Beginners and 9-ball

C

Cameron Smith

is kind of hungry...
Silver Member
Every time I go to the pool hall I always see a bunch of beginners practicing, which is cool I always like to see more people taking the time to learn te game. I just can't understand why 9-ball is THE game they have to practice, their logic behind it is nonsensical. I see these guys (and kids) break open the rack, bang the balls around until the 9 goes in, which would amount to somewhere around 15 to 20 innings. They do this for 4 hrs or so. I have on occasion tried to help these guys out by suggesting they add a little straight pool to the mix, but they just say that straight pool and 8-ball are too easy, lol. A high run of 6 in straight pool does not make it "too easy" . They say that 9 ball forces you to go for the tough shot rather than wimp out and take the easy shot. Thats not what 9 ball is all about! Hell thats not what any game of pool is all about.

The problem is that making one ball and then constantly missing, its very easy to become frusterated. Perhaps if they practiced by planning their position (which they don't do), and then trying to get there. If they miss either the shot or the position, then they should set it up and do it again and again until they can make it, this is called positive reinforcement.

9 ball can be an art if played properly. A very good player can make the game look so easy, and the game looks very pretty when a player can make the cue ball dance around the table (Efren Reyes and Earl Strickland comes to mind). I suppose that is what they see and want to do, but it just isn't working for them and they've been playing for months and not really getting anywhere, and I think this has more to do with the fact that in 4hrs they don't make very many balls, rather than lack of natural talent.

If these people were just coming in to play and enjoy themselves then I wouldn't really care, but they really want to become great players, which is a goal of mine aswell. I just thought that since we are on the same path, but Im just a little farther down the road then they are I would impart some of the knoweldge I have obtained. But nope, its 9ball, 9ball is pool, 9ball is life man.

I don't really think there is a point to this rant other then, for any beginners reading this, if your high run in 9 ball is 4 balls and your average run per rack is 0.5 balls, then maybe you should think about playing some straight pool. But then what do I know? Im still a nobody in the world of pool. Some day..... *sigh*

Just wait till next week when I go off on another rant about people who come in with their $800 cues and go to work on the coin ops, because 9 footers are too hard. If you want hard try a couple shots on the snooker table in the back.

regards
Cameron-is shaking his head
 
I've long believed that if inexpereinced players must play a rotation game, they should play six ball, not nine ball.
 
I agree. You should work your way up to the more difficult games like 9-ball or rotation.

But Straight Pool is such a great game for beginners and advanced players alike. I've always enjoyed Willie Mosconi's comment about 9 ball. "You hit the balls hard and the 9 ball goes in. Wheres the skill in that?" lol. I know he is exagerating a bit but I still thought it was funny.

If you couldn't tell I really like straight pool.

regards
 
Newer players tend to want to play what's being shown on TV and considered "in". Just like poker - no one plays 5-card stud or draw anymore, it's all Texas Hold 'Em. I think once the IPT TV coverage starts heating up, you'll start to see LOTS of newer players playing 8Ball, which is probably a better learning game than 9Ball. When I first started playing, all I played was straight pool and snooker, and by the time I got to 9Ball, I was ready and played pretty good right away. My vote for the best learning curve game progression would be: 14.1, 8Ball, 9Ball, banks, 1P - with a little snooker and 3-Cushion billiards thrown in along the way. I'm thinking that starting with 14.1 might give a player a more consistent stroke, but I don't have anything to back that statement up with. I'm not a 9Ball hater, but after watching 1P, 14.1, banks and 9Ball at the DCC, IMO the 9Ball finished dead last in spectator appeal.
 
I learned in a room that had both great 14.1 players, and 9ballers. I of course played 9ball because that's what the tournys were, and honestly it had less thinking, Shoot the 1 etc, and thats easier for a beginner....

The funny thing was you could tell what game a guy played by the stroke he had. 9ballers in general were wide open and loose, 14.1 players had short compact controlled strokes.

If I had to do it over again, I'd start by learning to run balls in 14.1, then 1 pocket, then rotation, then banks, 9ball is just a conglomeration of those games and really does'nt have a "set of certain skills" needed to play the game well like say 1 pocket...

Gerry
 
I promote some amateur 9-ball leagues in the UK. It has taken us a while to get them started but we are finally breaking the mould! The problem in the UK is not necessarily about practice but more to do with players from a snooker background thinking that the game is easy. They soon realise the difficulty and technical aspects of the game. The second problem we have is players new to the game hitting he balls real hard rather than stroking!It doesn't matter how many times you tell them. Coaching in a pool sense does not really happen in the UK yet as there is not really a dedicated professional coaching body, you can get coaching for your cue action rom a snooker qualified coach but they do not ave the knowledge on the 9' tables. Instructors courses would be a good idea!
 
Gerry said:
and honestly it had less thinking, Shoot the 1 etc, and thats easier for a beginner....

Gerry
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That may be the major reason. New players haven't learned strategy and pattern play. In 9-ball, they don't have to make choices. There is only one ball to aim for, so they can just shoot. I've heard several beginners say they like 9-ball for just that reason. Give 'em time...
Steve
 
I think that as long as the players involved are having fun with it, then let them play what they want to play. For me, when I was a beginner, and exchanging those 20 inning racks of 9 ball with my buddies, I hated the game because for players at that kind of level, winning the game doesn't qualify as being the better player. More or less, when players that can't move the cue ball around and can only make close thick shots with any regularity, the player that wins the game is always going to be the first guy that finds himself at the table with an easy 9. When I work with younger or lower level players, I always suggest a form of straight pool but without the 14-1 rack. Rack all 15 balls, and shoot til you miss. First player to reach a predetermined number of balls wins. That's the only way the better player is going to be the one that consistently comes out on top when it comes to lower level players.
As far as I'm concerned, the game of 9 ball is based on the break and run out. A game of 9 ball between players that can't break and run with reasonable consistency, is simply playing roulette with the game ball.
But like I say, if they're having fun with it, let them be.
dave
 
I think everyone should start with straight pool!

By starting with straight pool, the novice learns all shots in their time.
It also isn't discouraging.
It is a great game to see the progress you have made by the amount of balls you can consistently run.
I played straight pool for over a year at 18 years of age and my nine ball improved 50% after that.
Straight pool really teaches and promotes the three C's.
Confidence, Concentration & Consistency.

TY & GL, OHB
 
I like the way you think :D.

I remember when I first started playing, and I walked away from the table with a run 12 balls. I was on cloud nine. The confidence that straight pool has instilled in my game is phenomenal, because after shooting so many balls there are so many shots that become gimmies after a while. Before any match, regardless of what game, I always play straight pool, simply to get that confidence in running balls. If I can run at least 45 balls before a 9 ball match, then that is 5 times what is required to run the table. I know there is a flaw to the logic but it works for me. I do by the way play a bit of 9 ball before a 9 ball match but i make sure that I am quite comfortable running balls first.

regards
 
I started playing (again) in '05 after I retired, and I play a lot of equal offense when I'm practicing by myself. I modify it in one aspect, when I miss a ball I continue to shoot until all the balls are pocketed. I keep track of both the number of balls I run at the beginning of the rack, and how many misses per rack. It is a good way to track your progress and my game has improved. The only thing it doesn't do is teach kicking and safety play, I have started to work in some safety practice now that my pocketing and position play are no longer lousy like before.

When I go to the local pool room 9 ball seems to the the most popular but some 8 ball is also played. Occasionally I see some 1 pocket. The best players, and there are some good ones, usually play on the bar boxes. I'm guessing that's because all the tournaments and leagues are played on bar boxes.
 
Plateaus of Learning ...

Because:
1) Most players start out playing for entertainment.
2) They grab the easiest to understand and play first, and most popular.
3) Learning Pool is similiar to courses offered in school, you graduate to
the 'harder' courses over time.
4) Most people can recognize 'stripes' and 'solids' after you tell them what
they are, just don't call them 'little ones' and 'big ones', hence 8 ball.
5) Most people can count past 3, hence 9 ball.

Never know what a bigginner will think. I once heard 2 black guys complaining that the 8 ball should not be black, and that it was discriminatory in nature and connotation. The fact, that when you sunk the
8 ball, you were rewarded for putting a 'black' down.
 
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Am I an exception? By that I mean I'm a new player, I have playing for about a year and the vast majority of games that I play are 9-ball(Vast majorty meaning 8 out of 10 games). In that year I've learned to get position at least 75 to 80% of the time, and on average I run 7 balls on good day the table. I also have a friend that has played for as long as I have and is way better than me. Neither of has had any major instruction from anyone. Althogh I do understand what you are saying.
 
Mr.psychopath said:
Am I an exception? By that I mean I'm a new player, I have playing for about a year and the vast majority of games that I play are 9-ball(Vast majorty meaning 8 out of 10 games). In that year I've learned to get position at least 75 to 80% of the time, and on average I run 7 balls on good day the table. I also have a friend that has played for as long as I have and is way better than me. Neither of has had any major instruction from anyone. Althogh I do understand what you are saying.
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I don't know if your the exception. Are you saying that after a year you average on a good day is a break and out, on a regular day you run out from the 3 ball consistently. If so thats some pretty fast learnin.

regards
 
Its strange that i really see the opposite. More beginners i see in halls are playing 8 ball, and dont like 9 ball because they dont like the limitation of having to hit the lowest numbered ball first. Personally, ive played 8 ball most of my beginning years of pool. Only recently (past year or so) did i pick up 9 ball because the hall i go to, thats basically what all the serious players play, that and some straight, rotation, and carom.

My high school has a billiards class, and my doubles partner and i HATE playing 9 ball in the class. Not because we hate the game, its just that it gets annoying when the beginners start banging balls around and then having the 9 ball fall into a pocket. Meanwhile, those same beginners think we're stupid for not going for the 9 at every possible chance. Either way, we took first place this term, so its not like the beginners were winning or anything. Its just that the second place team that we faced in the finals were push overs. It was really an easy game, but they still won 3 racks by luck. They also took out the second seed somehow, where we were all really surprised by.

Still, thats not to say that a lot of beginners dont play 8 ball by luck either.....
 
Im in New York. Id rather have a team, but no other school that i know of also has a billiards class. Dont get too excited though. The class really isnt that good, theres basically no real competition if yur a half way decent player. I just take the class to avoid taking regular gym and for table time. 95 dollars per term isnt that bad; it would kinda be like paying for table time for the time we're in the class.
 
Cameron Smith said:
I don't know if your the exception. Are you saying that after a year you average on a good day is a break and out, on a regular day you run out from the 3 ball consistently. If so thats some pretty fast learnin.

regards
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Yes, on a good day I break and run and most of the time if you miss on the three you've lost the game. Like I said my friend is better than me and has been playing for just as long.

P.S. I hope nobody takes this as tooting my own horn so to speak.
 
Mr.psychopath said:
Yes, on a good day I break and run and most of the time if you miss on the three you've lost the game. Like I said my friend is better than me and has been playing for just as long.

P.S. I hope nobody takes this as tooting my own horn so to speak.
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You have a right to toot your horn, as it sounds like you are probably an "A" player, a "B+" at least. I would have said I've never heard of a player getting that good in their first year of playing if you hadn't mentioned your friend.

I just hope you truly appreciate what you've accomplished, and wish you continued success.
 
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