he was concerned he might be hitting the ball too hard, he was told, keep at it they will eventually start going in. He was told you can always hit less hard, but if you have never hit a ball real hard its extremely difficult too when needed.
And when was the last time you saw a player from today, that was brought up playing on fast cloth that developed a great slip stroke?
Great powerful swings I think, evolved "because" of slow cloth, therefore creating an exceptional throwing motion.
Cowboy Jimmy Moore/Cornbread Red

You bring up very valid points that are hard to dispute. I would say I agree...but comparing eras is like comparing apples and oranges. It's a shame we do not have a way back machine to see a Reyes-Greenleaf match

 

[Tbeaux]

Explain Slip Stroke I've heard the term before. Thanks

I can only tell you what I have used and called a "slip stroke". I seen different desciptions including the way Mosconi would slid his hand back before making the final stroke.
Way I did it was on the stroke slightly open my hand and allow the cue to slid forward on it's own momentum. you have to be very careful to keep the tip on target with your bridge hand. Two ways I used it..1) allow the cue to hit the cueball and catch the cue on it's return- This was good for a "pop" on the cueball and in some situations helped keep the cue from a double hit. 2) let the cue slid forward and with "good timing" regrip just at impact to help the cue follow through-unbelievable power if done right. Do it wrong and people go...."What the hell was that!".

Terry

 

[Black Cat 5791]

I can only tell you what I have used and called a "slip stroke". I seen different desciptions including the way Mosconi would slid his hand back before making the final stroke.
Way I did it was on the stroke slightly open my hand and allow the cue to slid forward on it's own momentum. you have to be very careful to keep the tip on target with your bridge hand. Two ways I used it..1) allow the cue to hit the cueball and catch the cue on it's return- This was good for a "pop" on the cueball and in some situations helped keep the cue from a double hit. 2) let the cue slid forward and with "good timing" regrip just at impact to help the cue follow through-unbelievable power if done right. Do it wrong and people go...."What the hell was that!".

Terry

Thanks Terry, anyone else have any input or further explanation. I haven't seen much of Mosconi vintage footage. I'll have to look out for some on ESPN Classic.

Black Cat

 

[8-ball bernie]

as an ipt player i found the holy grail sort of speak, right near my house is a pool hall with the slowest cloth i ever played on in my 45 years!! they claim it's a cheapo throw away version of simonis, i just don't know. i can say that it made the cloth at the king of the hill look like simonis rapid 200!!!!!!!!! for those of you unaware of simonis rapid 200, it's a special cloth used for 3-cushion billiards and it's LIGHTING fast!!!!! this cloth i now practice on is so slow that you can do the impossible when it comes to holding up the cueball, for positional purposes, however, when follow is required and the cueball, and object ball are only 5 inches or so from eachother, a regular nice soft stroke is instant death!!!! it will be interesting to see what type of cloth the ipt came up withm but i doubt it will be as slow as this. and if it is i'm well prepared. Bernie Friend ipt 2006.