Best Hitting Shaft is...

[Cuedog]

Ok,OK

I did answer on my very first post in this thread.



That is when you told me I was wrong, and started going off on how some shafts are better than others, etc. etc.

Yes some shafts have different pros and cons, but it depends on the style of the player that determines what is the best shaft for that player.

Now you're starting to misquote me. Calm down, you win.

There are times when two people don't see things the same. You made your point and I have made mine. Let's just agree to disagree, although I OD agree with some of what you say and have already stated so.

Gene

 

[Hal2]

Tascarella shafts are the BEST

I have played with many different shafts, made by some of the top cue maker's of yesterday and today (Balabushka, Szamboti's, Franklin, Shick and Tascarella). By far the BEST hitting and most consistant hitting shafts were made for me by Pete Tascarella.

So good are Pete Tascarella's shafts, I will tell you of my actual experience:

A while back when I was at the Glass City Open, I showed-off my Balabuska cue and two shafts made by Pete to a group of people. Included in this group were custom cue makers, cue collectors, and a few Pro-players, such as Larry Wiggins. I told them how Pete made the first shaft and it played even better than the orginial Balabushka. I told the group that six (6) months after Pete made my first shaft, I asked him to make me a second shaft of the exact same size.

A wise-guy asked to see both shafts. He commented how nice Pete's two shafts looked. I emphasized that both were made at least six months apart. The wise-guy picked up both shafts and placed them seperately on his scale. Both weighed exactly 4.3 ounces and both where the same the diameter.
Then the wise-guy then said loud enough for everyone to hear "Now I am going to show you the difference between those two shafts." He changed his scale to read grams. He placed the first shaft onto his scales and it weighed 509 grams. Then he placed the second shaft onto his scales and it weighed 510 grams.
I will never forget the look on everyone's faces and how big their eyes got with amazement. One guy said that was unbelievable. Then the wize-guy with his head bowed down said "Now that is "A-mazing!"
I smiled and said "Now that is a Tascarella."

I picked up my two shafts from the scales and proudly walked away.

Regards,
Hal

 

[Chris]

A wise-guy asked to see both shafts. He commented how nice Pete's two shafts looked. I emphasized that both were made at least six months apart. The wise-guy picked up both shafts and placed them seperately on his scale. Both weighed exactly 4.3 ounces and both where the same the diameter.
Then the wise-guy then said loud enough for everyone to hear "Now I am going to show you the difference between those two shafts." He changed his scale to read grams. He placed the first shaft onto his scales and it weighed 509 grams. Then he placed the second shaft onto his scales and it weighed 510 grams.
I will never forget the look on everyone's faces and how big their eyes got with amazement. One guy said that was unbelievable.

4.3 oz = ~120 gm

 

[Hal2]

Chris,
Thanks for the equation. What does 4.2 oz equal? Both were within 1 gram of each other (possible 109 vs 110).
Regards,
Hal

 

[FAST_N_LOOSE]

I have played with many different shafts, made by some of the top cue maker's of yesterday and today (Balabushka, Szamboti's, Franklin, Shick and Tascarella). By far the BEST hitting and most consistant hitting shafts were made for me by Pete Tascarella.

So good are Pete Tascarella's shafts, I will tell you of my actual experience:

A while back when I was at the Glass City Open, I showed-off my Balabuska cue and two shafts made by Pete to a group of people. Included in this group were custom cue makers, cue collectors, and a few Pro-players, such as Larry Wiggins. I told them how Pete made the first shaft and it played even better than the orginial Balabushka. I told the group that six (6) months after Pete made my first shaft, I asked him to make me a second shaft of the exact same size.

A wise-guy asked to see both shafts. He commented how nice Pete's two shafts looked. I emphasized that both were made at least six months apart. The wise-guy picked up both shafts and placed them seperately on his scale. Both weighed exactly 4.3 ounces and both where the same the diameter.
Then the wise-guy then said loud enough for everyone to hear "Now I am going to show you the difference between those two shafts." He changed his scale to read grams. He placed the first shaft onto his scales and it weighed 509 grams. Then he placed the second shaft onto his scales and it weighed 510 grams.
I will never forget the look on everyone's faces and how big their eyes got with amazement. One guy said that was unbelievable. Then the wize-guy with his head bowed down said "Now that is "A-mazing!"
I smiled and said "Now that is a Tascarella."

I picked up my two shafts from the scales and proudly walked away.

Regards,
Hal

AWESOME STORY HAL, THAT'S WHY PETE IS THE BEST OF THE BEST (IMO) I'VE HAD CUES FROM DOZENS OF MAKERS AND NO ONE IS AS CONSISTENT AS PETE WITH HIS CUES. HE TOOK A HORRIBLE TITLIST BLANK I HAD AND TURNED IT INTO ONE OF THE BEST PLAYING CUES I'VE EVER HAD.

 

[FAST_N_LOOSE]

Chris,
Thanks for the equation. What does 4.2 oz equal? Both were within 1 gram of each other (possible 109 vs 110).
Regards,
Hal

117.2 GOING BY MY CALCULATIONS. BUT I'M NOT SURE I DID IT RIGHT

 

[Koop]

I'll take a shaft built by Mike Webb all day and twice on Tuesday.
Scot Sherbine and Eric Crisp of Sugartree cues also produce very high quality shafts.

 

[Chris]

Chris,
Thanks for the equation. What does 4.2 oz equal? Both were within 1 gram of each other (possible 109 vs 110).
Regards,
Hal

119 grams = 4.20 oz

120. grams = 4.23 oz

Both these cases would read 4.2 oz on a scale as you described.


Also, 121 grams = 4.27

122 grams = 4.30 oz

123 grams = 4.34 oz

These three cases would read 4.3 oz on a scale as you described.

Having the measurement in grams is more meaningful than in tenths of ounces, since a gram is the smaller unit. Also, I used more significant figures on the conversions in this post than in the previous one, so these are more accurate.

BTW, having two shafts of the same size and weight within a gram of one another is pretty impressive. I know the two shafts for my playing cue are not that close.

 

[RBLilly]

Agree to Dissagree

I will always agree to dissagree, and I never meant to miss quote you. I was just simply stating that I did answer your original question.

This is the way I see it. As every sport in life the manufactures are going to try to sell you stuff you don't need. This happens in every sport.

So as consumers we have to know what is just being sold to us as a marketing tool, or what is actually going to help us. Now I won't go into what products I think are doing this.

What I will say is this. If you have watched cue makers make cues, you will see that sometimes the only difference between a $1000 and a $100 cue is the amount of inlays in the butt. So if anyone is going to tell me that a $1000 cue is better then I am going to argue everytime.

Mentally it may be better, because you think it shoots better. If that is the case then fine. So be it.

The thing I love about this sport is you have to know your own strengths and weaknesses. By knowing that, then you can build your cue to your style of play. If you use a lot of english, then get a shaft with less deflection. If you don't like the way a soft tip feels, or holds chaulk, then get a hard tip.

Predator had a great thing when they started out with their original shaft. Nobody else had done deflection testing and such. And yes it all started from the way people were making golf clubs. Predator decided to put a camera on the action and see what was going on.

So now everyone else is following suite and trying to compete with this product.

Do I like the shafts with less deflction? Yes. Do I feel you can put more spin on the cue ball? Yes.

Does it make me play any better? NO!

Now, someone in here wanted to know my preferance, what I shoot with. So here it goes. I know it isn't for everyone, but it suits my game perfectly.

I have a McDermott Mano, yep that's right it is a cue with pictures on it. No inlays! And yes it is one of the cheaper cues you can get from McDermott. However the shaft they put on it is the same shaft they put on some of their more expensive cues. The joint is the same as some of the more expensive cues. So it feels the same on the way it hits.

I love the wood to wood joint, and frankly I won't shoot with a cue that has a metal to metal joint. I don't like the way they hit. But that is my preferance.

About 6 months ago I slapped on each one of the I shafts from McDermott, and I liked the I-3 the best.

So now I have a cue with a shaft that is comparable to the Z from Predator. Now before anyone gets mad, I know the Z has less deflection than the I-3. I was just meaning that McDermott is comparing it to the Z cause that is the market they are after. And it is really close to the Z on the amount of deflection. LOL

Anyway, this combination works really well for me. However I have a buddy that doesn't like Predator shafts, and all the shafts with less deflection. He shoots with a cue that is about a $300 cue from a local cue maker here, and it is stiff as a steel rod. I hate the way that cue plays. However this guy is one of the top players in my city.

It all comes down to what works best for you, and because of that there is no best shaft. There is no best tip.

There is only what is best for you. The more people that figure that out, the better off they will be.

We have all seen people that rush out and always buy the marketing products. Oh dude I just got a predator shaft. Then a few weeks later oh dude I just got a predator 2 shaft. Then a few weeks later oh dude I just got an OB-1 shaft.

It is fine to try all of them out and see what suites you better. The people I am talking about are the people that go out and buy it just cause they say it is better. And we all know people like this.

They are the people that buy all the fancy crap yet their game still sucks.

So again I think it is important to know your own game, and get what works for your game. The more natural your game is, the more consistent you will be.

 

[Cornerman]

What the high performance shafts do for you is to allow you to hit the NATURAL contact point without having to make an adjustment for the deflection. .

I guess I don't see the automatic connection between low squirt and "high performance." Lower squirt is simply lower squirt, not higher performance.

Take a look at both Universal Shaft flavors. Both are highly engineered to reduce vibration, but one is low squirt, while the other is normal squirt. Neither is "higher performance" than the other.

If you have to make an adjustment to a low squirt shaft, then that makes it no different than any other shaft. Once you get adjusted, you should be good to go.

The problem I had with low squirt shafts (and I tried one for a year and a half, well documented on these forums) was that the overall cueball path was so different than what I've honed into my game that I had to adjust more due to english, not less. Low squirt is fine for shots that do not have enough time or distance to swerve significantly. But, that's only half of the english shots. The other half have enough swerve that people will still miss shots if they don't compensate. People confuse the result with "more spin" or "more throw." That's not what's happening.

What's happening is the ball sweves the same amount for either low or normal squirt, but since there's less squirt with a low squirt cue, the end point is determined more by swerve, whereas in a normal cue, the squirt and swerve act in opposite directions, allowing you to aim closer to the natural contact point (for those shots). So, by that logic, a normal shaft is "higher performance" for shots that both squirt and swerve influence the shot.

Fred

 

[Black Cat 5791]

This Post has taken so many twist's and turns since it started I'm not sure where it's headed now. But I play with Predator products, and I will continue to play with Predator products PERIOD.

Six years ago when I started playing pool seriously, I started out with a decent starter cue for $100.00 dollars. I played ok with it about as well as any other normal novice, I could make 1-2 ball runs consistantly straight in shots. No english, or draw just if I could see the shot straight in I could usually hit it. At the time I was also reading about english and cue ball conrol and things of the nature but not having alot of success at least not consistantly.

Then one day I heard about Predator, got on the Web did some research read all the claims and promises, so I said what the heck and I purchased the 314 which at the time cost more than my whole cue put together, well it was money well spent. I immediately started my making more shots consistantly, and a draw shot appeared out of nowhere and I'm talking half a table length's worth (9ft.), and I also started to notice more action on the cue ball coming off of rails, (I later learned this was the english I was reading about). 3 weeks later I went directly from an APA skill level 2 to a skill level 4 locked.

Two years ago give or take, I got my first Z shaft, scewed the thing on and just playing regular no adjustments or anything I started making shots from a distance that I would only make 1/2 the time with 314 consistantly.

Six weeks or so ago I got the Z2, and once again I've noticed an increase in accuracy and another improvement in my game.

I'm not doing anything different than what I normally do, I put my 314 on about 2 months ago because the tip came off at a tournament that was the only backup shaft I had at the time of course didn't have the Z2 yet and starting out I missed 3 or 4 easy shots that I'd normally make, untill I adjusted back to the 314. And, it took tought and concentration.

So I know first hand that they work, and I've seen the same type of results for people that I've gotten to try.

So to make a long story short, for me the shaft of choice is the Predator Z2

Black Cat

 

[RBLilly]

Black Cat

Hey buddy,

I am glad that you love predator, and it fits your style of play. I believe every instructor in here will tell you that the predator didn't help you develop your draw shot. On a normal draw shot it is all about your stroke. If you don't have a good stroke then you won't have a draw shot. Yes the tip plays a factor too, but a shaft that has less deflection will not help you have a better draw shot. A shaft with less deflection is for left and right english to help you from driving the ball off line. You can see that directly on Predator's website.

I think the reason your draw came from out of no where is because you got better as a player, and your stoke improved. You were just more consiously focused on it because you had a new shaft. That happens to all of us.

Maybe your site picture is better for predator than a normal shaft, this is because you don't have to make as much adjustment. Everyone sees differently, and lining up looks a little different to everyone. Maybe your eyes are more suited for the Predator, and the reason you like the Z is because it has even less deflection. Meaning you don't have to adjust as much.

You can believe what you want, and you can use what you want. I won't tell a man or woman not to use a product. The only thing a predator shaft will do is have less deflection. It doesn't make you a better player though.

 

[havoc]

Hey buddy,

I am glad that you love predator, and it fits your style of play. I believe every instructor in here will tell you that the predator didn't help you develop your draw shot. On a normal draw shot it is all about your stroke. If you don't have a good stroke then you won't have a draw shot. Yes the tip plays a factor too, but a shaft that has less deflection will not help you have a better draw shot. A shaft with less deflection is for left and right english to help you from driving the ball off line. You can see that directly on Predator's website.

I think the reason your draw came from out of no where is because you got better as a player, and your stoke improved. You were just more consiously focused on it because you had a new shaft. That happens to all of us.

Maybe your site picture is better for predator than a normal shaft, this is because you don't have to make as much adjustment. Everyone sees differently, and lining up looks a little different to everyone. Maybe your eyes are more suited for the Predator, and the reason you like the Z is because it has even less deflection. Meaning you don't have to adjust as much.

You can believe what you want, and you can use what you want. I won't tell a man or woman not to use a product. The only thing a predator shaft will do is have less deflection. It doesn't make you a better player though.

i'm not saying you're wrong about the draw shot because you obviously have more pool knowledge in your pinky than i do my whole body,but i experienced the exact opposite.
i loved the draw shot,and i got good at it.i used an old mali cue,and could draw like rembrandt.i buy a new lucasi with the laminated shaft,the same one gerry owns,and could only draw flies.
i talked to gerry about it and since then i'm having more success,but still nothing like i had with my mali.something is different because i can still draw with the mali.i figured maybe the tip,maybe the taper,but something's different.

 

[havoc]

I have no idea what is the "best hitting shaft", but I know what I like. First of all I don't particularly like the specialty shafts, Predator, OB-1, etc; though in fairness I of course haven't tried them all.
Among the custom shafts I like are Mike Webb's, Andy Gilbert's, Samsara's, Madison Bob's, and Scott Sherbine's. I'd be hard pressed to say which one I like the best just because I find a good hit is a good hit.
As soon as I win the lottery, I'll try all the others.

if you don't mind me asking,what is it you like about sherbines work?
scot is in my area,and is on my list of people i might buy a custom from.just trying to get some feedback.

 

[RBLilly]

Luccasi

What kinds of tips are on both cues? As far as draw shots the only real big factor with equipment that I know of would be the tip. Some grab better than others. So blackcat might have gotten better draw because of the tip, but it deffinately wasn't the shaft.

I guess the taper of the new cue could affect you some too, you are trying to get used to a new cue and such. I know that once I improved my stroke I started noticing that I could draw with just about any cue or tip. The stoke is one of the biggest factors in draw.

Thanks for the compliment on knowledge, but I really don't know all that much. There are guys on here that have been shooting since I was in diapers. These BCA instructors in here are the ones that know what they are talking about.

Have you ever taken any lessons? Maybe they could figure out why you could draw with one cue, but not the other. Just a thought.

 

[havoc]

What kinds of tips are on both cues? As far as draw shots the only real big factor with equipment that I know of would be the tip. Some grab better than others. So blackcat might have gotten better draw because of the tip, but it deffinately wasn't the shaft.

I guess the taper of the new cue could affect you some too, you are trying to get used to a new cue and such. I know that once I improved my stroke I started noticing that I could draw with just about any cue or tip. The stoke is one of the biggest factors in draw.

Thanks for the compliment on knowledge, but I really don't know all that much. There are guys on here that have been shooting since I was in diapers. These BCA instructors in here are the ones that know what they are talking about.

Have you ever taken any lessons? Maybe they could figure out why you could draw with one cue, but not the other. Just a thought.

maybe it is the tip.i don't know the brand or hardness of either.if you had to guess,what hardness tip level would grab best?

 

[RBLilly]

Mali

If you liked the one on your Mali find out what it was, and put one on your new cue just to test the theory. I mean, maybe the tip on your Mali is more suited to your style. It wouldn't hurt to try.

 

[RBLilly]

Le Pro

Looks like most Mali cues have a LePro tip, and most Luccasi's have a triangle tip. So why not try a LePro on your Luccasi and see what happens?

 

[havoc]

Looks like most Mali cues have a LePro tip, and most Luccasi's have a triangle tip. So why not try a LePro on your Luccasi and see what happens?

thanks shark.i was doing the same fact finding.i'm going to try a lepro med.

 

[Hal2]

Tascarella Shafts

I am glad to see that one of my posts invited a few debates and follow-up discussions. And I stand firmly behind Pete Tascarella's shafts as the best shafts made for me and I my actual experience.
By the way just as important to me is the same length, the same diameter, the same weight in grams (within 1 gram), the same feel, and they BOTH hit exactly the same. And they were made 6 months apart!
Best Regards,
Hal